DP Bug Database Participants -- I need three easy questions:

Shooshie · Post by **Shooshie** » Thu May 11, 2006 3:33 am

This will take you less than 5 minutes. It's easy. It's just a matter of looking over my rating scales, and using my numbers to rate yourself, DP, and the bugs I've listed. We're almost there. Let's make this thing worthwhile for all the effort we've all put into it so far.

I've been working on this database of bugs. It's getting very big, but to make this info more usable for MOTU and for ourselves, I need to shade some of the data, because software this complex isn't just black or white. This won't take long, and it requires no research on your part; just your memory. If you will do this, it will make our data much more sensible. It really took getting each of your experiences to know what to ask. I couldn't have known what to put in this database without your input the 1st time around.

NOTE: If you want to answer these questions, but you didn't send me your info, go ahead and do it, but for it to be meaningful I'll need the info I asked for in the thread linked here.

Question 1.
First, using the scale below, describe yourself as a user: ____ (don't be shy!)

1 - I'm a Sunday DP driver
2 - I use it often, but I pretty much do the same things all the time, and I don't know [or don't care] that much about the rest of DP.
3 - I'm a pretty hard core hobbyist/semi-professional, and I secretly plan to produce a hit CD with DP one of these days. (we won't tell... it'll just be our secret)
4 - I'm a pro, and DP is involved in lot of what I do. I'm pretty knowledgeable about DP, but I'm not ashamed to ask questions.
5 - Balls to the wall, pedal to the metal; you can have my copy of DP when you pry my cold, dead fingers off my keyboards. I live and breathe this thing.

Question 2.
Secondly, let's describe Digital Performer as your latest active version feels to you. I'm not looking for trends over every version since 2.7 or even 4.12. I'm just looking at the current systems and bugs, mainly in DP5, or if you're not there yet, DP 4.61 or whatever you're using. This is subjective; it's how DP feels to YOU, not the next guy. If you want to describe TWO versions (as in a before and after scenario) then fill out the questionnaire twice, and state what changed. (drivers, DP version, etc.)

To me DP version _____ feels:____
0 - Totally stable. Zero bugs. I love DP, and it loves me.
1 - A few inconsistencies, but DP is stable
2 - Yeah, yeah, I get the stuck note or occasional sudden quit, but I save often and everything is fine. Not a problem.
3 - Stuck notes, Crashes, Bounce to Disk problems, or other problems they seem to creep up a lot more often than I'd like, but I'm not about to abandon ship. DP's very usable, and I get my work done.
4 - I've had to learn to avoid certain activities in DP. They just cause me too many problems.
5 - DP is unusable for me. Notes stick, it crashes, I have reproducible bugs, and I've even thought seriously about switching to Logic or some other DAW (though I probably will stay with DP if they fix it).

Question 3.
The following scale will be used to describe the severity of your bugs and problems on the questions down below. Just look over the scale, then skip on down to the list of bugs, and rate each bug with a number from this scale.

NA - Does not apply to me (never used the function)
0 - Never had the problem
1 - I remember it, but it's been long ago
2 - Used to happen, but not anymore
3 - a few times per year
4 - happens rarely, but it's not a problem
5 - maybe once a month
6 - maybe twice a month
7 - This bug is really bugging me
8 - Distracting. I get my work done, but this is a problem.
9 - Seems like all the time, but not 100% reproducible
10 - All the time. 100% reproducible.

Rate the following with a number from 0 to 10, using the above scale. Please, I need a number by every one of these. If you don't put a number, I will assume 0. Feel free to add your own bugs if you don't see them here.

••• Random Sudden Quit:
••• Bounce To Disk:
••• Chronic Stuck Notes:
••• Audio Routing bugs:
••• Cue Mix Silent:
••• Crash Changing WindowSets:
••• Random VI Volume Changes:
••• Random Solo Changes:
••• MIDI Bursts:
••• Pitch Automation:
••• Mixing Board Automation Changes:
••• Clicking in monitor during input:
••• CPU Spiking:
••• Crash/Corrupt on Compact:
••• Crash while working:
••• Clicks on Merge:
••• Temporary Digital Noise during playback:
••• Lost Firewire Connection:
••• Lost PCI Connection:
••• MOTU Audio System quits:
••• MOTU MIDI System quits:
••• Crash on other specific functions (specify and rate):
••• Other bugs (specify and rate):

The END!

Thanks, guys and girls. That should do it for now. I may ask a few of you for more info, but basically this will finish it for me.

Shooshie

doodles · Post by **doodles** » Thu May 11, 2006 4:29 am

cheers shooshie!

