MachFive in a Nutshell-- POLL

[Frodo]

4
The interface is a bit kludgy..
Text is kind of small for my (nearly) 40 year old eyes

Do tell. Do tell. I've never used OSX's Universal Zoom feature so much as I do in DP. No doubt there will be no retiring this keystroke, it seems.

"kludgy". Now there's a word for the books, but a 4 is not a bad rating. Thanks sd.

[wlbwlb]

4
The interface is a bit kludgy..
Text is kind of small for my (nearly) 40 year old eyes

Do tell. Do tell. I've never used OSX's Universal Zoom feature so much as I do in DP. No doubt there will be no retiring this keystroke, it seems.

Well, I'm glad to hear this from others. I just discovered the Universal Zoom feature myself and use it often with M5, MSI, and DP. Only problem is that all of the DP interface text is antialiased and gets blurrier and blurrier as I increase the resolution. Kontakt players, on the other hand are always readable. Go figure! And whatever happened to vector graphics? Long live Flash!

While I have been suffering with learning Logic for a while now, I rarely sing its praises, but this is one area where Logic really shines. You can make tracks huge and zoom in on the matrix editor (MIDI) or the score editor, even editor, or anything else, which is a real boon for members of the reading glasses set (which I have belonged to for some time

Bill

[billf]

I have mixed thoughts about it:

I give it a 3 for the paltry stock library and the inconsistent import capabilities.

I give it a 5 for UI and sonic manipulation capabilities.

[Frodo]

I have mixed thoughts about it:

I give it a 3 for the paltry stock library and the inconsistent import capabilities.

I give it a 5 for UI and sonic manipulation capabilities.

Wow. That would actually average out to a 4, which is worth having despite a few shortcomings.

So far, there has only been one vote that in the 2-ish range. Most votes are hovering around 4 with a couple of fives and threes. No ones? Encouraging-- but perhaps I speak too soon...

[qo]

Having both Mach5 and Kontakt, I tend to use Kontakt more often because the library covers more ground. I've tried, with varying success, to import other sample formats into Mach5 and find it cumbersome/flakey. And, as others have implied, there's no forward momentum with this product.

I'll give it a 3. It's usable, but it's nothing special due to the lack of support by 3rd parties (or even MOTU) for content.

regards,

qo

[stephentayler]

Most people seem concerned about M5's ability to deal with importing sound libraries, but I give it a 5 as a tool for sampling/creating my own work.

I remember only too well what a complete pain it was to go through the actual sampling and performance setup process with AKAIs !!

So for sound design and unusual instrument creation.....spot-on!!

Stephen

[stratology]

Only used it for a short while.

1

Unusable at the end of the day, due to iLok issues I experienced.
The program as such was ok, the interface could be more readable. Out of the huge stock library I could only find a handful of sounds that were really good.

[lordtoranaga]

hello,


I have been using mach 5 for about 1 1/2 years.


I find, for me it only works with dp.

when i use it with abelton live, there is a bug.

if a window opens infront of th m5 window, the m5 window will glitch out.

i then have to close and reopen the window, then there is no text in the m5 window. this is the vst version

i am going to sell my m5, and buy an s6000

[gblock]

Unfortunately: a 2.

1) I'm on the AudioUnit version, and so I'm missing features that many of the RTAS folk have access to.
2) It's glitchy.
3) I'm demoralized by the complete lack of updates to the product.


Which is a shame, because I do like the sound of it - but I'm afraid it hasn't managed to replace the EXS. I'll use it in addition, but it's just not a good enough user experience to be a replacement.

[Frodo]

All very honest and insightful comments here, both pro and con-- all valid and important considerations.

stehentaylor's experience with it as a wonderful self-contained tool for creating one's own sample collection speaks volumes. If that's not the way one works most of the time, then having reliable sample format import suddenly becomes very important, especially if MachFive format is all but absent on the third-party market.

But it doesn't sound as if stephen has had the same iLok or glitch issues, unless I've overlooked something. Such things can really reflect poorly on a product, as is the case right now with Syncrosoft and the new Vienna Symphonic Library's Virtual Instrument collection. The new library is amazing, but so many people have been "protected" from using their own software. It's getting sorted, but it is a pain.

It's very interesting that there has been relatively little talk about M5 over the past year or so. It is worth noting those comments from those who've observed that certain features are not available on certain platforms, or those features which can be found on other samplers and sample players other than M5.

Few people have said anything about surround, but then again there is so little talk about surround mixing in DP or any other Mac-based DAW for that matter.

This survey has suddenly become more complex than expected!! Good food for thought...

Thanks again, folks!! I'm learning....

[billf]

It's very interesting that there has been relatively little talk about M5 over the past year or so.

I suspect there are at least a couple of reasons.

* First, it's been a long time for V1 to be on the market. I bought MachFive at the time that DP 3.11 was transitioning to DP 4, so it's been a long time to remain at a v 1.x release.

