Looking to replace mixer with 3 x 828's and some Euphonix MC

[mr_me]

Hi,

I am wondering if anyone can tell me whether this is feasible. I currently have 2 o1v's, and lots of hardware synths, connected to my computer through an 828 Mk 1, which I have owned for something like 6-7 years, and have been very happy with. One of my mixers is starting to have issues with some of its channels, faders and fx return knobs stopping working, I've had them for about the same time as the 828 and they have been well used. I need to replace them, and I was thinkng I might be able to do this with 3 828 Mk 3's, a Euphonix MC-Control and 1 or two MC-mixes. I need 20 analog channels to connect everything, giving a few channels spare for subsequent additions. What I was thinking was to use the Euphonix surfaces to control the 828's mixing features via the MOTU Cue Mix software for my monitoring, using the effects of the 828 Mk 3's in the same way I currently use the effects on the o1v's before recording, giving the advantage of having the Euphonix kit to mix within Logic after I have recorded.

From what I can gather from the MOTU site (which is a little sparse about the specifics of multiple 828's) this should work, but I cannot figure out the following:

1) How would I connect this up altogether?

2) Would I be able to use all 20 inputs at the same time, for monitoring or for recording?

3) What would my monitor outs be - would there just be a way of having a single stereo pair output from all the 828's?

4) What is the maximum amount of 828's that can be used on one system? I can see myself investing in more hardware, and I do not like patch panel arrangements.

I would be using an 8 core Mac Pro, I do have 2 slots free for additional firewire cards if necessary. And my software is Ableton 7 and Logic Studio, I also have a Powercore Firewire and have been looking at purchasing an SSL Duende but that would be after replacing the mixers.


If this is not a feasible solution, I would appreciate it if someone could point out why, and what other options I may explore. The main reasons this setup would be attractive to me would be having the Euphonix's as multi purpose devices, the space saving this would provide over going for a Mackie DXB, and the features for the price. I have also toyed witht he idea of a decent analog desk, but I just do not have the space in my current studio to do this.

Any other suggestions, please do say so, I am not a superb technician and none of the stores seem able to give me a definitive answer beyond 'yes that sounds good'.

Thanks in advance,

mr_me.



edit: originally put 30 inputs...don't know what I was on about there...will need 20, with a few spare.

[BradLyons]

Totally possible (and Do-Able), but based on what I'm reading..... well let me ask you this.... You said you have lots of hardware synths, which ones? I ask this because I had a MAMMOTH rig years ago that multiple computer systems have easily replaced, such as (3) EMU E4XT Ultra's, (3) Kurzweil K2500's, (4) Roland JV2080's, (2) XV5080's, a Trinity Rack, and several others. Now if we're talking MiniMoogs, Moog Voyagers, Vsynths, that's a different animal. Since youre' on (or will be?) a Mac Pro 8-core, I'd strongly recommend NOT to go with the 828mk3's. Nothing against them, but you're better off looking at something like the MOTU 24I/O CORE SYSTEM. This will give you 24-ins, but the ability to have up to 96-channels of input total with NO latency. The Firewire bus can't handle that. Technically you could also add a 2408mk3 I/O expansion along with an MY16AT 16-ch ADAT card for your 01V and have 24-channels of digital returns. The 01V (or is it the 01V96?) is a GOOD mixer with excellent converters. While it will act as a control surface for Logic, it's NOT a Euphonix box by any means! At this point, I don't believe that the control surfaces has control over Cuemix--but I know that is in the works if it's not done already.

The question is this---HOW good do you want this to sound, and HOW much are you willing to spend to get there? Are you recording using microphones at all? Do you need pres? Why don't you want your 01V's any longer and again, which version of the 01V is it?

[therealbigd]

if you have a mac pro, it really can't hack 3 828s, a powercore AND a duende. the firewire would just slow to non existence. They start getting funny at you on most mac's at about 3 devices.

there's nothing to stop you getting a 24 i/o or 2408, as you have the PCI slots available.

again with PCI, why not get the SSL Duende PCI ? It's cheaper and doesn't require a box.

Also, on the note of the duende, do you want a vintage SSL or modern SSL sound? The duende is modelled off a C-series digital console, the Waves SSL pack is modelled off the G-series analogue. (The Waves pack also doesn't have a track count... but does rely on the Mac's CPU... however an 8-core Mac Pro shouldnt have any issues). The Waves pack was made with co-operation from SSL so its not dodgy SSL-ish sounding stuff, it's just as good and SSL admit it in the duende FAQs...

[monkey man]

I replaced my O2R with 2 24I/Os. I monitor all MIDI via a CueMix pair and employ a small analog desk for DP master bus/CueMix source selection. The desk's direct outs from the first few channels feed a 24I/O for guitar/bass/vocal/acoustic recording.

Oh, and I retained (and am even expanding) my h'ware MIDI rig thanks to this setup; I don't yet trust VIs.

FWIW, I'd go with the 24I/O. Sounds just fine.

[HCMarkus]

The 828mkIII gives you 8 analog line level ins and 16 ADAT ins. If you decide to stick with firewire (and I concurr with the comments regarding avoiding piling on firewire devices) you could get by with a single 828mkIII and two 8-channel preamps, like the 8pre or similar Mackie or Presonus, etc. units, lightpiped right into the 828's ADAT ins. A single 828mkII and CueMix will control all. With the two mic pre's in the 828, you get 26 analog inputs.

[HCMarkus]

PS: VI's rock. Apologies Monkey. With your new machine, you should climb on board the VI express!

[monkey man]

That was the original idea behind the Mac upgrade, Markus, and it makes sense... except that I'll be working on 200 songs (plus whatever I write) for the next few years, and want to avoid glitches and "gotchas" (oh, and redundancies) at all possible cost. I've been worn into the ground troubleshooting already and simply want to make music, even if it means sacrificing quality and flexibility to an extent.

Deep down, I wish I could justify jumping onboard, but experience and my now-obliterated budget would indicate that I'd be risking my neck if I did, at least in the foreseeable future. Thank you for the suggestion, mate.