1) 5
2)3
3) Random Sudden Quit: 1
••• Bounce To Disk: 0
••• Chronic Stuck Notes:3
••• Audio Routing bugs: 0
••• Cue Mix Silent: 0
••• Crash Changing WindowSets:0
••• Random VI Volume Changes: 0
••• Random Solo Changes: 0
••• MIDI Bursts: 0
••• Pitch Automation: 3
••• Mixing Board Automation Changes: 4
••• Clicking in monitor during input: 0
••• CPU Spiking: 6
••• Crash/Corrupt on Compact: never used
••• Crash while working: 4
••• Clicks on Merge: 3
••• Temporary Digital Noise during playback: 1
••• Lost Firewire Connection: 0
••• Lost PCI Connection: 0
••• MOTU Audio System quits: 2
••• MOTU MIDI System quits: 0
••• Crash on other specific functions (specify and rate):
••• Other bugs (specify and rate):

richardein · Post by **richardein** » Thu May 11, 2006 4:47 am

Question 1.
First, using the scale below, describe yourself as a user: ____ (don't be shy!)

1. 4
2. 2 to 2 1/2
3.

Question 3.
The following scale will be used to describe the severity of your bugs and problems on the questions down below. Just look over the scale, then skip on down to the list of bugs, and rate each bug with a number from this scale.

••• Random Sudden Quit: 6
••• Bounce To Disk: 0
••• Chronic Stuck Notes: 8
••• Audio Routing bugs: 0
••• Cue Mix Silent: 0
••• Crash Changing WindowSets: 0
••• Random VI Volume Changes: 0
••• Random Solo Changes: 0
••• MIDI Bursts: 4
••• Pitch Automation: 0
••• Mixing Board Automation Changes: 0
••• Clicking in monitor during input: 0
••• CPU Spiking: 4
••• Crash/Corrupt on Compact: 0
••• Crash while working:4
••• Clicks on Merge: 0
••• Temporary Digital Noise during playback: 4
••• Lost Firewire Connection: 0
••• Lost PCI Connection: 0
••• MOTU Audio System quits: 3
••• MOTU MIDI System quits: 0
••• Crash on other specific functions (specify and rate): 0
••• Other bugs (specify and rate): 0

Two Addenda:

Two days ago, I was recording. I saw the red soundbite graphic in the tracks window but when I stopped, it disappeared. The soundbite appeared in the soundbites window but could not be dragged into any tracks. All the audio from my session disappeared. I finally traced it to a corrupt preference although since I trashed them all, I don't know specifically which one.

Also, I would suggest adding a number for "never use the function so have never seen it" to the above list of bugs. I know, I know, everyone can kibbitz a survey, but I think that would be helpful in providing a true measure of how frequently a given bug appears. Obviously, if you don't use WindowSets, you won't have any crashes to report, and if that is a serious bug, an answer of "0" will make it seem less serious. "Never had it" isn't the same as "Never used it, so never saw it."

logo80 · Post by **logo80** » Thu May 11, 2006 5:15 am

1: 3
2: version 4.61 - 2 (only due to slow or bad fragmented HD) so maybe 1

••• Random Sudden Quit: 0
••• Bounce To Disk: 0
••• Chronic Stuck Notes: 4 (when fast forward)
••• Audio Routing bugs: 0
••• Cue Mix Silent: 0
••• Crash Changing WindowSets: 0
••• Random VI Volume Changes: 0
••• Random Solo Changes: 0
••• MIDI Bursts: 1
••• Pitch Automation: 0
••• Mixing Board Automation Changes: 0
••• Clicking in monitor during input: 4
••• CPU Spiking: 7 (it really depends on buffer settings and hard disk used)
••• Crash/Corrupt on Compact: 0
••• Crash while working: 1
••• Clicks on Merge: 0
••• Temporary Digital Noise during playback: 0
••• Lost Firewire Connection: 0
••• Lost PCI Connection: 0
••• MOTU Audio System quits: 4
••• MOTU MIDI System quits: 0

I just notice that many of the few problems I have are due to the slow hard disk of the powerbook or a bad fragmented section of hard disk, I think I'll need a fw external disk entirely dedicated to audio purpouse.

just another point... I think you should add a question like "do you optimize your system, repair permission and launch manteinance scripts?" cos I think that a stable digital performer needs such operations...

Shooshie · Post by **Shooshie** » Thu May 11, 2006 6:16 am

Richard, I added "NA" for "does not apply to me."

Logo80, I agree that there are many more questions that could be asked. I focused on a very few questions that I thought were most likely to be causing trouble -- mainly on drivers and interfaces (see the other thread linked above). I narrowed it down so that more people would feel like participating. Long lists of questions get few respondents. I think this is the best compromise.

I am very thankful to all who are seeing this through to the end. This is going to be valuable information.

