Mojave MA200 Mic, What Preamp matches well?

[dhearn2@mchsi.com]

I just bought a Mojave MA200 tube condenser mic. When I put it through the preamp in my MOTU TravelerMKIII I'm getting a somewhat compressed sound when I record vocals, both male and female. The examples on Mojave's site make me wonder if I need a really good Preamp that would unlock the kind of sound I hear on the demos.

So, am I on the right track thinking this way? If not, what mic in the $1k price range should I try next? Or, what's a really good preamp that matches up well with the MA200?

I'm trying to decide what the best course of action is. Keep the mic for now and try preamp X, or send the mic back and try something different.

Thanks for any insight.

Dave Hearn

[mikehalloran]

My best guess: Not the Traveler.

Royer/Mojave is certainly going to have some suggestions to make in this regard.

[mhschmieder]

You're also going to want to decide whether you want a transparent mic pre or a coloured one. I seem to be in the extreme minority in wanting to hear my microphones and get to know them really well on their own. But with the Mojave mics, my recollection (I've only used them once or twice) is that they aren't very transparent to start with. So if there are some qualities you find bothersome, maybe use a pre-amp that negates them.

Here's a suggestion for your long-term studio setup though, regardless of whether you like "straight wire with gain" or like to shape the sound a bit going into the board: AEA's RPQ. It's a 1u two-channel pre-amp with more headroom than almost anything on the market, designed with ribbons in mind but also supplying phantom power on a separate pair of inputs. The EQ section is quite innovative and designed as a "problem-solver" to give you even MORE headroom primarily by notching out (or using low-pass/high-pass) unwanted frequencies at recording time. It can be used creatively as well, of course.

This pre-amp isn't cheap (they have a cheaper version without phantom power or EQ, at half-rack size and requiring a wall wart as I recall), but it really is a lifetime purchase and will be the only pre-amp you ever need for ribbon mics, weaker/older dynamics, and even more modern mics and condensers if you don't have an even higher-end mic pre (such as True Precision, DACS, Earthworks, etc.) allocated for those mics.

It would not surprise me at all if Royer recommends the AEA RPQ for the mics in question.

[Kubi]

Won't matter which mic you try until you have a good preamp. So keep the mic for now and get a better preamp. You'll need one anyway.

I don't much believe in mics matching preamps per se. A good preamp will bring its own mojo to the party, and make every mic sound better for what it is, within the confines of that mojo.

Totally agree re. making a general choice first between colored vs. clean preamp. If you track a lot of classical music or high-end bluegrass in great rooms, you may want a very clean pre. Most of us in the day-to-day of our real-world working scenarios are helped by a little extra magic, so I'm a big fan of preamps with a little color to them.

What's your budget for a pre? Here's a good little article on the topic by Ronan Chris Murphy, whom I often turn to for gear advice - and he and his pal John Rodd have steered me well every time!

http://recordingbootcamp.com/2013/05/wh ... -mic-pres/

[mhschmieder]

BTW there's an excellent budget mic pre-amp with input sensitivity matching (not many have this feature; I think Avalon was the first to offer it). It has many different versions but its basic model name is the MPA (for Mic Pre-Amp) by A.R.T. It's a tube design, two channels, and some versions have digital outputs such as S/PDIF. I used one for many years before upgrading to my eight-channel Tube Precision 8. I find the recordings done with the A.R.T. to be of pro quality and not at all an embarrassment after all these years.

[jlaudon]

I have a MA200, and have used an SSL alpha channel, LA610mkII, Avalon 737, as well as the onboard preamps of the Apogee Ensemble, and a UA Apollo. I have to say, no kidding, they all sounded great with this mic. It's my go to mic, and often for thinner voices I will use it with the LA610mkII (also tube). There is a school of thought that you shouldn't use a tube mic with a tube pre, but I'm pretty sure in the classic days of the 60s and 70s, most recordings were with a tube mic thru a tube console .

Of course, all of these preamps are higher end quality - I was really impressed with the Apollo preamps especially - if you had one of these interfaces (along with the onboard UAD plugins, incredible), you wouldn't need to buy an outboard preamp.

[mhschmieder]

I hope this isn't O.T., but when paired with a good mic pre-amp, is the Mojave MA200 good for dealing with someone whose voice is both thin and nasally?

I am now using the venerable E/V RE-20 on said person, and it helps a lot (the ribbon mics I tried didn't work as well, surprisingly). I can't even touch a condenser on this person, but hadn't thought about a tube mic for such situations.

Hopefully this is relevant to the topic. Zen Pro Audio's Clip-a-lator has Royer mics to compare but not Mojave, surprisingly.

[mikehalloran]

MPA (for Mic Pre-Amp) by A.R.T.

Yes, I still have one kicking around on loan to a friend. It is much better than the low price would indicate.

