How to Copy Automation between Takes?

[waxman]

Would anyone please tell me how to copy automation from a take to another take...

thanks...

[Kubi]

View Filter automation, copy from one take, then merge into the other.

[Shooshie]

To elaborate on what Kubi said, which is of course, correct: Select the line of automation you want -- all its control points. Then go to the track you want it on, select the automation layer, position your cursor at the beginning (first control point) of the automation-to-be, and COMMAND-M (merge).


Shoosh

[waxman]

Thank you kind gentlemen...

[FMiguelez]

.

Another very similar approach:
Hide anything (VF) you DON't want to copy (SBs, pan, volume, whatever), in a way that you only see what you DO want to copy.
Make a time range selection of the desired time by dragging while pressing "i" along the source track.
Copy.
Click on the target track where you want the stuff copied.
Paste.

Done!

[Phil O]

Another approach - automation snapshots. Anyone using this? I've tried to read the manual and it's all Greek to me. There doesn't seem to be a clear line between TAKING a snapshot and APPLYING a snapshot. I've never used this feature, because the manual is so vague, and when I've tried to use it things just get all messed up. Then again, maybe I just dont get it.

Phil

[FMiguelez]

.

What do you mean by "applying" a Snapshot, Phil?
As far as I know, you just take them for the selected tracks-selected range-selected parameters.

Or are you talking about copying a section's automation and pasting it at another location by the "turn-off" automation trick? That would only work for STATIC automation (no ramps, etc.).

[Phil O]

.

What do you mean by "applying" a Snapshot, Phil?
As far as I know, you just take them for the selected tracks-selected range-selected parameters.

Or are you talking about copying a section's automation and pasting it at another location by the "turn-off" automation trick? That would only work for STATIC automation (no ramps, etc.).

I really guess I'm not getting it. So you take this "snapshot" of the automation, a kind of picture or clipping, I assume...and then what. What the F do you do with it. If you can't apply it to another track or set of tracks, what good is it? I'm totally missing the point of snapshots! A picture of your automation for posterity, perhaps.

Sorry, just re-read the DP manual on this topic and I still don't get it. My frustration is showing. Forgive me if I'm getting off topic.

Phil

[Shooshie]

Another approach - automation snapshots. Anyone using this? I've tried to read the manual and it's all Greek to me. There doesn't seem to be a clear line between TAKING a snapshot and APPLYING a snapshot. I've never used this feature, because the manual is so vague, and when I've tried to use it things just get all messed up. Then again, maybe I just dont get it.

Phil

I know what you mean about that. I started using snapshots for my mixes for various reasons about 10 years ago. Then I went through a spell where I didn't need them. Now I can't remember how to do it for the life of me! I'm going to have to read the manual again and learn it all over. That's what I mean about DP being impossible to know completely; I've forgotten almost as much as I've learned! Thank goodness for that little bit in between learning and forgetting that at least keeps me punching Record and Play.

Fortunately for us both, there's the Tips Sheet. Apparently I still remembered how to do this when I posted this tip:

Category: MIXING
Snapshot Automation for copying effects settings to another location
Works in: Sequence Editor and Mixing Board
Page 706 in manual [794 for DP7 manual]. Follow instructions carefully and you can copy effects settings from one place to another by
1) position playback wiper where you want to copy automation settings,
2) globally disable automation
3) move to new location
4) globally enable automation
5) Be Careful: DO NOT MOVE wiper or budge Transport Counter at this point
6) take automation snapshot
7) snapshot will copy settings as they were in the original location, and apply them at the point where you took the snapshot (new location)
______
[Editor]
--------------------
--------------------

Snapshots are discussed on pages 767, 794, and 751 of the current (DP7) manual.
Hope this helped...

Shooshie

[waxman]

Another approach - automation snapshots. Anyone using this? I've tried to read the manual and it's all Greek to me. There doesn't seem to be a clear line between TAKING a snapshot and APPLYING a snapshot. I've never used this feature, because the manual is so vague, and when I've tried to use it things just get all messed up. Then again, maybe I just dont get it.

