Audio Express - One person's experience

[Frodo]

He isn't, there aren't any, MLC was the very first one

Ah. My case in point. His plight might not have been fully understood-- but it's turned into "all of this"... so to speak. Hmm.

I think pioneers and guinea pigs and early adopters serve an important purpose around here where MOTU products were concerned.

Forget the input/output thing for a second. MAS plugins went daft and MOTU tech support acknowledged an issue with a particular volume control oversight, intentional or otherwise. There's some valid stuff going here.

Not all interfaces are created equal-- and prices can reflect that. In the midst of all the other noise, I'm seeing some legit concerns here.

Perhaps his particular unit was defective. It's rare, but it can happen. We are on the internet, mind you. If there is any way to find the exceptions to the rules, it will be on a forum like this.

I'm just saying. MLC is not a troll, a newbie, or a basher. He's stepped out in front of a lot of DP and OSX updates before most of us would dare. He agreed to meet me at the DP6 launch-- which is where the whole pancake legend began. The entire motivation was due to some 40+ questions forum members posed of me to ask the MOTU rep. That MLC offered to be there when I got the beat-down, means that there is something resembling care going on.

A respectable amount of what we know about Universal Binary came from MLC's brave first steps. I don't pity da foo, I respect him.

So, if no one else has jumped on the new interface other than MLC, I think that some of what he's saying should be given merit before it's shunned.

Okay-- I would recommend that a grain or two of salt might be required to get the humor behind the tragedy-- but Ren & Stimpy fans would understand where MLC is coming from.

[dcoscina]

I'll let you guys know what I think of mine when it comes in.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

I'll let you guys know what I think of mine when it comes in.

If you don't need (want) to articulate the Mac levels, you'll be fine. Just don't uninstall the AE drivers without backing up your Audio folder (Sys>Lib) and have a copy of the Jan 2010 MIDI drivers handy.

Other than that it seems to be a nice box...

[FutureLegends]

If you don't need (want) to articulate the Mac levels, you'll be fine.

That is, if you don't need to attentuate ALL Mac levels from one place. Which I still have a hard time understanding the need for.
If your main need to do that (lower mac volume) is when working in DP, there should be no problem at all.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

Yes, you've made that point about a dozen times now. We get it.

[dcoscina]

I currently have Apogee Duet and ONE. I'm probably getting rid of the ONE and holding onto the Duet for mobile recording needs. It works very well with Logic and DP and my Mac. I wonder if MIDI also has some issues with DP and the folders since you're on a G5 Quad in OS 10.5.8. Just wondering. I'm on 10.5.7 and perhaps it will run better...

In an ideal world, I'd just get an Ensemble for the IOs but that's over kill on all fronts...and the Audio Express looks like a nice little box.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

The box ran great after the factory reset except for the missing features that I need. As far as the AUDIO and MIDI drivers not working when Uninstall was used, we saw the same EXACT issue when DP went from 5 to 6. The AUDIO drivers changed and were not compatible when a user tried to fall back to the previous version. Understandable, but extremely frustrating to figure out even for seasoned users. Less experienced/savvy users would be forced (or at least instructed by MOTU tech support) to reinstall DP and their entire audio and MIDI systems, if not their entire OS just to replace two very small components (MAS and MIDI bundles). Hello Time Machine!

The other potential problem might be possible conflicts with the MIDI and AUDIO drivers and other devices (such as my MIDI Express 128 going south and the missing plugs on uninstalling).

Forewarned is forearmed...

http://www.motunation.com/forum/viewtop ... le#p240792

http://www.motunation.com/forum/viewtop ... it+Support

[zaratero]

Sorry to jump in so late only to ask the question again.

If I´m getting this correctly, all system audio goes straight to the main outputs in Cuemix. No submix faders, no chance to lower that level but to turn down an output together with whatever else is going to that buss/output. This would be for all MOTU devices using Cuemix.

Well, If that´s the case I´m very surprised as well.

I have to buy a new interface and was thinking a MOTU unit, I´ve had RME for my last two units. This would be a deal breaker for me too. I can´t wrap my head around it.

Only a few years ago "it was compulsory" to run you DAs without attenuation to keep using all your resolution (it still is, maybe not that noticeable).
Then you have to calibrate a room with that setting. Am I supposed to move that calibration or add stages to watch youtube?
Then I´m editing some movie and adding SFX from my library, so every time I want to audition a commercial SFX in Audionfinder or Soundminer I have to reach for my volume control. Can´t I have two different sources coming out from system audio and DP and have them levelled before the output fader?

Please excuse me if I got it all wrong, but that´s what I´m understanding. And MOTU interface users seem to find that regular behaviour. Right?

[AnthonyS]

So far, I think I understand it as the M-Audio could:
1) Have it's output adjusted the same way as a Mac's built in audio i.e via the special buttons on the keyboard
2) Had a universal virtual fader that adjusted the output

Am I correct so far?

No, wrong on both counts, my friend.

1- I don't give a crap about the keyboard buttons, per se. Nothing to do with it.

2- I don't need a universal OUTPUT, I need a universal INPUT or MAC LEVEL adjustment.

