MIDI in dp vs. other sequencers (opinions?)

toodamnhip · Post by **toodamnhip** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:21 am

rumble wrote:well, like i said they were being used on an amiga in bars & pipes...

here's a curious (free) MIDI plug in i just found:

http://www.mucoder.net/hypercyclic/

does it work in DP and if so , how?..

mhschmieder · Post by **mhschmieder** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:27 am

Shooshie, thanks for that link; it'll help a lot the next time I feel I can spend time with MIDI CC editing. I had gotten pretty far down your example methodology last weekend, but got tripped up when I tried to be too mathematically pure about it (as this is the approach I have taken with my other MIDI CC methodologies). Now that I see your final example curves, I realise that there's no need to be that precise about it, and that it can be a resonably fast approach.

I unfortunately had already lost a lot of time by the time I got to that point, which also shook my confidence a bit, because the plug-ins I was trying to modify simply were not reacting to the MIDI CC's, and as they aren't documented, I was blaming myself for "trying a new tool".

So the next time I try this tool, I won't worry about a precisely uniformly changing curve, and I'll make sure to pick either a hardware or virtual instrument source that I know in advance reacts to the MIDI CC's (you'd be amazed how many soft synths don't document this at all!).

But the main point is that many times all we need is to know there's an answer, to feel motivated to spend the time to learn something. Your tutorials do a great job of helping people get over the inhibition factor, which many of us develop after wasting way too many hours getting nowhere on a particular problem and wondering if we're expecting too much.

I haven't had time to follow the hundred or so DP6 threads, so don't have an awareness of whether this aspect of the app has changed much (if at all). It only matters to me if I am spending too much time accelerating my depth on DP5 as I've been doing lately, as I am now expecting to upgrade to a new computer as soon as Apple releases their next round of updates (which should be no later than September/October). By then, probably the first point release bugfix for DP6 will already be out

.

zed · Post by **zed** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 5:57 am

blue wrote:BTW, that article was for Performer 6, not Digital Performer 6. Must have been written at least 8 or 9 years ago.

That's funny. I'm surprised that article still exists online. Hasn't Performer 6 been discontinued since back in the 1990s? Is anyone still using it?

philbrown · Post by **philbrown** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 6:31 am

Dp's MIDI editing may be wonderful, but I agree with the original poster that DP has plenty of room for some tricked out creative tools like a fully decked out Arpeggiator for example, maybe something along the lines of Reason's new one. DP is way overdue for some new tricks in this dept (MIDI plugs) and not just new VI's. In fact a tricked out arpeggiator and step sequencer could bring new life to existing VI's. Reason is trouncing DP in this dept, IMO.

We sure don't have any MIDI Plugs in DP that look like this:

or this:

I've been asking for a rework of DP's MIDI plugs for years but there's been zero attention paid to it. You can buy plenty of VI's to fill in the gaps of whatever you need but where do you buy MIDI plugs like this?? I end up using Numerology and Reason a lot myself, but would love for DP to incorporate some of these features.

Cheers
Phil

Mr_Clifford · Post by **Mr_Clifford** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 4:12 pm

philbrown wrote: or this:

Well you can do everything the Matrix does directly from the MIDI editor window - and a lot less clunky.

philbrown · Post by **philbrown** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 4:22 pm

Mr_Clifford wrote:
philbrown wrote: or this:

Well you can do everything the Matrix does directly from the MIDI editor window - and a lot less clunky.

Switch patterns on the fly from the qwerty keyboard?
Switch time time divisions on the fly as well as sequence length?
Not to mention the extensive complex routing capability with "Control voltages" via back cabling to various parameters.

