New Mac for my DP projects. What to get?

[Anders Peev]

Hi friends!

It's time for a new Mac. And I need som help to make a good choice. Thinking of this setup:

• 27 inch iMac with i9 processor
https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-mac/imac ... 0ghz-512gb

• Lowest RAM 8GB. And buying 128GB from a third party maker.

• I Need at least 3-4TB storage:
- Built in Apple SSD storage?
- Or external SSD drive? Which one? USB? Or thunderbolt?

I'm planning to run BBC SO from Spitfire Audio.

Am I going in a good direction? Or should I get another setup?

Hope you can help!/ Anders

[mikehalloran]

I contemplated buying one instead of my 18 core iMac Pro. The additional Thunderbolt channel, more powerful GPU for my AV work and superior cooling tipped me over to the iMP.

Let me rephrase that: I did buy a 2020 for my wife and, after comparing it to my 14 core 2TB iMP decided to get the 18 core 4TB Vega 64 for myself instead of a second 2020.

Damned good machine for DP, hands down, no doubts about that.

Nothing wrong with your specs but, if contemplating having 4TB on board, spring for 8TB instead. Yes, it's +$1,200 as opposed to an external 4TB Thunderbolt 3 SSD at $999 + shipping but this allows you to buy inexpensive spinners for TimeMachine and archiving only.
https://eshop.macsales.com/shop/owc-env ... lsrc=aw.ds

If you need 8TB, there is no advantage to 4+4. Besides which, the pair of 4TB blades inside the 2020 are set up modified RAID 0, something you can't do with 4+4.

There's a reason to consider the $100 10 Gigabit Ethernet upgrade over Gigabit Ethernet. You can link two or more T2 Macs to harness the combined horsepower but only if all have 10GBE. Don't need it now but what about the future?

Apple's RAM prices for these are absolutely frickin' insane—it's user replaceable for crying out loud. They're using Micron RAM; Crucial is the consumer division of Micron and sometimes has the better price over OWC. Do not buy non-Crucial Micron off the internet—that's OEM and not covered by any warranty unless extended by the seller (the lack of warranty is reflected in the price to the VARs who are expected to eat the rare defect). Also, there are reports that some of the sticks on the internet are for the 2019 and there is a minor difference*. Also, Crucial has excellent warranty and customer service through their warranty center in Nampa, Idaho. OWC's customer service is well known.

*The 2020 27" supports dual-channel memory if a) two matched sticks of RAM in the correct slots or b) four matched sticks. Mixing 2019 and 2020 Micron or any other mismatch gives you single-channel performance which does show up in Geekbench and other scores. (Macs without the T2 are single channel only; the iMP & MP 7.1 are quad channel)

We really like the Nano-glass option on my wife's 2020. Opinions on MacRumors vary but few are posted by those of us who actually own one. She didn't know there was a glare issue with the old one till it was gone.

If I could have had Nano-glass and 8TB internal storage with my 18 core iMac Pro, I would have ordered it that way.

[Anders Peev]

Oh, what a fantastic, in-depth reply! Thank so much Mike!

The iMac Pro is beyond my budget. I'll have to settle for the 27 iMac. But I assume the the i9 processor is a good option?

RAM. When buying RAM from a third party maker I have to find the right thing in the tech-djungle here! I had no idea about the possible single-channel performance when mismatching third party RAM-sticks! I don't live in the US and will have to find a dealer for the RAM in the EU or in Sweden, where I live. But I still don't understand what kind of Crucial RAM I would be looking for. They seem to have different lables such as DDR4 and DDR3. https://www.webhallen.com/se/category/6 ... er%5E15560

Storage. It is better to get internal storage than external? With external SSD-drives I will miss out on the RAID-0-thing and thus my SSDs performance will be slower? I long thought that the RAID-thing was a SATA-disk setup. But it is vaild for SSD as well?

My workhorse of today is a MacPro tower from 2007 (!!). It does hardly work on the internet anymore. It's maxed out with 16 (or 8? Can't recall) GB RAM and 2TB internal storage. I expect it to selfdestruct any minute. But she's still in the game. I have recorded several albums and created music for films and numerous theatrical shows on it. Will it it be possible to connect my old MacPro via 10GB Ethernet to my new iMac? What would it do for the new iMac? Can I run VI:s from it? Or do I just take it to the dump?

Thanks again for your wise advise Mike!

Anders

[bkshepard]

Please note that as of this moment, DP is not compatible with Big Sur and the new M1 Macs.

[HCMarkus]

The only thing I can add is, if you are not in a rush, consider waiting for an appropriate M1 iMac. Of course, this assumes DP will be ported over by then...

OTOH, the upgrade you will experience going to the Intel-powered machine you are now considering will likely be astounding. And you won't have to worry about compatibility issues (you can run Catalina on that Mac, I'm pretty sure.)

[mikehalloran]

No matter what MacOS a 2020 iMac ships with, it can be run over Catalina if necessary.

The i9 rocks for DP. I checked it out. Overall response was on par with my 2017 14 core Xeon and that's very good. The fan speed rose a little on the large project I tested but not like my 2010 used to (more than my iMP, of course).

