ANY DP users with Pro Tools experience, I have one question

[hkc116]

So now me correcting someone (so they know why their "solution" is not the answer to my question) is rubbing it in there nose.... nice

The overusage of pronouns statement was not directed to you sdfalk, did you notice that?

You talk about me maligning your character, yet you've done nothing but
that to (almost) everyone else here.

And this is your justification for people taking a thread completely off topic to attack someone's character... Its the old "well you did it first" excuse that children fall back on. If you felt you were disrespected in anyway, there is a mature way to address that without making long rambling posts.
I've done nothing but conduct my conversation in a mature, precise, and clear manner to get to the bottom of my problem and eliminate the unneccessary (which is what needs to be done on a search for a solution).

[sdfalk]

So now me correcting someone (so they know why their "solution" is not the answer to my question) is rubbing it in there nose.... nice

The overusage of pronouns statement was not directed to you sdfalk, did you notice that?

You talk about me maligning your character, yet you've done nothing but
that to (almost) everyone else here.

And this is your justification for people taking a thread completely off topic to attack someone's character... Its the old "well you did it first" excuse that children fall back on. If you felt you were disrespected in anyway, there is a mature way to address that without making long rambling posts.
I've done nothing but conduct my conversation in a mature, precise, and clear manner to get to the bottom of my problem and eliminate the unneccessary (which is what needs to be done on a search for a solution).

...That's rubbing their nose in it, and you're missing the point (again)
As for the overusage of pronouns thing, Of course I noticed it wasn't
directed at me.
I just found it amazingly funny.
As for me falling back on an excuse that "children use"
well fine, if that's how you see it.

"I've done nothing but conduct my conversation in a mature, precise, and clear manner to get to the bottom of my problem and eliminate the unneccessary (which is what needs to be done on a search for a solution)."

okay then, if that's how you see it...(by the way, you're repeating yourself...wait...so am I..DANG!!)

Feel free to continue...
I'm really done now.

[musicarteca]

Going back to topic: KC:

First of all, before I post any example, I check it first and make sure that it works perfectly well, that said, if you re-read the workaround that PJ and I proposed you will realize that it works, maybe you didn't read well, so I am going to repeat myself, but this time step by step and in a practical example. Please go ahead and dissect the examples and explain to me exactly why it doesn't work for you. Yes, I want you to repeat yourself one more time, but this time related to this specific example. I took the time to repeat myself too. Everyone is welcome to follow along, and judge if it works or not. Here it goes:

Example 1:
1- No Memory Play or Link selection to Memory, which means no Pre-roll for you. Please lets assume that for the moment.
2- Click anywhere on the timeline with the letter "i" depressed, an insert point is created. Atention: this is not a selected range, it is a point.
3- On the counter type in the desired location.
4- Press command-period. this will move the insertion point to the counter location.
5- To initiate playback play Control-space bar. Play back will start at the insertion point for as many passes as desired.
6- For a new start location simply repeat from step 3.

Now lets say I have to edit: I make a selection and edit, therefore loosing my insert point. To resume playback, I go back to step 2 and repeat.

Example 2:
1- Memory play and Link Selection to Memory enabled.
2- Repeat from steps 2 to 4 above.
3- Playback using space-bar, playback will start at the insert point for as many passes as needed.

Same comment as above if you want to edit.

Now please explain to me "again" why this works perfectly well for me, but it doesn't work for you. Do you think it takes a long time? Try it out! Go ahead, try it and count the miliseconds.

Now please, if this doesn't work for you, explain then how are you going to resolve this situation. In other words, what are you going to do to continue working using the procedure described on this thread. Give me a solution better and quicker that what I have just described. Please don't answer me that you are going to use QuicKeys, we know that is not a real solution.

[Tim]

I wonder how many times one could hit F1 in the time spent on this thread.

[hkc116]

Just to let you know, I was not intending on posting here again but since you directly posed a question to me here goes....

