UAD Lexicon 224 alternatives

[David Polich]

I launched the demo of UAD's Lexicon 224. Tested it with some vocal
tracks, synth pads, strings, and drums and percussion. There's no question
that the 224 sounds great, and from my memory of the actual unit (which
I first encountered at a Los Angeles session way back in the early 80's),
it brought a smile to my face.

But like a lot of people, I just can't find the funds to purchase the
224, so I went back through all my current reverbs again, including
some I hadn't visited in a long time. iK Multimedia's CSR, Waves TrueVerb
and Renaissance Reverb, Nomad Factory's BlueVerb, UAD's RealVerb. Also reviewed the Lexicon 224 and 480 presets in Altiverb, and some Bricasti
Impulses I downloaded and installed in MOTU's ProVerb. I then selected
the Large hall preset on the UAD 224, and set up several additional auxes,
each with a different verb, so I could A/B between them on the same source
track.

Surprisingly, for algorithmic reverbs, Waves TrueVerb sounded excellent
to me again - I don't know why I stopped using it awhile back. It's actually
better than Renaissance Reverb, IMO. If you own TrueVerb I honestly think
you can build a very reasonable "Lexicon" of your own.

The Altiverb Lexicon 224 (and 480) impulses are ones I use a lot, and
I still found them satisfactory when compared to the UAD 224, although
the UAD has the edge - it's more transparent and enveloping. The Bricasti
M7 impulses in Proverb were also perfectly satisfactory, again with the
UAD holding the edge, although in all fairness the Bricasti is a completely
different animal compared to the Lexicon, even the modern Lexicon units.

UAD's RealVerb is still a darn good one, quite smooth, and I've always
loved the "surfaces" options in designing a space in RealVerb. My only complaint about RealVerb is that it is a resource hog, even on my UAD-2
system which is a UAD-2 Solo and a UAD-2 Duo.

Disappointing (again) - iK Multimedia's CSR ( a little too "blanket-like"
and a bit murky), and Nomad Factory's BlueVerb. Not to say I wouldn't
use these again, but I think I still have to find tracks that "like" them.
BlueVerb sounds the most metallic of any of my reverbs - now, if I were going for the old Alesis Quadraverb sound then BlueVerb would be my choice.

Just wanted to post this for those who wonder if they absolutely must have
the UAD 224. In my opinion, it's a great product. Do I think it will
change all your mixes to the degree that it is a must-have? No. In fact
for game-changing plug-ins my vote is for UAD's Studer. Nothing else
really does "tape" like it does, and it adds a character to a track that
I haven't found anywhere else.

[Killahurts]

Dave, I can tell you this:

I havent tried the UAD 224 yet, but what I can say is that it is $350 solution, and that opens the doors to a whole plethora of plugin reverbs that must be investigated first. I remind myself that this is a replica of a 30+ year old instrument. Do I want that sound, or do I really want the bee's knees of reverb that I can get for the same money today? It really depends on what you're after. Vangelis used the 224 for the Bladerunner soundtrack back in the day..
Would he use that now, with all that is available? I dont know.

I would never use a reverb plugin without trying it first, bottom line. I have been digging the SSL Duende native reverb, but I may try the UAD 224 and be surprised, who knows?

Guys, we're living in a time where we have to let our ears judge whether or not the value is there. It's tough, I know. We have to know what we're after to make value decisions.

And since this iPad is hard to get used to and I have wasted soooo much time posting this, I must make a value decision to quit. Good luck Dave!

[kassonica]

There are some excellent 224 IR's on the net.

Don't have time to find the link now, but they should still be out there if not PM and I will email them to you.

[David Polich]

One addendum I thought of - if you consider a plug-in a "piece of gear"
(and I do, it helps me vibe with the product, especially if I have had
experience with the hardware equivalent), then buying the UAD Lexicon
224 might actually be your last chance to experience the closest thing
to the actual gear. Reading through a lot of 224 links on the
internet, I ran across story after story of how the original units have
failed or are in the process of failing, and it is getting increasingly
difficult to get them repaired or get the parts.

