Mac/Mac/PC Network Solution?

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 1:38 am

Has anyone heard of or used Plogue?

http://www.plogue.com/index.php?option= ... &Itemid=35

http://www.macmusic.org/software/view.p ... en/id/693/

I'm just discovering this-- just read about someone who's got 3 G5's networked with "virtual zero" latency using Plogue on the two slave computers to run tons of VI's one each.

The app is cross platform Mac/PC, and early reports for VI use are strongly positive from users. VST, Rewire, AU-- man, this looks promising.

Thoughts?

(Plogue is French for thingamajig.. btw)

boonier · Post by **boonier** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 2:09 am

Right (cracking my knuckles now)

Yes i use it extensively and i have to say its brilliant. Its like having a toolbox full of useful bits that you can connect in any manner whatsoever. Its like being a kid again.

The good about it is that you can go in from all levels. If you want to make your own customized FFT effects, you can. If you want a special setup for live performance - piece of piss. It can be an educational tool or you can create music entirely without having to look at a timeline, if thats what you want.

Ive recently created a live tool thats a bit like an MPC box. Its based on 8 loopers and ive got a pool of all mny audio. Ive then connected up MIDI controllers, such as the BCR 2000 and a drum machine to use its pads to trigger muting of parts...then the whole lot goes through a bank of my own effects or AU or VST plugins which i individually tweak using the BCR

its like having MAx/MSP or PD but you dont have to be a dsp wizz just to build something quickly...in that sense its like a musical instrument. Thats not to say that there isn't some learning to do, but it makes sense really quickly

so have I gushed about it enough for you? I can only say download it and see what it does (for you)

Aramis · Post by **Aramis** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 7:26 am

I knew about Bidule and I went to the site today and apparently there is no more demo version .....-(

Aramis

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 11:07 am

boonier wrote:Right (cracking my knuckles now)

Yes i use it extensively and i have to say its brilliant. Its like having a toolbox full of useful bits that you can connect in any manner whatsoever. Its like being a kid again.

The good about it is that you can go in from all levels. If you want to make your own customized FFT effects, you can. If you want a special setup for live performance - piece of piss. It can be an educational tool or you can create music entirely without having to look at a timeline, if thats what you want.

Ive recently created a live tool thats a bit like an MPC box. Its based on 8 loopers and ive got a pool of all mny audio. Ive then connected up MIDI controllers, such as the BCR 2000 and a drum machine to use its pads to trigger muting of parts...then the whole lot goes through a bank of my own effects or AU or VST plugins which i individually tweak using the BCR

its like having MAx/MSP or PD but you dont have to be a dsp wizz just to build something quickly...in that sense its like a musical instrument. Thats not to say that there isn't some learning to do, but it makes sense really quickly

so have I gushed about it enough for you? I can only say download it and see what it does (for you)

Brilliant!!

Aramis wrote: I knew about Bidule and I went to the site today and apparently there is no more demo version .....-(

Aramis

Not so brilliant. Hmm.

Well, it's only $79, which is not bad by today's standards.

quadrupolesmurf · Post by **quadrupolesmurf** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 4:12 pm

For basic AU hosting just use AU Lab?

(It's in /Developer/Applications/Audio/)

and It's free!

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 6:31 pm

quadrupolesmurf wrote:For basic AU hosting just use AU Lab?

(It's in /Developer/Applications/Audio/)

and It's free!

I suppose what I didn't get into is what inspired this thread. It would be accurate to say that the purposes for which such a host would be used can be described as anything but basic. In fact, it's very complex, and the person who succeeded with Plogue, tried AU Lab and wasn't happy with it. But he swears by Plogue. Nothing in particular against AUL, of course.

I'd never heard of Plogue before this week, and was just curious if anyone else was using it. Quietly, I've been wondering why I hadn't heard of it before.

blue · Post by **blue** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 6:51 pm

Plogue is great in a multi-computer scenario. I've put it through a few films and it's behaved quite nicely. It was buggy at first but it's pretty solid nowadays.

Jaysplace101 · Post by **Jaysplace101** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 11:50 pm

I tried to revive this old thread on Plogue bidule...

http://www.motunation.com/forum/viewtop ... ght=bidule

which I'm sure you already searched for and saw. I'm very curious about this after trying the muse receptor, and other solutions to get more power. I would LOVE to hear about any other users.

Blue, could you be more specific with your setup? Were you running 2 macs? What were your buffer settings?

I tried the demo a while back, but was in the middle of deadlines and couldn't really get it running. I was just trying to run it as an AU host separate from DP, and what I remember was being able to set Plogue to a very low latency, even though DP had a high buffer setting that would normally yeild high latency if the same VI's were running within DP. Am I right about this?

j

Aramis · Post by **Aramis** » Sat Jun 17, 2006 3:29 am

Well ,
I have tried tree times to buy bidule and the Share it system was rejecting my orders .....Too bad ...... I wanted to see it since it seems to be more powerfull and probably more stable compare to when I tried it ....