Example 1)
You start off admitting that there is no pre/post roll option in this configuration, so there's strike 1
Second, you're method has the user holding down the "i" button while clicking in the timeline. I hope you know all this is doing is temporarily selecting the time range tool if it is not already selected.
Two problems are presented with your 3rd step. First of all, what was the point of clicking on the timeline to set an insertion point if right after that you type in the desired location in the counter and move the insertion point to the location you just entered in the transport counter? That makes no sense. Why not just skip the second step entirely?

musicarteca wrote

Atention: this is not a selected range, it is a point.

Exactly, and you know what this means, Audition from selection start will not work at all so there is no work around for the pre-roll option

Now we get to the good stuff.... all the points that show just how much you haven't been listening.

After step 3, your suggestion results in exactly the same problem that I spoke on in my first post.
This is what you said..

musicarteca Wrote

3- On the counter type in the desired location.
4- Press command-period. this will move the insertion point to the counter location.

This is what I said...

However, to keep this functionality working, I have to hit the command "Enter Counter In Memory Start" EVERY TIME that I change my playback location.

The only difference now is, in your suggestion, I am hitting the command "Enter Counter in Selection Start" EVERY TIME that I change my playback location. woo-hoo

"As a result, it is always a 2-step process to change my playback location to achieve proper functionality."

Same exact problem I spoke on in my first post, and repeatedly spoke on throughout this entire thread.

Oh, but its not over yet...

In Example 2, Memory Play and Link Selection to memory are enabled. This sounds familiar...

Hmmm, "repeat from steps 2 to 4 above." In the above situation, you are using command + spacebar to initiate playback from the selection start time. Have we forgotten the bug that is present when Memory Play is enabled, that screws up the Play from selection start command?? Maybe I should quote myself again.

The other configuration I tried that was close but not right was to enable memory play and use the Memory Start and End times as Playback Start and End times (which is what it is configured to do). However, this renders the transport counter completely functionless as anything but a time display because playback is continuously controlled by the Memory Start time field and this proposes 2 problems. 1st, there is no shortcut to edit the Memory Start field (the shortcut to edit the transport counter is Apple+T) so every time I need to adjust my playback location, I have to manually navigate my mouse to the tiny entry field on the control panel.
The second problem with this method is the "Bug" where the command "Play from selection start" does not properly work whenever "Memory Play" is engaged in the control panel. The "Play from selection start" command will only work when the transport is already running. Again, this "bug" only occurs when "Memory Play" is engaged. Upon initially entering the command, playback will begin from the regular Memory Start time and you have to hit the command a 2nd time in order for DP to properly execute the command.

And you want to know another problem with this "example 2"
try this one out.
1)Enter a playback location of bar 10 in the transport counter and use the 2-step command to copy it to your selection start.
2)Now I want to change my playback location so enter bar 8 in the transport counter and use the 2-step command to copy it to your selection start. Now your selection start time is bar 8, but your selection end time is bar 10. And since memory play and link selection to memory is enabled, DP will only play back these 2 bars...
And still it gets better... say I go the extra step, and either make sure that the selection start and end times match, try using a pre-roll right now. DP will play up until your selected playback location and stop. Awesome

You know what. I've really got to hand it to you on this one. You really added something constructive to this topic and shed some new light on me. I mean, its not like you just repeated everything that had already been discussed. Because that would just be proving my point again now wouldn't it?

musicarteca wrote

Now please explain to me "again" why this works perfectly well for me, but it doesn't work for you. You think it takes a long time? Try it out! Go ahead, try it and count the milliseconds.

Here I go repeating myself again. I love it.

"You are use to the 2-step process that I find annoying. You have accustomed yourself to a workound that you should not have to use."
"My optimal workflow will be different from yours and everyone else••™s. "
" You are missing the point entirely of this entire thread! I did not start this thread asking for workflow suggestions.
""I started this thread to find out if there was a way to configure DP's transport to a specification that I feel only makes common sense to have, and I found out that it doesn't. I'm cool, because my question is answered.""