The 224 was based on technology which is now over 30 years old. It is
easy to forget that, as it is with old vintage synthesizers, the
originals had their own great sound but their life expectancy has
actually passed. The power supplies for the old 224's and 480's
are notorious for overheating and once they start doing that, the units
are pretty much history. Which makes the UAD 224 a more practical Lexicon.
No big power supply to overheat, no error codes or failure to advance
beyond program 1.

[HCMarkus]

I kinda' like the fact you can disable the 12 bit conversion emulation and noise in the UA version. I just blows my mind when I see the number of instantiations possible on one UAD2 card and think about the economics of it all.

[new-knee]

A while back I was looking at the new Lexicon plug from UAD with gear-lust until I saw the price and found the "Bricasti" IR's for Altiverb. There are a couple of very good 224 IR's in Altiverb as well. I'm sure the Lex plug would be nice but with my finances being what they are and these sweet IR's I can't justify the cost right now. I haven't demo'd the lex yet and I'll probably wait until I'm ready to do some serious mixing before trying it out. I have 2 solo cards so I wouldn't be able to get many instances anyway. For those who have already purchased this plug I'm sure it is worth every penny. Just my 2cents worth.

n-k

[thethethediamondz]

Guys, we're living in a time where we have to let our ears judge whether or not the value is there. It's tough, I know. We have to know what we're after to make value decisions.

yes, that is true. but i don't think the original poster was asking for anyone to tell them what to do. it would actually be strange to imagine a person basing their decisions on what a group of people that they've never met say in passing on the internet.

i would kinda be insulted if someone presumed this about me. it insinuates a lack of authority in knowing what u like or dislike, what is good or bad. and that's not the tone of their post at all, i think.

especially seeing how they go into detail on their own assessment so far of the plug-in. they might just be wondering if there is something they dont understand in it's usage. someone else with more experience might be able to point that out.

of course, in the end, you always have to let your ears judge whether the value is there or not, but u gotta consider that u don't know everything yet and that u might be overlooking a lot of stuff. at least i do. i've never used a hardware 224, i don't know what they excel at and don't except for abstractions about vangelis and other stuff that i've never even heard.

personally, i've demoed it, and found that it doesn't sound like any of the plug in reverbs i've heard yet. but that i don't think it's worth the cost for me cuz i tend to favor the things that my UAD 250 are best at. (i do think, overall, it's better than the 250 emulation, tho. it adheres better and has more of a possible range in it's application. it really sounds better to me and i love the option of messing around with input/output gain. it definitely has an effect on the sound.) so once it falls into promotion, i'm almost for sure gonna buy it when i see a 3 for %30 discount. it's really great but it's not adding anything that i can't live without right now.

[Killahurts]

yes, that is true. but i don't think the original poster was asking for anyone to tell them what to do. it would actually be strange to imagine a person basing their decisions on what a group of people that they've never met say in passing on the internet.

i would kinda be insulted if someone presumed this about me. it insinuates a lack of authority in knowing what u like or dislike, what is good or bad. and that's not the tone of their post at all, i think.

especially seeing how they go into detail on their own assessment so far of the plug-in. they might just be wondering if there is something they dont understand in it's usage. someone else with more experience might be able to point that out.

Nah, you've misunderstood me, I didn't mean it that way at all. I was actually marveling about the fact that we have so many choices out there now, that we can assess the value of something based on what we hear, not just on what we can afford. When I used a 224 for the first time 30 years ago, it was only within reach of the larger studios. I would have loved to have one back then, and if it had cost $350, I would've!

I've purchased several software reverbs this year, they're all great in their own way, and all (relatively) affordable. I have also purchased several hardware reverbs over the past 25 years. The software has just recently gotten to the point, IMO, that I can replace hardware with them..

OK, guess I have to go demo the 224 now, you guys have my curiosity piqued!

