I need Subfolders in the Trackwindow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Harry]

I need subfolders in the trackwindow!
If you have many tracks ( 30-40 fe.) you can put for example some sections ( all strings or all drumparts -MIDI and audio etc. ) in different subfolders for a better overview. I know, that Logic and Cubase have this feature since some time.

Logically it should be possible to open and close these folders in the trackwindow.

I would like also the possibility of a vertical Zoom in the Track Window.

Also it should be possible to change the color of the tracks in the V-Rack!

[Tim]

I've been wanting that for years, since I saw it in Cubase!


I think they forgot to have colors in the V-Rack (though I've not checked the manual to find out if there's a way).

I first make my V Rack channels in the tracks window, color them, and then choose Move Selected Tracks To V-Rack from the pull down sequence menu there.

To edit an existing V-Rack, drag the v-rack icon from the Chunks Window into the Tracks Window (where the track names are), edit, Move Selected Tracks To V-Rack (a new one), delete the old v-rack. Crazy, huh?

[alexff]

I want MIDI regions (a la protools) in the sequence editor.
Add a new window called "patchbay" which is as it sounds, then we can delete the tracks window altogether!! Hurah!

(in the voice of darth vader)
I know you want this, MOTU, it is your destiny..(etc)

I've always though DP was more like PT than the other sequencers anyhow, and the tracks window somehow doesn't fit into the DP way of working.

Just my 2 pence.

[Splinter]

I need subfolders in the trackwindow!
If you have many tracks ( 30-40 fe.) you can put for example some sections ( all strings or all drumparts -MIDI and audio etc. ) in different subfolders for a better overview. I know, that Logic and Cubase have this feature since some time.

Logically it should be possible to open and close these folders in the trackwindow.

I would like also the possibility of a vertical Zoom in the Track Window.

You don't NEED it. Get over yourself. You WANT it because you saw it somewhere else. I've never had it and could care less. The Tracks Overview window is just that... for OVERVIEW. It's not an editing window. Just learn to work with DP the way it was designed. It's a great program!

[Splinter]

I want MIDI regions (a la protools) in the sequence editor.
Add a new window called "patchbay" which is as it sounds, then we can delete the tracks window altogether!! Hurah!

(in the voice of darth vader)
I know you want this, MOTU, it is your destiny..(etc)

I've always though DP was more like PT than the other sequencers anyhow, and the tracks window somehow doesn't fit into the DP way of working.

Just my 2 pence.

You obviously haven't worrked with DP for very long. The basic design of DP comes from Performer which existed long before PT was a wet dream. Losing the TO window would be bad news. It is a great central window for handling data on a macro level. If you don't like it, you don't have to use it. I can't think of anything you can only do in the TO window.

[maresz]

remember the equivalent of Tracks Overview window in Studio Vision ?
man, that was something...

I still miss it !

yan

[Spikey Horse]

I need subfolders in the trackwindow!
If you have many tracks ( 30-40 fe.) you can put for example some sections ( all strings or all drumparts -MIDI and audio etc. ) in different subfolders for a better overview......

Isn't 'overview' the operative word here? .... if you start hiding things then it's no longer an overview window..... What I really like about T.O. window is that there is NOWHERE for the tracks to hide! If something is playing when it shouldn't I can find which track it's on straight away unlike the mixer or S.E. where it could be hidden.

Having to scroll down if you have lots of tracks is hardly a chore, seeing as how you can configure all the other windows to hide/show/resize your tracks.

[chrispick]

Isn't 'overview' the operative word here? .... if you start hiding things then it's no longer an overview window..... What I really like about T.O. window is that there is NOWHERE for the tracks to hide! If something is playing when it shouldn't I can find which track it's on straight away unlike the mixer or S.E. where it could be hidden.

Having to scroll down if you have lots of tracks is hardly a chore, seeing as how you can configure all the other windows to hide/show/resize your tracks.

"Overview" is the operative word -- but idea of Track folders isn't to hide things, it's to organize them. In fact, it'd help give things a more structured overview. No more row after row of sundry tracks.

As a composer who uses lots of MIDI and audio when working, I think Track folders would be the best UI improvement DP could offer.

For example, I could store all of my MIDI hi hat, snare, toms, kick and cymbal tracks in a folder labeled "drum kit MIDI." That way, they remain discrete, yet organized and easy to find. I could do the same for "synth VIs" or "aux percussion MIDI" or "string section audio" or whatever.

I can't stress how helpful that'd be.

I mean, what's more familiar and organized than folder hierarchies. It's how OS's have worked forever. It's also how apps like Photoshop or After Effects allow you to sort and label assets (so its an idea hardly confined to audio apps). Anytime you have a lot of files, it helps to organize them into general categories.

To re-emphasize: We're not talking about losing the Tracks window or adding hide/show functionality to it. We're talking about improving it.

[giles117]

Learn to live in the sequence window. I like the tracks window. As we all have resounded OVERVIEW.