Phil

+ 1 that is is why I asked... the snapshot in the manual I don't get either...

I found the easiest for me was just to hide the soundbites in the viewfinder. Add a control point on beat 1 of the automation, copy and merge to the next take. I could not get just the automation to show in the view finder.

[Phil O]

Snapshots are discussed on pages 767, 794, and 751 of the current (DP7) manual.
Hope this helped...

Shooshie

Thanks so much, Shoosh, for trying to explain that. I've read it over several times. Whenever I'm this confused about something, I'm sure it's because there's one key piece of information that I'm missing. I just don't get it. There's something I'm missing that MOTU failed to explain (that seems obvious to most people) that I'm missing. Snapshots makes no sense to me at all. But thanks for trying.

It's kind of like Master faders. When I first got DP, Master Faders Made no sense at all. How can you have an output with no input?? Once I got a mental picture of DP's routing it all made sense, but before that it was just frustrating. There have been several newbie posts regarding DP's Master faders and I can so empathize with them. The manual doesn't explain the routing well , and if you see it, it all makes sense, but if you miss it...

+ 1 that is is why I asked... the snapshot in the manual I don't get either...

I'm still in the dark.

Phil

[FMiguelez]

.

Suppose you want to tweak the EQ for the chorus and verses differently for the Bass drum and Bass guitar.

What you do, is you select a section (a verse) for those 2 tracks and set the EQ the way you like it. You then take a snapshot and it will record your EQ settings for ONLY that section for those tracks.
You then proceed to do the same for the chorus.

Snapshots are great to set a lot of different parameters at the same time.

Another example: suppose you want to have different delay settings for a few measures in a song. First, set the delay the way you want it. After you are happy, apply a snapshot that includes ONLY the plug-in settings. If you want to tweak the delay for another section of the song, turn off automation and set it the way you like. When you are happy, take another snapshot, so those settings will be reflected for that section. Then turn automation on again.

Think of them as "time range presets for any parameter".

I don't know if I'm making any sense

[Phil O]

Suppose you want to tweak the EQ for the chorus and verses differently for the Bass drum and Bass guitar.

Ok.

What you do, is you select a section (a verse) for those 2 tracks and set the EQ the way you like it. You then take a snapshot and it will record your EQ settings for ONLY that section for those tracks.

Ok.

You then proceed to do the same for the chorus.

Wait, forget the chorus. What about the verse? You recorded it and now what? What are you going to do with that recording? Apply it where and how? What's the point of recording that data if you can't "paste"it somewhere?

Another example:

Forget another example. What the F do you do with it after you record it????????????????????

Can you feel my frustration? I'm tryin' here, my friend. I'm really trying, but I'm missing something. I'm really missing something. This makes sense to so many people and I'm just not getting it. I feel so stupid.

Phil

[Shooshie]

Don't worry, Phil. I understand exactly where the "missing info" is. You feel the exact same thing I felt when I first tackled snapshots about 10 or 15 years ago. I remember it clearly. So... first, purge all preconceived notions of "snapshots" from your mind. Now, let me draw you a verbal picture.

I'm going to paint two scenarios.

1) The first assumes you have no automation data. In other words, your automation buttons have been off. You haven't recorded any fader moves or parameter moves of any kind.

• • Now, you've been messing with levels, pans, sends, Trim parameters, EQ parameters, and so forth, and you feel like you've found the perfect starting point for your mix.
  • You'd like to record all of this into automation to make it permanent before you experiment further afield.
  • Your cursor is rewound to 1 | 1 | 000 so that any settings you write will start at the beginning of the sequence.
  • You COULD set all of your tracks automation to "Overwrite" and turn on the Automation Record button, then start and stop your sequence. Basically, everything I just mentioned would now have an automation layer containing one control point extending indefinitely (until you record some other automation that changes it) But doing all this is a lot of work, and if there happened to be any existing automation, and if some of the tracks' automation was set to "Touch," then you might mess up all that you so carefully created.
  • AUTOMATION SNAPSHOT makes all that unnecessary. It does the same thing with one little simple operation -- the snapshot. The cursor is at 1 | 1 | 000. You select all the tracks that you want to apply your settings to, and you choose Snapshot from the Regions Menu (or click the little camera icon), do the dialog box, and it's done. There is now a control point in the automation layers of the Sequence Editor for every parameter that you wanted to set.