[jlaudon]

SOme other reverbs that are close IMO - the 2C Audio Aether Reverb (even Breeze), and one I just got for 50 bucks - ValhallaDSP Room (amazing for the price, IMO).

[David Polich]

I posted this thread originally with the desire to help my fellow Motunationers. Whenever a new plug-in from UAD comes out, I know
I find myself thinking, "oh man, is this one of those plugs I'll
try for 10 seconds and know I absolutely have to have it?" We all
have reverb options available, including MOTU's own ProVerb and
the existing reverbs I mentioned. I'm sure most users here own at
least one of those reverbs.

It's easy to think that when a new plug-in comes out, it negates
the value of your "old" plug-ins. In the case of the UAD 224, I
don't believe that to be the case. That's why I started the thread.

[towerproductions]

Some of the other UA reverbs are very nice as well and cheaper. I have their EMT140 plate, EMT 250 and Dreamverb. The EMTs are quite nice. The EMT140 probably gets the most use when not using Convolution reverbs. I remember having to go in a storage room at a studio I used to work at to make adjustments. It was huge. Haven't used the Dreamverb for a long time but I should probably pull it out sometime and check it out again.

[Killahurts]

I posted this thread originally with the desire to help my fellow Motunationers. Whenever a new plug-in from UAD comes out, I know
I find myself thinking, "oh man, is this one of those plugs I'll
try for 10 seconds and know I absolutely have to have it?" We all
have reverb options available, including MOTU's own ProVerb and
the existing reverbs I mentioned. I'm sure most users here own at
least one of those reverbs.

It's easy to think that when a new plug-in comes out, it negates
the value of your "old" plug-ins. In the case of the UAD 224, I
don't believe that to be the case. That's why I started the thread.

Very cool David, thanks!!

[thethethediamondz]

yes, that is true. but i don't think the original poster was asking for anyone to tell them what to do. it would actually be strange to imagine a person basing their decisions on what a group of people that they've never met say in passing on the internet.

i would kinda be insulted if someone presumed this about me. it insinuates a lack of authority in knowing what u like or dislike, what is good or bad. and that's not the tone of their post at all, i think.

especially seeing how they go into detail on their own assessment so far of the plug-in. they might just be wondering if there is something they dont understand in it's usage. someone else with more experience might be able to point that out.

Nah, you've misunderstood me, I didn't mean it that way at all. I was actually marveling about the fact that we have so many choices out there now, that we can assess the value of something based on what we hear, not just on what we can afford. When I used a 224 for the first time 30 years ago, it was only within reach of the larger studios. I would have loved to have one back then, and if it had cost $350, I would've!

I've purchased several software reverbs this year, they're all great in their own way, and all (relatively) affordable. I have also purchased several hardware reverbs over the past 25 years. The software has just recently gotten to the point, IMO, that I can replace hardware with them..

OK, guess I have to go demo the 224 now, you guys have my curiosity piqued!

haha. i'm sorry, i apologize. i kinda jumped all over u on that one. probably i am guilty of too much time looking at gearsl*&z and forgetting that people aren't all trying to crucify each other.

i do agree with what the original poster said above tho, i also thought this plug-in would blow my mind and i'm demoing it and thinking...
first, that it's really great and sounds amazing
but second, that i'm not feeling like i need it.
&it's not entirely the price either. maybe it's just that i'm really happy with the uad EMT250. i use the 140 too, but not nearly as much.. besides that i'm sometimes using ValhallaRoom, which i really love, but i think the UAD Lexicon kills that. especially the thing is how the UAD Lexicon sinks into the source material a little better. i'm just confused a little why i don't like it more.

[dweiss]

I've been demo'ing the UAD Lexi for the past week and it's a must have for me. I find it has pretty remarkable depth, far and away better than any other UAD verb for sure. It's expensive, but not when compared to a real Lexicon, which in my opinion it sounds like for sure.

[waterstrum]

Just read the end of this thread.
If you're looking for Lexicon plugs, the PCM bundle is very good.
The Relab 480 is a nice complement to give another flavor.
They all run native with no need for hardware cards.