Sometimes in the seq window I hide something and forget I have it till I look at the Tracks window. Long Live the TO window.....

[chrispick]

Learn to live in the sequence window. I like the tracks window. As we all have resounded OVERVIEW.

Sometimes in the seq window I hide something and forget I have it till I look at the Tracks window. Long Live the TO window.....

Did you not read my post? Do you not understand the meaning of the word "overview?" It's exactly what I'm talking about. Folders do offer overview -- it's their purpose.

Read my post again.

I'm sorry you lose stuff. You know, the folders concept may help alleviate that. You may never have to hide/show again.

[Spikey Horse]

Although I am happy the way TO is at the moment AFAIAC folders would be fine too because you could always not use them, if people want folders then I'm not certainly not AGAINST them but I'm curious chrispick, how would it work?

...would the folder track show any indication of (combined) data from all its contained tracks in the timeline (even if not editable) or would there be a folder title with no actual data shown in the timeline and then drop down set of normal tracks below (or none when not opened obviously)?

If it was just a folder title and no data display then some sort of MIDI/audio activity indicator would be useful to show when hidden tracks are playing. It could be in the same place as the level indicaor is in normal tracks in the TO.....

Still not really my scene, man.

[alexff]

Ok, ok..

The way I see it:
For the record my route to DP was: Notator, Cubase, Logic, PT to DP.
So I've used them all.

Logic and cubase work kinda the same way. If you're coming to DP from these programs, the tracks overview makes the most sense.

DP works in a similar way to PT. I understand that the original DP was meant as a front end to the PT rig, before digidesign did it themselves.

Those coming from PT to DP, enjoy the sequence edit window.

Now regardless of what we see in other sequencers - what we then want in DP - I do think that the basic MIDI functions of DP could do with a little overhaul. I keep prattling on about MIDI regions to anyone who'll listen, but that's my own belief. Folders could be another solution. I like it, and would use them.

Never used Performer/Studio vision whatever - guys get over it. It's gone.

If you want your drums in groups, tryout the song window: Make a sequence containing only your drum parts then use a DP song to stack up the rest of the arrangement.

Or edit groups maybe?

[chrispick]

Although I am happy the way TO is at the moment AFAIAC folders would be fine too because you could always not use them, if people want folders then I'm not certainly not AGAINST them but I'm curious chrispick, how would it work?

...would the folder track show any indication of (combined) data from all its contained tracks in the timeline (even if not editable) or would there be a folder title with no actual data shown in the timeline and then drop down set of normal tracks below (or none when not opened obviously)?

I prefer the drop-down concept. Something collapsible and analogous to the columns view in the OS.

Using the "drum kit MIDI" idea: You create MIDI tracks for hi-hat, snare, kck, etc. Then, you create a folder and name it "drum kit MIDI," then throw the discrete MID tracks inside it. Contracted, the folder would show the full time range of the MIDI; expanded, it would show the individual tracks and their discrete lengths.

A simple, recognizable sorting technique really.

To consider: Let's say I'm working on an orchestral track for a film. Using a VI like EW Gold, I have different samples for different articulations. If my piece needs strings, I may have anywhere from, say, 5 to 25 MIDI tracks -- and that's only for one instrument section! And it doesn't include the strings VI track or it's outputted audio tracks.

And, usually these jobs require additional instrumentation like human voice, guitars, synths, sound design-like musicality, other live instrumentation, etc. And I haven't even added aux buss tracks.

Soon, I have a Tracks Window that's a really, really long, unsorted laundry list of MIDI, VIs, audio and aux busses. It's no more an overview than, say, laying out all pages of a book vertically and saying it's an overview of the novel.

I suppose if you use DP to record bands and your VI and track count rarely exceeds, say, 24 tracks, then Track Window folders may seem less important. But, if you arrange for film/tv -- and many of us do -- then it'd be a godsend.

FWIW: I've used Logic, Sonar and ProTools to varying degrees, but I started with Performer and am a big DP fan, so I'm not adverse to the workings of the Tracks Window. I just don't think it was "born perfect," and could use some upgrading to accommodate a greater-developed user base.

If it was just a folder title and no data display then some sort of MIDI/audio activity indicator would be useful to show when hidden tracks are playing. It could be in the same place as the level indicaor is in normal tracks in the TO..... Still not really my scene, man.

I agree; a MIDI indicator would be useful in this case.

[Spikey Horse]

OK I see

I use VSL so I know what you mean about large numbers of MIDI tracks and when you get to the stage of bouncing to individual audio tracks too and with reverbs and FX on aux's and sub mixes yes it can get very large - I usually just colour code them and order the tracks for maximum .er..order and name them of course...

Hmmm maybe I'd use folders if they were there.

[alexff]

Me too. Maybe I could grow to love the tracks window.

One of the other major sequencers - cubase or sonar I think - has introduced folders in a recent update too.

Point well made sir.