As a recording engineer running sessions for high paying clients, it is all about speed. I can't stress that enough. Say for example, I am zoomed into to a pre-chorus for overdubs. The client says, let me hear the last 4 bars of the guitar solo real quick. I am not going to say, "Ok, Mr. High Paying Client, please wait a moment while I zoom out, click on the timeline, link that to my counter, and begin playback." Please.
Is this economic climate, its all about being able to hold on to your high paying clients and influence them to come back. They are paying hundreds to thousands of dollars an hour (depending on the room) and trust me, every millisecond counts.


musicarteca Wrote

Give me a solution better and quicker that what I have just described.

Your solution is a mess. And most importantly, it was not answering the question that I started this thread for. How's about quoting myself 1 last time
"I started this thread because I thought there could be an option that I hadn't found, to select this method of transport."
""I have said at least 6 times that I now know the answer to the question I came here for and I'm ready and willing to adjust my workflow....
I was done with this issue 2 days ago, but I have to keep repeating myself to people who either won't read my earlier posts, or just aren't listening."

Now it••™s getting to the point where I don't even have to type in new text, I can just quote myself. Oh yeah

[MT]

What an interesting thread.

For what it's worth, hkc116, I read the entire thread, and honestly, I'm not pro enough to understand what you were going for, initially, but I learned a lot in the process. But, considering your technical harshness towards others regarding language, I would suggest that it's precisely pompus of you to scold a self-proclaimed ESL poster for his use of pronouns when you're throwing out Bushisms like "accusational", which isn't a word (here's what you needed). Everyone makes typos, including many found in your posts, but most people are forgiving. Besides, "there" is an adverb, not a pronoun.

I'm just pointing out your mistakes, because I know you can handle it.

I did learn some things about using the transport in layman's terms though, so that's a good thing.

Kool and the Gang.

MT

[musicarteca]

KC:

I am dropping this thread also, I am not going to waste more time dissecting all the nonsense that you wrote on the last post. But don't think that you are going to get away. I want to see your solution whenever you decide to start implementing it. So you better put your expertise where your mouth is and post it. Take your time, we'll be waiting.

[hkc116]

I am dropping this thread also, I am not going to waste more time dissecting all the nonsense..

That••™s great
I completely dissect your "solution" after you asked me to and now all you have to say is "I'm dropping this thread."

That is interesting.
You asked me to prove you wrong, I did. Now all of a sudden, it••™s a waste of time. Why don't you tell me what is so nonsensical about all the points I just made.

Take your time, we'll be waiting.

What's to wait for, I just exposed all the holes in your argument, and you can't say anything about it. You asked me to do it. I, for one, came through when someone asked a question of me. Direct and to the point. Now you want to drop it?...

Convenient

p.s. for you people that have a problem with me asking a person to speak more clear without the heavy use of pronouns, I guess you are just looking for any reason to point the finger at me being the "bad guy." I was not scolding him. If I can't understand someone, then I can't understand them.
Does this look easy to comprehend to you?

When outlining the issue you simply didn't mention this. I derived this from the knowledge of the program. It's true that once it's set it's there. I think you like to work with this setup as a pref, whereas I activate it through the edit window when it's needed.

Now a days, you're a jerk for asking a person to speak with the use of proper nouns if they fail to specificy what the pronouns they are using are in reference to...

[hkc116]

I hope everyone with interest in this thread really pays attention to what happens next.
I planned on leaving this thread alone but musicarteca asked me to prove to him why his "work-around" was not "ideal" for my purpose. I did exactly what he asked me to, very thoroughly.
Now he wants to drop the thread and all of a sudden, its all a waste of time.
Lets see, if he posts again, if it will be making valid points that are on topic or if he (or anyone else here) will revert back to trying to put the focus on my character.
I would think for a while before I responded if I were you musicarteca. I gave you just what you asked for.

[musicarteca]

OK, you pulled me back.

Believe it or not I would also like to see any kind of resolution or beneficial conclusion to this thread.

I am willing to follow along and go deep into details, but only if we agree to respect each other all the way, no ironic remarks or insults, a pure pro to pro on topic discussion.

