embarrasing editing 101 questions

[Noam]

I am embarassed to say I haven't figured these things out yet, despite referring to the manual and the help program.

1) how do you get automation to "stick with" their assosiated soundbites? I have played with the automation set up and view filter windows but still can't get this to happen. I move a soundbite, - the automation envlopes stay put.

2) Is there some type of 'remove' edit, or 'close gap' command? The Idea being that if you remove a section of soundbites in the timeline, the sounbites to the right of them automatically shift left and close the gap. Also some type of 'select all to the right of the cursor' comand would be usefull. These are common in video editing programs (FCP etc.) and I would think they should be basic to all timeline based editing programs but can't find them in DP.

Wish I could say I was a newbie but allas,- I should know this stuff by now -
thanks, - noam

[musicarteca]

I assume that you are using DP5
1) In the sequence editor select bite volume to edit a volume that will stick to the soundbite when it moves.
2) The snip function will cut a region selected in the timeline and move everything to the left closing the gap.
There are plenty of selection commands in the commands window, take a look.

[martian]

you don't have to use just the bites volume - this wouldn't work for pan's eq's etc any way.

you need to use the cross hairs and drag ove the range. You can then cut and past it into position - actually I think you might be able to drag too. not in front of DP now

After dragging the cross hairs to sekect your range - flip between edit bits layer and say volume layer - you should see that the breakpoints are highlighted.. flip back to editing soundites - and cut and paste

[Noam]

I am still in 4.6 but the crosshair and snip are working! I figured this was right under my nose. Thank you. Now I just have to remember that selecting a soundbite by clicking on it, and selecting it with the crosshair are different when it comes to the underlying automation. The snip edit is grayed out when just clicking on a soundbite to select as well. You have to crosshair select it or drag above the timeline to select all the area beneath it.

I'm still wondering if there is a preference I can choose that will keep automation with soundbite edits universally.

[martian]

you don't even have to be accurate.

I drag cross hairs just a little bit and use the move selection start to prev/ selection end to next event..... this will enable very accurate and quick selections....

I then use the key for move insertion to counter......... this may or may not involve the snap for insertion point...

[Noam]

you don't even have to be accurate.

I drag cross hairs just a little bit and use the move selection start to prev/ selection end to next event..... this will enable very accurate and quick selections....

I then use the key for move insertion to counter......... this may or may not involve the snap for insertion point...

These are great tips. I've dug back in to the manual (chpt 37) and the commands window to explore these options. Thanks again martian.

[martian]

glad to be of help-

notice you have the project mix...

how are the drivers on that? I'm curious! I Have FW1884 which is OK but maybe the native drivers could be better.

That has LCD scribble strips? do they work?

How about the EQ section?

[Shooshie]

I am embarassed to say I haven't figured these things out yet, despite referring to the manual and the help program.

1) how do you get automation to "stick with" their assosiated soundbites? I have played with the automation set up and view filter windows but still can't get this to happen. I move a soundbite, - the automation envlopes stay put.

2) Is there some type of 'remove' edit, or 'close gap' command? The Idea being that if you remove a section of soundbites in the timeline, the sounbites to the right of them automatically shift left and close the gap. Also some type of 'select all to the right of the cursor' comand would be usefull. These are common in video editing programs (FCP etc.) and I would think they should be basic to all timeline based editing programs but can't find them in DP.

Wish I could say I was a newbie but allas,- I should know this stuff by now -
thanks, - noam

Noam,

If you will go to the DP Tips Sheet -- one of the "sticky threads" (they don't roll off over time) at the top of the forum -- you will find on the 2nd page a post about selecting continuous controllers, with many screenshots and examples. It contains many tricks that will help you with what you're asking about, including the COMMANDS window for customizing your work environment, plus some advice on how to use it.

Now, to get to the bottom of this, conceptually, let's skip over the actual tricks; they're well represented in the above posts, and in the reference I just gave you. Let's just look at the concept of Digital Performer's layout and operation:

In any DAW, you have multiple events happening simultaneously. Some of those events are simultaneous music or audio, thus we stack them vertically in tracks. The Sequence Editor and the Tracks Overview Window are such vertical arrangements. Peruse the tracks up and down over the range of a given moment in time, and you can see all the things that happen at that moment.

But now, there's a deeper level of events that affect each other and must be simultaneous by definition, but it doesn't make sense to place them in separate tracks. So, we place them in layers. When you switch from notes or soundbites to automation, you've moved in the 3rd-dimension to another layer. Ok, that's all pretty straightforward, I think. There's a new twist in the most recent release of DP, and that's soundbite automation, that stays with the soundbite wherever it goes, but let's not complicate this. The next question is basically what you're asking: how do I tell when I've selected a single event, or all the vertical and/or layered events, at a given time point? The answer is in the selection of events or selection of time ranges. The selection of events highlights only the objects in the current layer. The selection of time ranges highlights all objects at the intersection of time range and selected track--in other words, it selects tracks over a time range, and all the layers beneath them.

