ProVerb

monkey man · Post by **monkey man** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 6:32 am

Pros? Cons? Ins? Outs? Formats?

Please spill the beans, 'Cornies; some of us still have weeks to wait 'till we get DP6.

Eleventh Hour Sound · Post by **Eleventh Hour Sound** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 3:39 pm

monkey man wrote:Pros? Cons? Ins? Outs? Formats?

Please spill the beans, 'Cornies; some of us still have weeks to wait 'till we get DP6.

It seems really nice. The dynamic setting is amazing, allowing things to be very wet yet with nice attacks.

I think just the ProVerb and/or Leveler is worth the upgrade price. I wish registered users could also drop them in DP5.

chrispick · Post by **chrispick** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 5:15 pm

RecordingArts wrote:I think just the ProVerb and/or Leveler is worth the upgrade price.

I agree. Although they won't supplant Altiverb and UAD-1 LA2A for me, they will supplement them very nicely. I like the new plugins quite a bit.

Eleventh Hour Sound · Post by **Eleventh Hour Sound** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 5:54 pm

chrispick wrote:
RecordingArts wrote:I think just the ProVerb and/or Leveler is worth the upgrade price.
I agree. Although they won't supplant Altiverb and UAD-1 LA2A for me, they will supplement them very nicely. I like the new plugins quite a bit.

That leads nicely to my next question

How does the ProVerb compare to AltiVerb?

Shooshie · Post by **Shooshie** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 6:03 pm

So far I haven't been able to use ProVerb. It crashes DP when I open it. I'm sure that will not be the case when I begin work in a file that originates in DP6. This is an old file that actually originated in 1987, then was updated a few times along the way, and now has been expanded greatly in DP 5.13, with audio and everything. So, there may be vestiges of something deadly in this file. Or it may be all the Waves plugins competing with it. But for whatever reason, opening ProVerb for me in THIS file ends up with a crash. I'll have to report back when I start a file in DP6 and try it.

Meanwhile, I don't see it ever replacing Altiverb. Nor will Masterworks Leveler ever replace my Waves L3 MultiMaximizer. But for a free plugin, it does a lot of the same things that the L3 does. Namely... limiting without sounding like it. One wouldn't want or expect some major difference in sound; just a very similar sound. After all, its job is to be true to the music, not change it. That, it does very well.

motuhelper · Post by **motuhelper** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 6:20 pm

I really like the sound of ProVerb...very smooth...easily as good sounding as Altiverb, but doesn't have as many IRs and parameters. To me, it sounds as good as the best plugin reverbs. (In the past, I would use the UAD Plate 140, Altiverb, Powercore VSS, Waves IR1).

The MW Leveler is excellent. Very good for getting tracks like bass and vox
to sit in the track. Glue like, really. MOTU did a great job on this. I have UAD and it's in that league. Don't use as brick-wall limiter...that's not what it's for (like an L3). The Leveler is fat and warm sounding, and barely taxing at all.

chrispick · Post by **chrispick** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 6:29 pm

RecordingArts wrote:How does the ProVerb compare to AltiVerb?

My early take:

Altiverb has a greater representation of real space-depth to my ears. It excels at those subtleties. It also offers more control. ProVerb, on the other hand, has a really nice lushness to it. And its simplicity is probably its virtue.

If you were mixing a pop song, let's say, I could see getting great results using Altiverb to emulation amp and percussion room spaces, then using ProVerb like you would a rackmount unit for conspicuous-effect reverb (i.e., beauty wash stuff).

Man, throw UAD-1 Plate 140 into the mix just for vocals, and you've got a killer verb toolset, I think.

kwiz · Post by **kwiz** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 6:42 pm

chrispick wrote:
RecordingArts wrote:How does the ProVerb compare to AltiVerb?

If you were mixing a pop song, let's say, I could see getting great results using Altiverb to emulation amp and percussion room spaces, then using ProVerb like you would a rackmount unit for conspicuous-effect reverb (i.e., beauty wash stuff).

Man, throw UAD-1 Plate 140 into the mix just for vocals, and you've got a killer verb toolset, I think.

I agree, Proverb has its place and I believe I'll use often enough, but like you stated, that UAD-1 Plate 140 is a killer on vocals.

Eleventh Hour Sound · Post by **Eleventh Hour Sound** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 6:50 pm

Shoosh!!! You got your copy!!! Keep testing and keep writing!!!!