Is there a "tearing one's hair out" emoticon? There should be.

Seriously, I understand what it is you're trying to do. Obviously it appears the Audio Express doesn't have that feature.

Has to be something out there other than the FW410 (or MOTU) that does this. Have you tried RME? I know they're a bit on the pricey side....

[MIDI Life Crisis]

If I´m getting this correctly, all system audio goes straight to the main outputs in Cuemix. No submix faders, no chance to lower that level but to turn down an output together with whatever else is going to that buss/output. This would be for all MOTU devices using Cuemix.

Whew! At least a few people get it now. Yes, that is my understanding from the posts.

Is there a "tearing one's hair out" emoticon? There should be.

Seriously, I understand what it is you're trying to do. Obviously it appears the Audio Express doesn't have that feature.

Has to be something out there other than the FW410 (or MOTU) that does this. Have you tried RME? I know they're a bit on the pricey side....

Not much left to pull out, frankly. I'll find what I need and the FW410 is still producing reasonably well for all its faults.

[AnthonyS]

Not much left to pull out, frankly. I'll find what I need and the FW410 is still producing TV and movie scores that the networks and execs are accepting, nay, embracing.

April 3; TCM; 5PM PST; 8PM EST; Fragments (Ignore the current description on UVerse, Dish, etc. It is incorrect.) About 1:12 of original music.[/quote]


LOL! Hey, you gotta stick with what works for you.

[zaratero]

If I´m getting this correctly, all system audio goes straight to the main outputs in Cuemix. No submix faders, no chance to lower that level but to turn down an output together with whatever else is going to that buss/output. This would be for all MOTU devices using Cuemix.

Whew! At least a few people get it now. Yes, that is my understanding from the posts.

Not only understand but fully sympathize. I was going to buy a MOTU card, and I read the whole manual, never realized I would miss this, that´s how basic this seemed to me. I´m not at all saying MOTU devices are not good, I´ve used them for location recording more than once with no issues, but this is rather daunting situation for the studio to me.

How do you MOTU interface users overcome situations like the ones I described before other than grabbing the main volume pot?
Maybe rerouting the first output to an input and then have a system fader?

[FutureLegends]

How do you MOTU interface users overcome situations like the ones I described before other than grabbing the main volume pot?
Maybe rerouting the first output to an input and then have a system fader?

I usually only have one application making sounds at any one time (mostly it's DP). And then I can just lower the Master fader. Or the phones out fader if that's the one that's too loud.

Can you please explain when it's beneficial to lower the volume of all apps at the same time in relation to a live sound coming into the interface? How is your typical workflow when you use that function?

I try to get it, because if it's a good thing, I will send requests to MOTU for it to be incorporated in future versions. But so far I can't grasp why it would be very usefull to me.

[Prime Mover]

Looks like I need to check out CueMix a little more for my 8pre. I'm not seeing any system out fader. I do know that CueMix provides slightly different functions for different units. MkIIIs have effects inserts, AE has the whole tuner thing. I'm getting the feeling that the 8pre is at the bottom of the heap in terms of special functions, so I wouldn't be surprised if I didn't get a system fader. Then again, I'm not even sure where it would go.

[PhireAlly]

Can you please explain when it's beneficial to lower the volume of all apps at the same time in relation to a live sound coming into the interface? How is your typical workflow when you use that function?

I try to get it, because if it's a good thing, I will send requests to MOTU for it to be incorporated in future versions. But so far I can't grasp why it would be very usefull to me.

Hey Folks,
Let me see if I can shed some light on MLC's plight.

Here's how it's useful to me .....

Sometimes I need to sketch a quick vocal for my band, so I'll use the Mac as a playback device for the instrumental track ... using the Mac's preview function.
The audio that's being played back from the Mac shows up on channels 1 & 2 of my Audio Interfaces mixer applet (in this case a Presonus Firestudio).

I then plug a mic into a channel of the audio interface (lets say Channel 3)
Now in the audio interface's mixer, I have individual volume and pan control of the Mac's output as well as the Mic input.

Note that when an audio interface is using core audio, the mac gives up control of its volume functions to the audio interface (assuming that you have set the audio interface as the default output device in the Audio MIDI setup utility).

Using the audio interfaces mixer ... I can route the output from the Mac and the Mic Input to my Digital mixer on separate channels .... I then apply EQ - Compression to the audio coming from the Mac and EQ - Comp - FX to the Mic , essentially "ruff mixing" then recording directly to an external CD burner.

Yep... I sing it live and usually in one or two takes. It's only for studying the arrangement.

This way I don't have to launch DP, then import the audio track, track the vocal, then apply
plugins ...etc
I find this way of working very fast for this scenario.

I used to own an 828 mk2 but the issue of Cuemix not being able to send the Mac's Audio output stream to at least Ch 1 & 2 of its mixer, where one can then adjust volume - panning - routing of all signals that appear in Cuemix, is one of the main reasons I opted to trade in the 828 Mk2 for the Presonus.

I hope I was able to clarify ... at least one possible scenario where not having the function that MLC desires may be useful to some.

Blessings,
PhireAlly