Motu MTP (MIDI timepiece) parallell version and PC

[Threshold Productions]

Hi!
I picked up a MTP today, the old version with parallellconnection. What do i need to connect it to my PC? Theres a small cable that I can connect the MTP with my PCI-324 card, is that enough or do I need a parallellconnection as well?

[Threshold Productions]

Thanks!
I just picked up a parallellecable so I will try it out tonight.

[Threshold Productions]

Now i installed the parallellcable between the PC and the MTP, tried all parallellsettings in bios (AT, EPP, ECP) and when i run LPT Refresh or Clockworks no LPT-port is discovered.

It sucks being out of a manual.

Help anyone please?

[Racy]

You need the ISA card. You can't just plug it into a parallel port.

I just got a Mac and I am trying to see if I can use my MIDI express PC in the mac. Anyone know if this is possible?

The pc card is a 16 bit isa type, with a parallel port connection built into it. It has switches to address the MIDI express PC.

I have the manual if you need a screen shot...

[Jidis]

I think I've seen mention of that older one with the card, in a review or something online. MIDI runs at a frequency that most COM ports and stuff don't actually match (the ports are faster). The devices will have code and circuitry to get the port to spit stuff out at the MIDI rate, so the old non-USB stuff is likely going to work with exactly what it has on the back (or the MIDI-rate ISA card it hooks to). You can't usually adapt anything to something it's not made for.

If the MIDI Express with the card, has any 8-pin mini-DIN jacks on it, it may work with an old Mac serial port. The jacks are the same size as modern PC keyboard/mouse connectors. Otherwise, there would have been a different version, with jacks, or a different host card for the Mac.

Many are running adapters in the more current Macs to get those old serial ports back, but you've still got the drivers issue. I doubt you could trust any recent OS or software to support something that old.

It may be something a PC'er would like, if there's at least a 98 driver or something around. "Card-driven" MIDI usually has good reputation, but I'm not sure about ISA.

Threshold Productions-

Try not to get your hopes up too much on the parallel MOTU under 2K or XP. There are some who have gotten them to work, but many who have done some serious fighting with them and come out with nothing.

First, make sure you've got the correct cable. It should be male 25 on one end and female on the other. The male 25pin connector on some PC's is actually a serial port variant. The parallel/printer port is a female. Also, the cable needs all 25 pins wired end to end (I doubt it uses that many, but it needs the right ones and no "flipped" crap).

You could probably write a book about the magic workarounds, tricks & tragedies of MOTU's parallel PC drivers. The concept is awesome, but they chose not to support it, in favor of the new USB interface sales. I guess products which they've already gotten the money for, don't do them much good in the present or future tense. Reliable sources have noted that the p.port MOTU code for 2K/XP is actually sort of a hacked-up version of the older drivers for 95/98, rather than properly written 2K/XP ones.

There are a couple threads and sites out there for tricks people have found, but some could still be interface or host dependant. There are also many who can get the unit to work OK, but not with certain MIDI devices or loads on it, and others using it regularly, who have it occasionally refuse to work under their usual config., for no apparent reason.

Here's a good tip site (note: I've seen some of the stuff he describes, so the drivers he's referring to probably didn't fix a lot of it.)

http://caps.pcrecruiter.com/MOTU/

Good luck with it either way!

George

[Jidis]

Yeah, 98 worked OK at the studio here, but there's too much stuff that only runs in 2K/XP now, so it doesn't do much good (sort of like having an OS7/8 Mac driver today).

98's on my secondary rig. I checked it on that, just to make sure the hardware was OK, and it seemed like it was detected properly. I didn't do much with it on that, but I think it worked with my JLCooper controller, and it totally screwed that up under XP. The old VXD MIDI drivers were how it was actually written. I think I read that the core of them may even be real old, but I'm not sure.

Take Care

[Threshold Productions]

Threshold Productions-

Try not to get your hopes up too much on the parallel MOTU under 2K or XP. There are some who have gotten them to work, but many who have done some serious fighting with them and come out with nothing.

First, make sure you've got the correct cable. It should be male 25 on one end and female on the other. The male 25pin connector on some PC's is actually a serial port variant. The parallel/printer port is a female. Also, the cable needs all 25 pins wired end to end (I doubt it uses that many, but it needs the right ones and no "flipped" crap).

http://caps.pcrecruiter.com/MOTU/

Good luck with it either way!

George

Big Thanks George!

I read thru some old threads last night and it seams like I shouldn‘t have bought this midiinterface in the first place

I got a correct parallellcabel, attached to the parallellport of the MTP and the other end to my Dell PC. I configured the port EPP, 378, IRQ7 as I read in some thread. It doesn‘t seem like my system detects anything on the LPT1-port so I guess I will have to continue struggeling and hope for the best.

I tried almost all of the old drivers from the ftproot on Motu‘s ftp with no particular luck.

[Threshold Productions]

I have a Parallel MTPAV and when I had it hooked up, I did in fact have it running under Windows 98!!! Yes all you need is the standard printer cable to connect it. ill take a look at this under XP and see what I can get.

Sounds very promising Hope you can find out something that get my system working as we got almost the same setup

[Threshold Productions]

I‘ve tried to run the latest drivers from MOTUs homepage (SETUPMIDI_2.51.zip). I run setup.exe and chose all the drivers from the installationmenu.