* Second, MOTU showed MachFive v 2.0 at NAMM in Jan 05, and since then has been silence. There was a flurry of discussion after they demo'd the new product, but because it has never been released, the buzz has died.

* Third, MOTU has appeared to be more focused on producing ROMplers rather than building a M5 sound library support community. So without new libraries coming out that are M5 ready straight out of the box, again there's less opportunity for discussion starters.


All this has made me wonder if MachFive is a dead end product. This is a case where MOTU marketing is dropping the ball.

[Frodo]

All this has made me wonder if MachFive is a dead end product. This is a case where MOTU marketing is dropping the ball.

When you consider the irony of how open-ended MachFive set out to be and how far ahead of the curve it was at the time, your question bears asking. It may not literally be a dead-end product, but for the way it's been kept so quiet over 2 NAMMs it may have a certain support shelf life.

That seems to sum up my concern so far as reflected in the comments of others in the way of technical support and third party support.

I'm still intrigued by stephentaylor's positive comment, but along with it I can't help but wonder in the midst of all else why we should get excited about all the new VIs shipping with DP5 when a major tool like M5 remains half cooked.

I like my steak medium rare, but my software has to be well done.

[billf]

I can't help but wonder in the midst of all else why we should get excited about all the new VIs shipping with DP5 when a major tool like M5 remains half cooked.

I like my steak medium rare, but my software has to be well done.

To add further to the mystery, MOTU has screen shots of M5 v 2.0 on their web site, along with Ethno and DP5.

http://www.motu.com/marketing/motu_products/software/

[Frodo]

Hmmm. Hope it's okay to put these here for easier visual comparison...


M5-2

M5-1

[wlbwlb]

All this has made me wonder if MachFive is a dead end product. This is a case where MOTU marketing is dropping the ball.

When you consider the irony of how open-ended MachFive set out to be and how far ahead of the curve it was at the time, your question bears asking. It may not literally be a dead-end product, but for the way it's been kept so quiet over 2 NAMMs it may have a certain support shelf life.

That seems to sum up my concern so far as reflected in the comments of others in the way of technical support and third party support.

I'm still intrigued by stephentaylor's positive comment, but along with it I can't help but wonder in the midst of all else why we should get excited about all the new VIs shipping with DP5 when a major tool like M5 remains half cooked.

I like my steak medium rare, but my software has to be well done.

Frodo, you're such a supportive moderator of this interesting discussion that I thought I would at least make a comment of my own since I've been using M5 right from the week it was released.

I have both M5 and K2. There is no comparison between editing and mixing functions. K2 wins hands down. You can tweak everything with expandable, click-down windows and you can even do mixing, routing instruments to AUX channels with convolution reverb, etc., all with relatively little pull on the CPU. I'm a composer, not an audio engineer, and since I first came to audio via the manuscript paper route, I still sometimes tremble a bit inside the mixing windows of biggie sequencers (especially Logic!) but I find Kontakt to be one of the easiest interfaces for handling audio around, bar none. All the meters, knobs, buttons, and faders are beautifully designed, easy to see, and (almost) intuitive. And it's all laid out in a spiffy way. Now I only wish NI would come out with a sequencer.

As for conversion, I flawlessly converted the entire VSL Opus I and II libraries from EXS 24 to K2 format in just a few minutes. A piece of cake. Then I put them in the QuickLoad menu of K2 for easy access from a pop-up.

Also, the instruments themselves in Kontakt are vastly superior to M5, even including a basic set of Vienna SL orchestral insruments which you could orchestrate just about anything with in a pinch. No muted brass and other omissions, but hey, the basic instruments and articulations are there.

Another example. Recently, I needed an patch with a full church pipe organ sound, so I went to M5, and sure enough there was a great organ sound, even playing dim chords or major or minor chords. I used it in a short cue I was doing. Then I happened to be messing around with K2 and noticed the organ patches there. I played them and was zonked out by the superior quality. M5 sound felt like the local church. K2 sounded like Notre Dame or St. Peters in Rome (or even better, St. Mark's in Venice, which has two opposite choir lofts).

The best patches in M5 are the ones that SoundBank produced. Lots of variety and high quality.

One small source of irritation for me is that DP has dropped the ball for Logic users since the M5 AU plug-in doesn't validate in Logic 7.1. This has been a known issue at MOTU for months. They have mentioned it on their website and they even encourage you to check the AU for use anyway under the menu category "incompatible." I'm sure it is not that complicated to make the AU validate, but so far nothing from MOTU.

All in all, as others have said, M5 was an early effort and was quite novel when it appeared. I have used it in the past for conversion and samples. But now it is becoming the grey lady of samplers while glitzy stars like Kompakt 2 have taken center stage. It's kind of like Cher vs Jennifer Lopez. But Cher is famous for her comebacks, so let's hope an M5 comeback is on the horizon. I'll cough up for an upgrade if it is as good as MSI.

My 2-cents.

Bill