I use this in real time improvisationally and play it like an instrument. I don't use it to what you'd do in the MIDI editor window, which I use too. It's Apples and Oranges IMO.

rumble · Post by **rumble** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 4:24 pm

i wish this could be a plugin:

http://www.dacs-audio.com/Distribution/Cycling_74/M.htm

http://createdigitalmusic.com/2007/06/2 ... idi-ready/

philbrown · Post by **philbrown** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 4:33 pm

rumble wrote:i wish this could be a plugin:

http://www.dacs-audio.com/Distribution/Cycling_74/M.htm

http://createdigitalmusic.com/2007/06/2 ... idi-ready/

I don't know about the software itself but that GUI is retro looking in a whole different way than an LA2A faceplate

Seriously though, I really believe there's room for development of some really cool plug-ins on the MIDI side of things and not just VI's if the right people were focused on it and got a little creative.

rumble · Post by **rumble** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 4:58 pm

philbrown wrote:
rumble wrote:i wish this could be a plugin:

http://www.dacs-audio.com/Distribution/Cycling_74/M.htm
http://createdigitalmusic.com/2007/06/2 ... idi-ready/
I don't know about the software itself but that GUI is retro looking in a whole different way than an LA2A faceplate

Seriously though, I really believe there's room for development of some really cool plug-ins on the MIDI side of things and not just VI's if the right people were focused on it and got a little creative.

absolutely.

too bad they didn't update the interface.
i'm still going to get the update though.

judging from hobbit's big thread it sounds like motu has bigger fish to fry than MIDI plugins.

rumble · Post by **rumble** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 5:20 pm

p.s.

m is one of the coolest MIDI apps ever...
there's a demo here:
http://www.cycling74.com/products/M

xx was kind of cool too and is currently being ported to os x.
it could import pictures and turn them into MIDI information:
http://www.uisoftware.com/XX/Xx.html

rumble · Post by **rumble** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 5:26 pm

this may be of interest to some.
it's an oms emulator for os x.

http://www.troikatronix.com/midibridge9x.html

(i just learned about it because it is needed to run xx in classic mode with os x.)

monkey man · Post by **monkey man** » Tue Jul 22, 2008 5:16 am

Phil, I imagine MOTU's a little tired of my screaming for great strides in the areas you mentioned, as well as in the processing department (match EQ, amp/cab sims, tape sat, denoising etc).

I wholeheartedly agree with your view on DP's need for these things.

philbrown · Post by **philbrown** » Tue Jul 22, 2008 6:38 am

monkey man wrote:Phil, I imagine MOTU's a little tired of my screaming for great strides in the areas you mentioned, as well as in the processing department (match EQ, amp/cab sims, tape sat, denoising etc).

I wholeheartedly agree with your view on DP's need for these things.

I guess the reason I harp about it is that I see it relatively simple in terms of programming when you compare it to developing a feature like Polar, or even a Plug like the Leveler. In the case of the arpeggiator, they already have the code in the arpeggiator plug-in, all it would need is a nice GUI face and a couple of other features added. I'm not a programmer but I just can't believe that would be a huge deal.

The other thing I'd like to throw in here is that not everyone uses DP linearly like a recorder. I make a living with DP and do all kind of bread and butter tasks, linear editing, etc but I also like some creative tools for experimental work and just plain fun tools to play with for sound design, etc. I may be in the minority but can't believe MM and I are the only ones who use DP in pretty divergent (hopefully creative) ways. I'm just saying "MOTU, please throw us a bone in this corner of the DP world every couple of years."
That or right-click functionality

monkey man · Post by **monkey man** » Tue Jul 22, 2008 6:47 am

Although it applies more to VIs and FX plugs, that's been my argument too, Phil.

I can't imagine the addition of plugs of any sort being a risky (buggy) proposition.
DP's fundamentals are not required to change in any way.

All we're asking for is some more paintings to hang on the wall, or perhaps more aptly for a hungry monkey, food for the fridge; she's kinda bare looking, and hardly inspirational when I open that door.

FMiguelez · Post by **FMiguelez** » Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:14 am

philbrown wrote: like the Leveler. In the case of the arpeggiator, they already have the code in the arpeggiator plug-in, all it would need is a nice GUI face and a couple of other features added. I'm not a programmer but I just can't believe that would be a huge deal.

Are you serious? Another GUI change, after our warm welcome for DP's GUI change? I don't think MOTU will EVER touch that again