So, as you study this stuff, be aware of which moves operate on events, and which operate on time ranges. Most especially, it's important to know of commands which convert one selection into the other. Thus, if you have a note, a range of notes, or a soundbite selected, how do you convert that event selection into a range selection? The answer is in the post to which I directed you in the Tips Sheet (page two) on the selection of controllers.

Once you get adept at judging what you need to select: an event, a layer, a type of controller, a range, a track, a group of tracks, etc., then you will become more skilled at making those selections. If you keep in mind a 3-D diagram, where the X axis is time, the Y axis is tracks, and the Z axis is layers, then you'll find it pretty easy to keep track of where you are, what you need, and how to get there. Plus, there are COMMAND Keys for all this stuff. Customize it for your own best workflow. (I recommend printing out your COMMANDS window and marking your changes by hand on your printout, lest you ever lose your prefs and have to reconfigure those from scratch. The printout is also a good way to study and learn the commands available.)

I know this is pretty abstract, but I thought you might benefit from the conceptual point of view, in addition to the good help you've already received.

Shooshie

[Shooshie]

I'm still wondering if there is a preference I can choose that will keep automation with soundbite edits universally.

No. I would LOVE to have such a feature, and would love for it to apply to all continuous data. There is a feature that helps in some cases, called "Smart Selection," but it's not the same. It helps make sure that when you cut out sections of continuous data, that you don't screw up the data that gets left behind. I'm not sure it always works, but apparently it's intended to make sure that a note that is supposed to have a sustain pedal cut-off will still have its cut-off, even if you happen to delete that cut-off when editing the notes around it, and that sort of thing. But it would be very beneficial to have continuous data and automation stay with the objects with which they are associated, by selection of a preference or check-box in the track. (like the quick-filter checkbox)

I think that the advent of VIs with all their complex continuous data will necessitate that feature in the near future.

Shooshie

[Noam]

Shooshie , Thanks so much for taking the time to write your post. It does give me a beter conceptual understanding of the event vs. time range selection. I will read the tips sticky and print out the comands.

My original DAW was Deck, the precursor interface to PT. Not nearly as deep as DP. You could not automate anything but volume and pan, but locking automation to soundbites was a simple preference check.

There is still a lot to discover about DP.
-noam

[martian]

Noam

I still have a lot to discover about the project mix.......

[Noam]

Noam

I still have a lot to discover about the project mix.......

I'm with you on that too - and there is no fat manual to dig through. I'm still using the basic controls and bringing up pan and meter on the display.
Haven't even tried to control effects.

Shoosie - The scribble strips do work and they are capable of more than I have figured out how to use them for. Its nice just having them show the name of the tracks plus as I mentioned , the pan and rough meter read out. The basic mac driver seems to be good. The software mixer - control for the unit is really nice and gives you a lot of routing options. There is a reported issue with assigning outputs to connected spdif units that hasen't affected me yet. I use the ada800 with it and it has worked seemlessly on the recording side of things. I haven't tried outputting through the 8000 yet.

There is no EQ however. It is not a mixer in the traditional sense. It's a control surface with 8 pre amps and ad/da. The only input control you get are the mic pre trims. You can monitor the inputs directly and/or mix them with your software outputs, but this is controlled with the above mentioned virtual mixer. If you want hardware eq you will have to feed the inputs from a mixer or channel strip. You can contrlol software EQ with it, though as I mentioned - I haven't gotten there yet.

On the DP control side of things (for 4.6 anyway) it has been good but not perfect. Scrub wheel and locate to marker functions have not been super reliable for instance. Motorized touch sensitive -flying faders are great however . That alone, plus very usable project sutdio quality input - and the fact that it will work with a lot of other software - including PT, make it very worthwhile. If you are using higher end front end gear and just want to add a controll surface, you might want to look at alternatives.

[martian]

Maybe they have a PDF somewhere?

To use the EQ controls I presume u might pull MOTU's para EQ 4 into an insert

select that channel on the project mix...

does it not have an EQ control section?

Well that's how it's done on the FW1884 I have - only it don't work as advertised... the gain goesn't control th gain of the EQ on some bands of EQ etc etc...

So the scribble strips work? - That sounds very cool!!! I have to be disciplined and work in banks.... Not great but can be do-able..

Will it work as a control surface with reason? That would be great!!!

The project mix came out after my purchase of a FW1884 - which is great in some ways - like 4 banks of MIDI assignable faders... but I'm interested in the LCD strip thing

I'm not sure for your proj mix

BUt on mine - it's easy to control the auxilary sends... I can either assign the rotary encoder to it - or I can "flip" the fader bank to control them...