The mismatched RAM issue is because of the T2 chip. I preordered my wife's as soon as it was announced before anyone knew about single vs dual channel. In fact, the 32GB came from OWC about a month before the iMac. So I have 40GB mismatched RAM in it—the 16x2 plus the original 4x2. Seeing that she runs Quark Express, Office, Zoom, browsers etc., I'd rather have the 40GB onboard a little slower than 32GB dual-channel. If she has issues with not enough RAM, I'll order another pair from OWC so that, if there's a mismatch, I can exchange the first pair since I bought it from them (and they absolutely would).

Storage. It is better to get internal storage than external? With external SSD-drives I will miss out on the RAID-0-thing and thus my SSDs performance will be slower? I long thought that the RAID-thing was a SATA-disk setup. But it is vaild for SSD as well?

Short answer: RAID 0 is even more beneficial with SSDs. The SSD blades in modern Macs are either single (Mini, most laptops) or duo configured RAID 0 (iMP). The 2020 iMac and the Mac Pro 7.1 can be either single or duo depending on the size. OS 10.13 and later cannot be booted from external RAID 0 but it's fine for external storage (and very expensive over Thunderbolt).

You cannot upgrade the internal storage later so, if you can, do it now. If you need to budget a 4TB external for later, it will work. I recommend looking towards the future now.

As for the optional GPUs: If you're a gamer or are editing and combining multiple video streams, try to see if the budget will stretch to cover the 5700 XT. You do not need it for editing and rendering Zoom videos.

The only thing I can add is, if you are not in a rush, consider waiting for an appropriate M1 iMac. Of course, this assumes DP will be ported over by then...

OTOH, the upgrade you will experience going to the Intel-powered machine you are now considering will likely be astounding. And you won't have to worry about compatibility issues (you can run Catalina on that Mac, I'm pretty sure.)

I agree 100%

[Anders Peev]

Thanks you all for your wisdoms!

I will consider 4TB Internal SSD. I probably get back here when it's time to find the correct RAM-sticks.

Have a great week!

Anders

[greg328]

Regarding the 7.1 Mac Pro— they currently ship with Intel Xeon processors—will they soon switch to M1 as well? Worth waiting for?


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[mikehalloran]

Regarding the 7.1 Mac Pro— they currently ship with Intel Xeon processors—will they … switch to M1 as well?
…

Yes. Prototypes have been spotted

…soon… ?

It's Apple. No one knows — and anyone who claims otherwise is wrong. Per Apple, sometime in the next two years.

Worth waiting for?

Only you can answer that.

The normal advice stands: If you need something now, buy something now. There are some interesting offerings in the Refurb Store
https://www.apple.com/shop/refurbished/mac/mac-pro

Many apps including DP are not yet compatible with Big Sur, let alone Apple silicon.

I bought my 18 core iMac Pro nearly a year ago knowing that a) Apple will replace it with an M based something b) I will probably want and c) I had work to do now.

I certainly didn't expect lockdown to continue and my workload to increase the way it did so it was the right call for me. But I am not you.

[greg328]

Thanks Mike, I appreciate it.


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[greg328]

Mike, another quick question, the new Mac Pro comes in 8-core, 12-core and higher core counts and of course with correspondingly more insane pricing.

It seems that us audio producers would be able to get by with the base 8-core unit, wouldn’t you agree? The higher core-count processors are for the video guys in Hollywood at Pixar/Disney and all that stuff, correct? In other words, wouldn’t the base new Mac Pro suffice to still be a blazing machine for our purposes?


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[mikehalloran]

Mike, another quick question, the new Mac Pro comes in 8-core, 12-core and higher core counts and of course with correspondingly more insane pricing.

It seems that us audio producers would be able to get by with the base 8-core unit, wouldn’t you agree? The higher core-count processors are for the video guys in Hollywood at Pixar/Disney and all that stuff, correct? In other words, wouldn’t the base new Mac Pro suffice to still be a blazing machine for our purposes?


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For DP? Oh yes.

I'm kicking butt on an iMac Pro with two 27" LG 4k monitors and a cat on my lap. From a post last week:

A couple days ago, I pulled out the lap piano (ok, Martin calls it a '67 D12-35) for the first time in 12 years to make tracks for one of my church bands. Because my left arm is still paralyzed since 2009, I use a Spider Capo to get the chords I want, then record playing each chord to a separate track that I edit together. Fun, huh? This band will add their own tracks and vocals to the scratch that I've made and the church will hear the final on Palm Sunday. Here's a pic showing a bit of the process:



The mic is my go-to AKG C535, the iPad shows the muted P-Bass VI — I tap on the glass to play. Digital Performer on the iMac Pro with the chart on the left monitor: the pink is Am; the blue is G; the MIDI track is the melody that I use as a guide when recording everything else. The singers and instruments will all be adding tracks — it's possible that none of mine will be left on the final except the 12 — that came out ok.

[greg328]

Mike, very cool set up, thanks for sharing that.


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