[Phil O]

I'm in the wire-with-gain school of thought. Let the mic do the mojo. I love my Grace Design preamp. It's my first choice for just about everything. It's one of the original 2 channel units, but grace has several 1 channel units now for under a grand. Worth checking out.

Phil

[Tobor]

I agree with Phil. When I was obsessing over preamps, I took note of the fact that you can always add attitude later with any number of plugins, but you can never get a pristine clean signal if it's not there to begin with.

Also, you may record something with vibey schmutz that sounds great going in, but may not interact well with other vibey processing slapped on down the line.

Get a clean pre and experiment with different mics first, maybe add a tube mic, etc. Get the vibey pres later. I've got an original Great River MP-2 (clean and crisp) and Buzz Audio MA2.2 (clean with sheen) and find they can handle everything well. I also have a Peavey VMP2 tube pre which is highly regarded and enjoy plugging guitars and bass direct into that.

It's fun to experiment with different combinations, but at the end of the day a quality clean pre will get you a long way down the line and is all you really need.

[dhearn2@mchsi.com]

Well, there is lots of great advice here. Thanks to everyone for your thoughts. I have decided to keep the MA200 mic. I had a chance yesterday to take the mic to a studio with a vintage U-47 Neumann, which is what reviews consistently compare the MA200 to, and we did a comparison through the stock MCI preamps in the console using a female singer. She is an alto who sings in the same exact range as my voice (I came down with a cold, so I can't sing right now). The MA200 held up VERY well to the U-47. I've recorded my voice through that U-47 for a couple of major label releases in the past, and I always loved that mic, so, since they sound so similar, I will be happy to have the MA200 in my studio.

I think a "straight wire" preamp makes the most sense in retrospect, but I will have the chance to run the MA2300 through an Avalon 737sp this week, and that may affect my thinking if it sounds great to me. Otherwise, the Great River 1NV that was mentioned looks very attractive to me, as it is in an affordable price range.

Thanks again to all of you for your advice!

Dave

[Kubi]

The Great River ME1NV is killer. In the general "Neve" neighborhood, it's a solid state pre that gets a lot of it's sound from the transformer. There are other great Neve-type pres (I love my Aurora Audio) but I don't know of any others that come in a single-channel version, which keeps the cash outlay down. Its sound is quite strong, muscular, with a real body to it.

The Avalon 737 SP has a lot of haters, but the couple of times I used it I really liked the pre. I used it on trumpet, sax, cello and male voice at the time, with a few different mics. The pre is a tube amp. It's not as muscular as Neve-type pres like the Great River ME1NV, more open and silky. Very very nice. Also really liked the EQ on that unit, but did not like the compressor much at all. YMMV.

Now if you have the bread, you should definitely at least try out this one: http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul11/a ... ropa-1.htm

Got a demo from the man himself a year and a half or so ago and LOVED this pre. It's incredibly versatile, because unlike other pres, you can really finetune its very characteristics, including the speed with which it reacts. Incredibly useful. This will no doubt be my next mic pre... although nothing will *replace* the Aurora, just supplement.

[dhearn2@mchsi.com]

THanks, Kubi. The Dave Hill preamp does look like a great one. It's just a little out of my wife's price range....

[kgdrum]

The Great River ME1NV is killer. In the general "Neve" neighborhood, it's a solid state pre that gets a lot of it's sound from the transformer. There are other great Neve-type pres (I love my Aurora Audio) but I don't know of any others that come in a single-channel version, which keeps the cash outlay down. Its sound is quite strong, muscular, with a real body to it.

The Avalon 737 SP has a lot of haters, but the couple of times I used it I really liked the pre. I used it on trumpet, sax, cello and male voice at the time, with a few different mics. The pre is a tube amp. It's not as muscular as Neve-type pres like the Great River ME1NV, more open and silky. Very very nice. Also really liked the EQ on that unit, but did not like the compressor much at all. YMMV.

Now if you have the bread, you should definitely at least try out this one: http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul11/a ... ropa-1.htm

Got a demo from the man himself a year and a half or so ago and LOVED this pre. It's incredibly versatile, because unlike other pres, you can really finetune its very characteristics, including the speed with which it reacts. Incredibly useful. This will no doubt be my next mic pre... although nothing will *replace* the Aurora, just supplement.

+1 I love my Great River ME1NV, my only regret is that I didn't get the 2 channel version, great pre, 1 of my favorite purchases of the last couple of years.

[SixStringGeek]

I have an Avalon 737sp and a UA Solo 610 and have tried the MA-200 with both. The Avalon is kind of a new acquisition and I'm still figuring it out, but I have to say I like it a lot - bit more options to tailor the sound vs the UA.

I will say that since I started collecting preamps, I'm getting much better sounding stuff than I did from the pres in my MOTU 828 MKII. They're just OK, but I often found them short on gain and thus always ended up with the input trim nearly maxed and that made things noisy.