I am still wondering how I will solve my problem to use my MiniMac and my G5 ......

Aramis

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Sat Jun 17, 2006 4:01 am

Jaysplace101 wrote: I would LOVE to hear about any other users...

j

I'm gathering up info from different forums in hopes that I can find enough of an explanation that makes sense. Some guys can be pretty cryptic...

By the way, even though the DAW being used is Logic, the claim is that other DAWs, including DP, will work as well.

============
POST 1----
I run 3 G5's
and have found that if you go beyond 1.9 gig of RAM used for VIs per G5 things get dicey....

At 1.9 gig things are fine in Logic for me (+ another 1.5 gig of EXS24 vienna on same computer)

I'm running 16 instances of VI per G5 (never exceeding 1.9 gig of RAM per computer for VSL-server)

1st G5 is hosting Logic
2nd G5 is hosting Plogue
3d G5 is hosting Plogue

So recap...my main G5 is running 1.9 Gig of Vienna Instrruments AND circa 1.5 Gig of EXS24 Vienna....(the machine has 7 Gig of RAM)

my buffer on main G5 is set to 512

the Plogue G5s are set to buffer 256.

...my sytem is finally running clean with the above settings / restrictions...
======
POST 2---
I will outline how to use a 2nd G5 for more memory, and pipe it into the main G5 without the need for a MIDI-inteface, or audio interface.

1) You will need: 1 ethernet cross-over cable ( or an ethernet hub and 2 cables)

2)You will need: 2 fiber-optic cables (out to in / in to out between the G5s.

3) Open Audio MIDI Setup on the Main G5 and create an "aggregate device". In it the first device is your main Audio i/o....the 2nd device select "Built-In"

4) Open Audio MIDI-Setup and under "MIDI", select "Network".....establish an ethernet MidiConnection between the 2 G5's

5) On the 2nd G5 open "System Preferences"...Click on "Sound" ....set both in and out to "Digital"

6) On the Main G5 open "Logic Audio" or your DAW of choice......In the Audio Driver's Page set the driver to "Aggregate Device".......create an AUX Input the last inputs available will be the Digital LightPipes we set up earlier)....

7) In environment create a multi-instrument and set it's midiport to "session1" (this is the ethernet MIDI connection). Now IF you have a MIDI-loop happening in Logic, simply create a transformer object.......now from "Physical Input" take a cable from "Session1" to that transormer object.....double click transformer object and set it to "Filter Matching Events"....now take a cable from transormer object to "Sequencer Input".

that is it works flawlessly and is a really elegant solution.

Now on 2nd G5, use Bidule Plogue to setup another 24 VI's
======

That's all I can find at the moment. BTW, I must have run across 30 quick recommendations for Plogue during my search, but these two were the most comprehensive posts on setting up the network-- but, still not a lot of info on Plogue itself.

(Was someone asking about basic AU hosting setup earlier?

)

Klaus · Post by **Klaus** » Sat Jun 17, 2006 4:13 am

quadrupolesmurf wrote:For basic AU hosting just use AU Lab?

(It's in /Developer/Applications/Audio/)

and It's free!

Just wondering : Xcode 2.3 is out, are the developper tools , esp. AULab a different version ?
I used AULab, but wasn't happy with its unreliable way of saving / recalling stuff, also the GUI wasn't saved right ( with MotU gear that was )

THNX

Klaus

Aramis · Post by **Aramis** » Sat Jun 17, 2006 5:17 am

Ok there should be a new demo version next week -))

Aramis

supersonic · Post by **supersonic** » Sat Jun 17, 2006 7:44 am

I'll be trying out the wormhole/Rax combination on network set-up to see how that goes. I think doing VIs is going to be a problem because of the latency on the incoming audio but having Altiverbs and such should not be a problem. I'll keep you posted, since that's kind of in the same trend.

boonier · Post by **boonier** » Sat Jun 17, 2006 11:53 am

sorry i probably pointed you all to a misnomer download there

The latest version is due in the next few days..if you are registered then you can download the latest preview version before the official non-registered version i s released.

S

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Sat Jun 17, 2006 12:08 pm

supersonic wrote:I'll be trying out the wormhole/Rax combination on network set-up to see how that goes. I think doing VIs is going to be a problem because of the latency on the incoming audio but having Altiverbs and such should not be a problem. I'll keep you posted, since that's kind of in the same trend.

Yeah-- I've heard some mixed reports about Wormhole. In fact, most who have used it for a while seem to switch over to something else. Following various forums about this over the past six months, I stumbled at last upon this Plogue buzz which is getting consistently high praise from users, particularly in the latency department.

If you are VI-heavy, a network appears to be increasingly unavoidable. Keep us posted on how the Wormhole/Rax process works out for you, how you did it, how it behaves, etc. Thanks.