Shooshie wrote:So far I haven't been able to use ProVerb. It crashes DP when I open it. I'm sure that will not be the case when I begin work in a file that originates in DP6. This is an old file that actually originated in 1987, then was updated a few times along the way, and now has been expanded greatly in DP 5.13, with audio and everything. So, there may be vestiges of something deadly in this file. Or it may be all the Waves plugins competing with it. But for whatever reason, opening ProVerb for me in THIS file ends up with a crash. I'll have to report back when I start a file in DP6 and try it.

Meanwhile, I don't see it ever replacing Altiverb. Nor will Masterworks Leveler ever replace my Waves L3 MultiMaximizer. But for a free plugin, it does a lot of the same things that the L3 does. Namely... limiting without sounding like it. One wouldn't want or expect some major difference in sound; just a very similar sound. After all, its job is to be true to the music, not change it. That, it does very well.

twistedtom · Post by **twistedtom** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:34 am

Has any one tried to make their own IR's?

Shooshie · Post by **Shooshie** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 2:17 pm

I have a Debussy piano Prelude (la Cathedrale Engloutie) on which I just tried ProVerb and Altiverb in separate mixes, allowing for a convenient one-toggle A/B between the two mixes. First, a qualifier: I'm quite familiar with Altiverb, and I've got first-rate IR's downloaded and installed for it. Obviously, I'm only barely acquainted with ProVerb. But I chose what should have been some of the better settings and tweaked them as best I could. The difference was huge. Altiverb's sound -- in this situation and setting -- was leagues apart from ProVerb.

Don't take that as a wholesale indictment of ProVerb; there is much to learn. I haven't tried all the IR's that came with it, much less downloaded great sounding ones from elsewhere. I'm sure ProVerb has hidden promise that we just haven't tapped yet, but for those who had hoped it was going to be a one-shot panacea, I'm afraid that -- like most things -- it's going to take some work, and even with that it may not catch up with Altiverb. I was a little shocked at the difference, I have to admit.

So... I think we're going to have to uncover some troves of great IR's. That should be the key. And we should start some kind of a thread where we post the results. This one would do!

Shooshie

Tomrabbit · Post by **Tomrabbit** » Sun Jul 13, 2008 7:14 pm

Thank You, Thank You Shoosh.

Great info here.

My copy will be here tomorrow and I too will play with Altiverb and Proverb.

You are THE Man!!!!

monkey man · Post by **monkey man** » Mon Jul 14, 2008 6:53 am

Thank you, Shooshie.

Sounds like I'll have to download my IR library all over again (the UNIX-executable problem hasn't gone away), but this time I'll not bother to denoise and convert all the files to SDII.
Previously I'd split all the stereo and quad IRs up and renamed them so that all rooms were available in all configs (mono, stereo & quad).
It took me a year to download and edit the files in the hope of being prepared for Altiverb one day, so their "loss" has been a blow.

Your initial report suggests to me that this library will now be more important than ever, partly because I won't have the Altiverb additions, and partly because of your implication that ProVerb may need a little help to shine through the use of decent IRs.
Hopefully this time I can forego any conversions (just what is the full extent of ProVerb's ability to read different formats?), and, having been burned by the OS once already on this, I'll try to resist splitting impulse responses up into mono files and just use them au naturel.

I do hope you discover that PV in fact sounds better than your initial tests imply; I'd love to hear a report from you on a similar comparison, but this time using the same IRs for both plugs.
I realise that Altiverb moved towards a proprietary format after version 4, and that conducting the test might necessitate your resorting to lesser-quality IRs, but this scenario could bear hidden fruit such as indicating the extent to which the plugs themselves "get the most" out of less-than-perfect impulses.
Phew! Glad I managed to spit that out.

Still clinging to the hope that I'll be able to do some serious work with no 3rd party 'verbs (just pop; I'd assume this would be much less demanding than your "field").
I very much hope that comparisons of the aforementioned nature will be presented here. I vote Shooshie to be the first to jump in at the deep end.
Don't worry Shoosh; I'm a good swimmer.

motuhelper · Post by **motuhelper** » Mon Jul 14, 2008 7:28 am

I've been downloading free IRs from links I found at Bigbluelounge.com.
ProVerb sounds as good as Altiverb with the right IRs. Right now I'm comparing a PCM90 IR against the hardware and I'm convinced.

pcm · Post by **pcm** » Mon Jul 14, 2008 7:43 am

motuhelper wrote:I've been downloading free IRs from links I found at Bigbluelounge.com.
ProVerb sounds as good as Altiverb with the right IRs. Right now I'm comparing a PCM90 IR against the hardware and I'm convinced.

Where are the IRs?

Thanks...

MOTUnation.com

ProVerb

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