Shooshie

Saintmatthew · Post by **Saintmatthew** » Thu May 11, 2006 7:17 am

1) 5

2) To me DP version "5" feels: "0 - Totally stable. Zero bugs. I love DP, and it loves me." - Yeah baby - upgrade was worth every penny for me!

3) Random Sudden Quit: 0
••• Bounce To Disk: 0
••• Chronic Stuck Notes:0
••• Audio Routing bugs: 0
••• Cue Mix Silent: 0
••• Crash Changing WindowSets:0
••• Random VI Volume Changes: 0
••• Random Solo Changes: 0
••• MIDI Bursts: 0
••• Pitch Automation: 0 all my pitch automation converted from 4.6 to 5 perfectly! : )
••• Mixing Board Automation Changes: 4 - converting projects to version 5 required minor adjustments that took all of 5 minutes.
••• Clicking in monitor during input: 0
••• CPU Spiking: 4
••• Crash/Corrupt on Compact: never used
••• Crash while working: never one crash in any DP version!!!
••• Clicks on Merge: 1
••• Temporary Digital Noise during playback: 0
••• Lost Firewire Connection: 0
••• Lost PCI Connection: NA
••• MOTU Audio System quits: 0
••• MOTU MIDI System quits: 0
••• Crash on other specific functions (specify and rate):
••• Other bugs (specify and rate): some MIDI issues but after dumping my bad USB keystation they're gone. Overall, despite being in the middle of two major writing/recording projects I jumped and did the upgrade and feel it was for the best.

Saintmatthew · Post by **Saintmatthew** » Thu May 11, 2006 7:22 am

I should add I run in 10.3.9 with the older 828MKII drivers that shipped on the CD for my studio setup. I also admittedly have a second install on my work system for those long days when there's nothing to do, I can dick around with mixes, or if I have an idea I can knock out a drum beat in the drum editor. It is also a 10.3.9 system, using the Built in Audio driver. Also runs flawlessly. Perhaps 10.3.9 is more DP friendly than Tiger?

Shooshie · Post by **Shooshie** » Thu May 11, 2006 7:24 am

St. Matthew, all I'm missing from you now is your driver version numbers and interfaces. Would you go to

HD/System/Library/Extensions/[MOTU[...]kext (there may be as many as three of them) and tell me the version numbers of each one?

Then give me the names of your audio and MIDI interfaces, and we're good to go!

Thanks!

Shooshie

Saintmatthew · Post by **Saintmatthew** » Thu May 11, 2006 7:33 am

Have to do that when I hit the studio later. I will update with them after I do. For the werk system:

MOTU MIDI driver 1.3.1
MOTU PCI Audio 1.0.8

Shooshie · Post by **Shooshie** » Thu May 11, 2006 7:43 am

Thanks! Those are indeed the "stable" drivers. I'll look forward to seeing whether the studio drivers are the same.

Shooshie

Timeline · Post by **Timeline** » Thu May 11, 2006 7:48 am

1. = 4
2. = 4.6+ OS 10.4.6
2.5= 4

3.
••• Random Sudden Quit: 8 when graphically moving waveforms forward
••• Bounce To Disk:
••• Chronic Stuck Notes:
••• Audio Routing bugs:
••• Cue Mix Silent:
••• Crash Changing Window-Sets:
••• Random VI Volume Changes:
••• Random Solo Changes:
••• MIDI Bursts:
••• Pitch Automation:
••• Mixing Board Automation Changes:
••• Clicking in monitor during input:
••• CPU Spiking:
••• Crash/Corrupt on Compact:
••• Crash while working:

••• Clicks on Merge: 4 There should be auto crossfades to analyze and avoid this.

••• Temporary Digital Noise during playback:
••• Lost Firewire Connection:
••• Lost PCI Connection:
••• MOTU Audio System quits:
••• MOTU MIDI System quits:
••• Crash on other specific functions (specify and rate):

••• Other bugs (specify and rate): 10 Selecting more than one RME IOs from Machine setup reveals playback continuos clicks at rate of 1 per second.