Since it is a fact that no workaround in DP will suit exactly your needs, I would be willing to suggest some ways that you might adapt your workflow to get the max from DP.

For example you mention the case where you have to quickly playback the last 4 measures of a guitar solo, the way I do it, if I have the 4 measures within my pre-roll range, y just press play, if it is beyond, I just type the corresponding measure number and play, and so on...
I don't use the workaround that I proposed to you, it was designed only for you, unfortunately it is not ideal for your specific purpose and no other workaround will be, so then why don't you just change your workflow? I would be willing to help if you let me.

We keep a respectful discussion and we can go on. Agree?

[mxman1]

I see much harsher rebuttalls on a daily basis in a major New York recording studio over the slightest mistakes that don't even result in any setbacks.

Just had to chime in here.
I've work in most of the major studios in NYC as a client. If we had an assistant with this attitude he/she would be asked to leave. If we had an engineer who treated their assistant this way (with public disrepect) they would be pulled aside and asked to chill out and replaced if it didn't stop. We are music makers and "attitudes" for some of us creative types is just unexceptable. A humble mistake and a polite correction are order of the day. Thinking that harsh rebuttals and the ability to absorb them is somehow praiseworthy........try a kinder gentler approach, you might like it, and surely the people you WANT to work for/with will notice.

Concerning this original question: all these problems are related to the fact that the playback head is also the editing marker. Sonic Solutions had seperate, independent editing markers that made all this moot.

[mastermix]

I have been reading this thread in disbelief.

Reminds me of Peter Steiner's famous cartoon that appeared in The New
Yorker in July 1993:

On the Internet, Nobody Knows You're a Dog

For those of you who have been on the net long enough to remember

Here is a reference:

http://www.unc.edu/depts/jomc/academics/dri/idog.html

Kris..

[chrispick]

Now a days, you're a jerk for asking a person to speak with the use of proper nouns if they fail to specificy what the pronouns they are using are in reference to...

And the grammatical pot calls the kettle black.

Posters on this thread, myself excluded, are trying to help you with your problem, despite it being esoteric and a stultifying bane to you only.

We're not your R&D department. Be grateful anyone even responds to your post. Many of the respondants of your question have gone out of their way to help others with DP questions and problems, time and again. And they've done it for zero recompense.

So, you should be cooler to them.

[Tim]

Here I go repeating myself again. I love it.

No doubt.

[Archer]

I really thought that I'd be done - Little did I know.

Since you bring back an element of one of my posts, you force me to come back to this topic, again.

p.s. for you people that have a problem with me asking a person to speak more clear without the heavy use of pronouns, I guess you are just looking for any reason to point the finger at me being the "bad guy." I was not scolding him. If I can't understand someone, then I can't understand them.
Does this look easy to comprehend to you?
Quote:
When outlining the issue you simply didn't mention this. I derived this from the knowledge of the program. It's true that once it's set it's there. I think you like to work with this setup as a pref, whereas I activate it through the edit window when it's needed.


Now a days, you're a jerk for asking a person to speak with the use of proper nouns if they fail to specificy what the pronouns they are using are in reference to...

The point you mention is partial, because you obmit to include the quote I used prior to writing my comment. Quote that gives a context to my comment. However vague that might have been to you, your understanding led you into the right direction and allowed you to comprehend what I was talking about. Furthermore, in my post I confirmed you did understand. And your responce is a clear proof of that.

If this weren't enough, I clearly stated I am not posting using my mother tongue.

Referring to what had to be my last post: what you call rambling is a polite responce to your insults. Mentioning the overuse of pronouns as an excuse not to give a reply, when I clearly stated I'm not posting using my mother tongue, and you previuosly confirmed you understood, is a convenient way for you not to recognise something that is bound to prove you wrong.

Now, as I really want this to be my last post, I ask you not to include partial quotes of my posts with the intention of using them to your advantage in order to follow a defense line that cannot be sustained. And not to use them as if they were toilet paper to clean up the mess you built yourself.

Thanks in advance.

Best regards