Monitoring and Recording Levels Consistent

crankygnomes · Post by **crankygnomes** » Mon Jan 09, 2012 2:30 pm

I prefer to mix to a stereo track, so I routinely use a stereo buss named MIX; this buss is the output for all tracks and submixes. The output of the Master Fader is MIX; the input of the stereo mix track is MIX, the output is 1-2; the stereo mix track is set to monitor input, and solo exempt.

I use a few plugins on the Master Fader, but can't imagine they enter into the equation. (This includes light compression, but I tested with and without [not just bypass] and got the same results.) There's one FreeG on the Master Fader; there's only a FreeG on the mix track. The settings on both FreeG's are identical and appropriate.

The FreeG on my Master Fader is postfader, and the other FreeG on my mix track is prefader . The levels on the FreeG's match but vary each time I play the tracks / record / play back the mix. Frequently the RMS readings never match. Mostly, but not always, the levels vary less than a dB -- .xx -- but they still vary.

This doesn't appear to be a level-reading-mode issue (pre vs. post, dB vs. dBFS, etc.) or a Sonalksis issue. A fraction of a dB really isn't, in the large scheme of things, that big a deal (though I'm sure many people vehemently disagree). But I'm curious -- is this a DP thing, or a not-know-rudimemtary-digital-audio thing?

Dark Goob · Post by **Dark Goob** » Fri Jan 13, 2012 8:58 am

crankygnomes wrote:
{snip}

I use a few plugins on the Master Fader, but can't imagine they enter into the equation. (This includes light compression, but I tested with and without [not just bypass] and got the same results.)

When you tested it, did you make sure MIX bus had no other channels secretly sending to it that you forgot about? Maybe they looked potted down...?

There's one FreeG on the Master Fader; there's only a FreeG on the mix track. The settings on both FreeG's are identical and appropriate.

Well what are the settings? You say they're "appropriate" but what are they exactly? Make sure of course that both are set to 0db trim, 0db fader, & phase switch off.

The FreeG on my Master Fader is postfader, and the other FreeG on my mix track is prefader .

I assume you mean the "pre" button within the FreeG plug-in itself. That button does not refer to DP's own channel strip fader, just to the fader within FreeG.

The levels on the FreeG's match but vary each time I play the tracks / record / play back the mix. Frequently the RMS readings never match. Mostly, but not always, the levels vary less than a dB -- .xx -- but they still vary.

What do you mean by "match but vary"?

This doesn't appear to be a level-reading-mode issue (pre vs. post, dB vs. dBFS, etc.) or a Sonalksis issue. A fraction of a dB really isn't, in the large scheme of things, that big a deal (though I'm sure many people vehemently disagree). But I'm curious -- is this a DP thing, or a not-know-rudimemtary-digital-audio thing?

Check the stuff I said and see if there's anything you can address. Then we'll re-visit this last question.

crankygnomes · Post by **crankygnomes** » Fri Jan 13, 2012 4:07 pm

Thank you for responding.

Dark Goob wrote: When you tested it, did you make sure MIX bus had no other channels secretly sending to it that you forgot about? Maybe they looked potted down...?

Quadruple+ made sure (though I don't know what you mean by "potted down").

Dark Goob wrote:Well what are the settings? Make sure of course that both are set to 0db trim, 0db fader, & phase switch off.

Default settings. 0dB fader and trim, phase switch off.

Dark Goob wrote:I assume you mean the "pre" button within the FreeG plug-in itself. That button does not refer to DP's own channel strip fader, just to the fader within FreeG.

The pre button on FreeG is off. I mean pre / post fader as per the draggable insert boundry-line.

Dark Goob wrote: What do you mean by "match but vary"?

Sorry, I wasn't very clear. I meant the whole numbers (x.) match, but the decimals (.xx) don't. I'm talking literally one take immediately after the other.

I realize that the FreeG provides more info than, say, MOTU Trim. But I wonder about even the slightest difference in input levels vs. output levels, when plugins or routing don't enter into the equation.

crankygnomes · Post by **crankygnomes** » Fri Jan 13, 2012 10:37 pm

To my knowledge, I did nothing to change the setup. I've always had MOTU Trim and FreeG postfader on the Master Fader; MOTU Trim and FreeG prefader on the stereo MIX track. So now, all the meters match except the FreeG on the Master Fader. I've tried several instances of FreeG, all with the same result.

I was always under the impression (from experience and the manual) that all channels were routed to the Master Fader like a submix. What am I missing? Is this a Sonalksis issue or, as I guessed, a not-know-rudimemtary-DP / digital-audio thing?

I'm happy to use MOTU Trim, the Meter Bridge on all tracks. I'm just curious.

Friggin' genie in my Mac ...

Marc7777 · Post by **Marc7777** » Wed Jan 18, 2012 5:22 pm

I just posted a topic on the "Usage, tips, etc." Section.. maybe it applies to you too.

I do the same thing - route ALL of my tracks/stems to a MIX buss then I have a stereo audio track that has the Input as MIX and output as Out 1-2. lets call it the MASTER Track

I noticed that if you print to THAT Master track, then it doesn't actually reflect the plugs that you put on the MASTER track. and it didn't seem to matter pre-fader or post..

So what I had to do is make an "in-between" Buss. I call it "FNL CMPRS" for Final Compressor. I then make the input of THAT track MIX, output to a new buss called FNL, then I take the MASTER track, set the input to FNL and output to OUT 1-2. Then if I record/print on the MASTER track, it has all the FX/plugs I want to have on it!

Not sure about the FreeG part, but maybe this helps..

crankygnomes · Post by **crankygnomes** » Wed Jan 18, 2012 5:37 pm

Thanks very much, Marc. I'll give your method a try.

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