MachFive in a Nutshell-- POLL

qo · Post by qo » Sat Mar 25, 2006 1:40 am

Frodo wrote:Hmmm. Hope it's okay to put these here for easier visual comparison...

M5-2

M5-1

Frodo, this is indeed puzzling. Both images have the same presets on the left and the same waveform in the waveform editor. This leads me to believe that the version 2 image is synthesized (yeah, pun intended). Right-click each and choose "Open link in new tab" and then switch between the tabs to get the full effect (again, uh, pun intended, heh).

3over3 · Post by **3over3** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 1:55 am

I don't tend to use commercial libraries, so M5 works for me. I'm more interested in playback (easy to do therefore M5 is very good) and manipulation (pretty good synthesis engine). Regardless of updates - it's still a fundamentally stable and effective sampler. I can't compare with other software samplers (barring EXS which seems good but like M5-lite to me) but every hardware sampler I've used has had its "idiosyncracies". Now let's count how many hit records have been made using quirky gear...!

Bottom line: it works in the environment I'm asking it to (RTAS/PC).
(Alternative bottom line: make it do more stuff! Make it do stuff the competitors do!)

chrispick · Post by **chrispick** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 2:05 am

qo wrote:Frodo, this is indeed puzzling. Both images have the same presets on the left and the same waveform in the waveform editor. This leads me to believe that the version 2 image is synthesized (yeah, pun intended). Right-click each and choose "Open link in new tab" and then switch between the tabs to get the full effect (again, uh, pun intended, heh).

ICYDK: The M5 2 image is a mock-up they made months and months ago. Every couple of months it resurfaces on this site.

qo · Post by qo » Sat Mar 25, 2006 2:12 am

chrispick wrote:ICYDK: The M5 2 image is a mock-up they made months and months ago. Every couple of months it resurfaces on this site.

IDK

Thanks for the history CP!

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 2:54 am

This is ALL very interesting to me because I've never really gotten a good gander at the console until now.

Seems that v1 has more faders and control options in the center part of the console, but if v2 is indeed a mock-up, then I'll just keep reading...

3over3-- thanks again for your comments. Stable and effective are "fundamentally" the bottom line.

wlbwlb-- I'm still taking in your last post. Thanks for your comments (and compliment) as well. I will respond in kind (if I can), but lets just say that for the first time I'm taking a whole new approach to shopping for new toys by engaging experienced users in conversation rather than skimming a few threads and reading a couple of reviews.

In addition, I'm looking at several different libraries to augment my orchestral libraries, which are finally getting up to speed. However, my orchestral libraries (VSL-VI, for example) tend to be self contained, but I would like to build better sound effects and ethnic instruments library. I'm also in the early stages of surround mixing, so M5 does have considerable appeal.

You and everyone here are helping me through a very unusual thought process, which is highly appreciated.

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 3:14 am

Bill-- I just took a few notes from your detailed post. Can't thank you enough.

I had considered K2, but I was in the middle of using GPO full version when the Finale scaled down version with GPO was released. Not knowing what trouble would be caused, I installed Finale with GPO and it unvalidated my full version. Repeated re-auths from NI for the two different Kontakt Players drove me nuts and was never able to get either to work properly since. I ended up taking all Kontakt Player versions off my system. BTW- Finale and the full GPO required their own versions of Kontakt Player. It was a compatibility nightmare.

So, you're a pencil-and-paper kind of guy, too? My work always starts at the table, then goes to the piano way before I ever sit at the computer. By the time a boot up, I need to have all of my essential ideas on paper already. The experimentation begins with auditoning sounds and creating a canvas. Your comments about K2 are quite telling-- I'm being a bit cryptic here, but I know this is getting wordy.

What about key mapping in both M5 and K2? Twiddly? Obedient? "Kludgy" Does K2 transfer such key mapping from Giga and EXS? I have almost everything VSL ever released for EXS and would love nothing more to get it working within DP as much as possible. I should scour the VSL forum for more specific K2 information, but I'm all ears (pointy as they might be!

)

Gratefully,
Frodo

wlbwlb · Post by **wlbwlb** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 7:55 am

Frodo wrote: What about key mapping in both M5 and K2? Twiddly? Obedient? "Kludgy" Does K2 transfer such key mapping from Giga and EXS? I have almost everything VSL ever released for EXS and would love nothing more to get it working within DP as much as possible. I should scour the VSL forum for more specific K2 information, but I'm all ears (pointy as they might be! )

Gratefully,
Frodo

I checked a few instruments and the keyswitch keys appear in pink on the K2 virtual keyboard and if I play the keyswitched articulations from my Keystation, they work. BUT, something funny is going on because in VSL there are files called "all" which, I believe, are usually KS instruments that include all the articulations that are also available separately. I also have OPUS I & II stuffed into GigaStudio and I will check the Keyswitches there for comparison. Kompakt is so much easier than GigaStudio. Of course then we get in toMac vs Windoze and that's probabaly too tiresome a topic and also getting a little OT here but, hey, that's the nature of forums.