But after installation and reboot it doesn‘t detect any MTP whatsoever when i run LPTREFRESH and Clockworks...

Any suggestions?

[gualso]

Hello
The MTP AV drivers for windows xp only works in sp1.
I couldm`t open the work clock console in sp2

Gualso

[Jidis]

Threshold Productions,

Hey Again,

Sorry if I missed this, but you're not actually trying to do anything under 98 are you? (I'd assume not with a P4 )

I also forgot a couple other things:

You may be happy to know that I think the only ones I've really heard of people being able to use under 2K/XP, were the MTP's (all the MOTU MIDI's have that same driver now). Most weren't 100% trouble-free, but the Micro's and MIDIExpress's were usually given up on.

One post I saw said that his MTP only worked with an earlier version of the unified driver (maybe feb2 2000 or 2002?). I've also heard of people having to set their port to that "lowest", old setting (usually SPP or normal). I'm not sure the "working" setting is the same on all people's systems or interfaces though. I did manage to get that MicroExpress here to show up on that setting. Also, I see the IRQ 7 recommended, and the i/o address of 300 (or maybe the default 378). And there's mention of making sure you don't have onboard devices (MPU MIDI or anything) trying to use it. The MIDI's under 2K/XP also appear to be some of the worst, with regard to MOTU's infamous "disappearing acts". I've read that by keeping the clockworks application constantly open in the background, you can keep it around a little better. It may be no relation, but you also might try reserving the resources in the BIOS or something. ACPI does that "virtual address" crap, but I think the hardware still "shares" on some level. Someone in a forum post even mentioned having his be detected more consistently with a certain cable length. Sounds like voodoo, but all of the aforementioned stuff is.

If you enjoy profanity as much as I do, you may want to go read some of the usenet posts on MOTU (Google: MOTU MIDI Parallel 2K XP Problem Support,etc. under the "Groups" search). I've seen threads in rec.audio.pro with about ten different people commenting on their experiences, and every single one of them was angry.

FWIW, I was talking to someone recently, who seemed to know some "port access" programming, and he pointed me to an article, which (if I read it correctly) actually implied that 2K/XP's port drivers had resolved many issues with 95/98 program's inability to maintain solid control of the ports(?). The older OS's would sometimes allow programs to steal the port from each other. It may only apply to "generic" Windows port apps, and not devices with dedicated drivers, but the port theft thing seems to be what the MOTU is having trouble with (thus the Clockworks workaround). It seems like with nothing else running on that port, it wouldn't happen, but maybe there's some periodic polling of the port or the resources it's tied to, that knocks it "out of the way".

Whatever the reason, it's obviously poor, rushed programming. The driver seems to either be an attempt to get people to "shut up and stop complaining" about no 2K/XP support, or a way of keeping future (or present) customers from seeing that they really weren't willing to take the extra time to maintain proper driver support for their previous product lines, and had left a whole world of relatively happy customers stranded with no use for the interfaces they had bought (not good for customer relations).

Sorry for the bleak outlook (still wishing you luck),

George

PS- I worked at a place a few years ago where we bought an MTP A/V. IIRC it was over $500. It's sort of funny how a thing in that price range could go from that, to being worth 30 or 40 bucks on eBay in that short of a time, just because of a driver which probably fits on a floppy. With the audio community's respect for non-USB MIDI, the damn things may have gone up in value if they had written a real driver back then.

[Threshold Productions]

Hello
The MTP AV drivers for windows xp only works in sp1.
I couldm`t open the work clock console in sp2

Gualso

Thanks,
Im on XP SP2 here

[Jidis]

Like the other stuff I mentioned, I don't think any of us can really be 100% sure that what works for our MOTU hardware on our systems, is what everyone's rig will need. Use the other's workarounds and tips merely as "good things to try" (including the SP1/SP2 issues).

While I'm still in a complaining frame of mind: Don't ever allow yourself to believe that any of this sort of crap is acceptable. The SP2 complaints may be an exception, but any hardware which requires this specific sort of install, has this many common required workarounds, and disagrees with this much software or hardware, is not normal. Other companies, for the most part, don't have these issues, and it's not likely Windows' fault, or any of your other components. Even the audio devices, like the FW interfaces which only work on a certain chipset, or allow a certain harddrive to interrupt their throughput, are not so common outside MOTU. Maybe some of it is poorly tested "prototypes", or permanent hardware issues, but a good part of the Windows issues are obviously a support thing.

Customers should not feel comfortable replacing or returning other working system components, because a third party didn't feel like allocating adequate resources to development or support, or had rushed out a prematurely advertised product or driver, to meet a deadline or beat other companies to a sale.

Take Care

[Threshold Productions]

Jidis:

Thanks for your awesome reply, I will try it out tonight when I get home from work (I‘m in GMT+1 country here)

Torsten

[supernova777]

Hi!
I picked up a MTP today, the old version with parallellconnection. What do i need to connect it to my PC? Theres a small cable that I can connect the MTP with my PCI-324 card, is that enough or do I need a parallellconnection as well?

those ports are for "Control track"+ "Adat Sync" they are not for connecting a MIDI device that connects via serial or parallel