I think no response should be assumed as just that, no response Shooshie.

markwayne · Post by **markwayne** » Thu May 11, 2006 9:29 am

Question 1.
First, using the scale below, describe yourself as a user: 4

Question 2. 4.61, 10.3.9, (MTPav drivers) 1.24d

To me DP version 4.61 feels 4

Question 3.
••• Random Sudden Quit: 0
••• Bounce To Disk: 6
••• Chronic Stuck Notes: 2
••• Audio Routing bugs: 2
••• Cue Mix Silent: 0
••• Crash Changing WindowSets: 0
••• Random VI Volume Changes: 0
••• Random Solo Changes: 0
••• MIDI Bursts: 2
••• Pitch Automation: 2
••• Mixing Board Automation Changes: 0
••• Clicking in monitor during input: 0
••• CPU Spiking: 4
••• Crash/Corrupt on Compact: 0
••• Crash while working: 1
••• Clicks on Merge: 6
••• Temporary Digital Noise during playback: 4
••• Lost Firewire Connection: n/a
••• Lost PCI Connection: 0
••• MOTU Audio System quits: 1
••• MOTU MIDI System quits: 2
••• Crash on other specific functions (specify and rate): n/a
••• Other bugs (specify and rate):

RROY · Post by **RROY** » Thu May 11, 2006 10:22 am

Question 1. 4
To me DP version 4.61 feels:2 ••• Random Sudden Quit: 1
••• Bounce To Disk: 1
••• Chronic Stuck Notes:5
••• Audio Routing bugs:0
••• Cue Mix Silent: NA
••• Crash Changing WindowSets:0
••• Random VI Volume Changes: 0
••• Random Solo Changes: 0
••• MIDI Bursts: 0
••• Pitch Automation:0
••• Mixing Board Automation Changes: 0
••• Clicking in monitor during input:0
••• CPU Spiking:7
••• Crash/Corrupt on Compact:NA
••• Crash while working: 4
••• Clicks on Merge: 4
••• Temporary Digital Noise during playback: 4
••• Lost Firewire Connection:NA
••• Lost PCI Connection: 4
••• MOTU Audio System quits: 4
••• MOTU MIDI System quits: 0
••• Crash on other specific functions (specify and rate): crash when doing crossfades 5
••• Other bugs (specify and rate):

David Polich · Post by **David Polich** » Thu May 11, 2006 10:51 am

Hi Shooshie,

Question 1: 4
Question 2: 4.61 feels like : 1
Random quit: 4
Bounce to Disk: 0
Chronic stuck notes: 0
Audio routing bugs: 0
CueMixSilent: 0
Crash changing window sets: 0 ( I don't use window sets)
Random VI volume changes: 0 (I don't use VI's within DP)
Random solo changes: 0
MIDI bursts: 0
Pitch automation: 4
Mixing board automation changes: 0
clicking in monitor during input: 0
CPU spiking:4 (when it happens it doesn't cause any problem).
Crash/Corrupt on Compact: 0 (I don't compact)
Temporary digital noise on playback: 0
Lost FireWire connection: 0
Lost PCI connection: 0 (I don't have a PCI system)
MAS system quits: 0
MOTU MIDI system quits: 4
Crash on other specific functions: 4 - (specific functions: opening T-racks plug-in window while playback is enabled).

system: G5 Dual 2.3Ghz, 2 GB RAM, DP 4.61, OSX 10.4.4, 2nd ATA internal 7200 drive for audio, 828 MKII, MIDI Timepiece USB AV, MOTU FireWire driver 1.2.5, MOTU MIDI Driver 1.31, FireWire console 1.1, Clockworks 1.51; no Virtual Instruments in DP, dashboard and Spotlight disabled, system preferences optimized for audio.

dosuna11 · Post by **dosuna11** » Thu May 11, 2006 11:10 am

Question 1.
4 - I'm a pro, and DP is involved in lot of what I do. I'm pretty knowledgeable about DP, but I'm not ashamed to ask questions.

Question 2.
To me DP version _4.6____ feels:_#4___

Question 3.

9 - Seems like all the time, but not 100% reproducible

Rate the following with a number from 0 to 10, using the above scale. Please, I need a number by every one of these. If you don't put a number, I will assume 0. Feel free to add your own bugs if you don't see them here.

••• Random Sudden Quit: 0
••• Bounce To Disk: Don't Do It
••• Chronic Stuck Notes: 0
••• Audio Routing bugs: 0
••• Cue Mix Silent: My fix is to open it from a pre set file not the application
••• Crash Changing WindowSets: 0
••• Random VI Volume Changes: Haven't recorded MIDI yet (I use Reason)
••• Random Solo Changes: 0
••• MIDI Bursts: 0
••• Pitch Automation:
••• Mixing Board Automation Changes: 0
••• Clicking in monitor during input: 0
••• CPU Spiking: 9
••• Crash/Corrupt on Compact: 0
••• Crash while working: only on pitch automation
••• Clicks on Merge: 0
••• Temporary Digital Noise during playback: 0
••• Lost Firewire Connection: 0
••• Lost PCI Connection: 0
••• MOTU Audio System quits: 0
••• MOTU MIDI System quits: 0
••• Crash on other specific functions (specify and rate): 10 only on pitch automation
••• Other bugs (specify and rate) never press playback too soon after recording