BTW I find VSL's filenames and general layout difficult sometimes. EWQL is much easier to use in this respect, but the great thing about K2 is that you can apply all sorts of reverbs and effects to the extremely dry VSL instruments right inside of the K2 interface. I could go on forever, but I need get to sleep. I'm logging in from Japan and it's after midnight here.

Hope this helps.

Bill

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 12:34 pm

It does help, Bill.

Arigatou gozaimashita!

billf · Post by **billf** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 2:56 pm

qo wrote:
chrispick wrote:ICYDK: The M5 2 image is a mock-up they made months and months ago. Every couple of months it resurfaces on this site.
IDK Thanks for the history CP!

you can see a video of MachFive II in action at the Jan 2005 NAMM here:

http://www.sonicstate.com/news/shownews.cfm?newsid=2033#

mcevilley · Post by **mcevilley** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 8:46 pm

5. I've got no complaints about it except the lack of libraries available for Mach V. Converting stuff is not quite as easy as they'd have you think. Sometimes it works great, but not always.
Mach V, though, is a great sampler.

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Sun Mar 26, 2006 12:49 am

mcevilley wrote:5. I've got no complaints about it except the lack of libraries available for Mach V. Converting stuff is not quite as easy as they'd have you think. Sometimes it works great, but not always.
Mach V, though, is a great sampler.

This is an odd time for software. The old addage that "you get what you pay for" doesn't always apply as it once did.

M5 has much to recommend. It does suffer from critical, essential support of one type or another-- technical and third-party. The question for me now is how committed to M5 MOTU is or will continue to be as they're pushing the development of other VI's (which was not really their 'thing').

On it's own, M5 may indeed be a great sampler. How do we approach the question of whether it's all but a dead sampler? It certainly is an old sampler with v1 being announced in January '03. I think at this point it cannot hold its price, which may actually make it more attractive. $300 is not a lot of money, but I could also add some appreciable RAM to my computer or-- I'd rather spend that plus another $200 on K2 if it's going to work better overall.

At this point, it may just be worth having M5 and K2 and one or two others to serve different purposes. My next challenge is to sort out what those purposes will be...

wlbwlb · Post by **wlbwlb** » Sun Mar 26, 2006 8:02 pm

Frodo wrote:[
I'd rather spend that plus another $200 on K2 if it's going to work better overall.

At this point, it may just be worth having M5 and K2 and one or two others to serve different purposes. My next challenge is to sort out what those purposes will be...

Virtual Instruments offers a crossgrade at a discounted price for users of any other VI sampler bundled with other libraries, such at the East West libraries, or Zero-Gravity, etc.
Full price for K2 is $499 but this crossgrade is $269, quite a savings. You'll have to pay for the shipping from Berlin, but even with that I ordered the crossgrade online and saved quite a bit of money over the list price. It only took two days from Berlin to Tokyo. I guess that transmission route has a long history!!

The VI website is not a model of usability, but if you click on the "Sampler Line" menu item in the products area, that will take you the Kontakt 2 area with the info I just mentioned.

Bill

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 1:08 am

Thanks again, Bill.

Looks as if I play my cards right I could have both for the price of K2.

Hmm. I'll check the site for more info.

3over3 · Post by **3over3** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 1:14 am

Frodo wrote:My next challenge is to sort out what those purposes will be...

(sorry, can't resist this) Hooray! It's Frodo's next challenge! Can we do a deal on the film rights? That Tolkein bloke never bothered with a proper sequel - at last - "Lord of the Plug-ins"...

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 1:33 pm

3over3 wrote:
Frodo wrote:My next challenge is to sort out what those purposes will be...
(sorry, can't resist this) Hooray! It's Frodo's next challenge! Can we do a deal on the film rights? That Tolkein bloke never bothered with a proper sequel - at last - "Lord of the Plug-ins"...

LOL!! Clever.

Two things--

1) Tolkien started a sequel called "The New Shadow". How appropriate!!

2) There are times when one wants to toss certain software and its tech support into the fires of Mt. Doom, but due thanks go to all the Sam Gamgees here who have offered their help and advice which will facilitate this new "adventure". I'm up for the challenge, but "I do not know the way" just yet. In the meantime, I'll take Gandalf's advice-- all I have to decided is what to do with the time (and money) that has been given to me.