Yes, taking a snapshot is the same thing as applying it. Think of all the interface settings you just created -- fader levels, pans, and so forth -- as the subject of your snapshot. You take the snapshot and it PRINTS all that stuff to the automation layers so that it's now permanently recorded. Now you can continue moving faders and messing around, knowing that all you have to do to get back to where you were is to turn on Automation Playback and hit Play. All your faders will jump to the level they were at when you took the snapshot. If you turn off automation and continue to experiment, and let's say you find even better settings, you can take a new snapshot, which will replace the old one providing the cursor is at the same location it was last time.

Ok, now for Scenario #2:

2) You've got existing automation throughout your song, but you've been messing around with the automation off, and you've found better settings for the bridge at bars 32 - 40.

• • Select the tracks which you want to change to your current settings.
  • Position the cursor at bar 32.
  • Set your range in the Selection Range from 32 | 1 | 000 to 40 | 1 | 000
  • Click the Snapshot button
  • Choose the selection range option and finish the dialog box.
  • Now, your bridge contains the new automation settings.

Ok, now that you see how this works, go back to my tip from the Tips Sheet a few posts back and see how you can copy automation settings from one location to another. It's like tricking DP into thinking it's somewhere else by putting automation to sleep while you relocate it. The automation doesn't know you've changed locations or selection ranges until you hit play or move the cursor. So, when you turn on automation, globally, it's still thinking it's back where it was when you put it to sleep [turned off automation, globally]. All your settings are still the same, and will stay that way until you touch something like the cursor, or hit Play. (so don't touch anything yet, ok?) So, when you apply the snapshot, you've just printed your existing settings to the automation layers in the range and tracks to which you wanted to copy the settings. Now, you can play the sequence in the new location, and because you printed those settings with the Snapshot feature, it plays with the copied settings from a previous location.

Compris?

Shooshie

[FMiguelez]

What the F do you do with it after you record it????????????????????
Can you feel my frustration? I'm tryin' here, my friend. I'm really trying, but I'm missing something. I'm really missing something. This makes sense to so many people and I'm just not getting it. I feel so stupid.

My explanations were not very good. Sorry for that, Phil, but the girlfriend was giving me "the look" and had to type in a hurry to finish watching a movie.

What you do with it after recording it is: you become happy! Yes! It works so well and you can save SO MUCH TIME. So, besides being happy, all you have to do is to check your mix. IN CASE you disabled automation, you must re-enable it again, of course. But after you take the snapshot you basically do whatever you would do after you draw automation by hand. After you took the snapshot, you would see:
- The parameters you selected for the snapshot with automated lines reflecting the position for whatever value they had at the point you took it (EQ band 1 with bell filter +3dB, volume line at -4dB, Send 5 at +1, for instance)
- The duration of the automation will reflect whatever your time selection range was (measures 4 to 15, for instance). But there are a few extras that work differently.)
- You should see ONY the tracks you selected being affected by all this (perhaps just a Bass, Snare and piano)

Think of snapshots as capturing whatever mix parameters you want any given moment.

The best way to use this things is to try them out. Just do tests based on what we wrote here. You will be like : AHA! And you will smile

I REALLY want you to completely understand the snapshot concept and how to use it at its best, Phil. Believe me, once you become fully familiar with it, and with all the things you can do with it, and all its parameters, you will not understand how you could live without them.
So please keep asking us questions until it is crystal clear and until you see how you can incorporate it into your workflow. Keep asking until you feel like a "fish in water"