Suggestions for acoustic guitar for recording?

[Phil O]

Yeah, every time I see a Taylor come into the studio I go mmmm.

Happy Holidays,
Phil

[airtime]

Hey guys, how can you be posting here on the 25th of December? It's only the 24th here at my house!

Wayne

[SixStringGeek]

Hey guys, how can you be posting here on the 25th of December? It's only the 24th here at my house!

Wayne

Santa's time warp. (Hey - there's a name for a band).

[monkey man]

Good call, Geekster:

1) It is a brilliant name for a band,

and

2) The extra-dimensionality of Mr. Claus would in fact explain his ability to carry so many presents as well as the time frame during which said work is completed.

Yup, if you're one dimension "above" our four, you're outside the time domain and are able to attend multiple concerns simultaneously.

[FM]

Are you liking it? Is it recording well?

I'd imagine you'll have best results with mics and pres that don't hype the top end too much - the standard condensers work well with my Guild but I imagine they might cause a Taylor to be a bit shrill. What have your experiences been?

The Taylor is very sparkly - a little better for picking than strumming I think - picked notes seem to have the same volume and presence as whole strummed chords. I find that amazing. It is well balanced across the tonal range though so it isn't a bad strummer, but it wasn't the best strummer either. I gave that award to a Martin. If I had unlimited cash, I'd have got the Martin for strumming and the Taylor for picking.

I've only had time to do one recording session with it but I did try a bunch of things. I have "one good mic" - an original edition Rode NT which I plugged straight into an 828 mk II. It has switchable patterns - cardioid and omni. It happened to have a foam wind screen on it as well.

Initially I felt the sound I was getting was muffled - yanked off the foam wind screen. Much better. Turns out it records much better with omni pattern rather than the cardioid as the latter over-emphasized the mids.

The Taylor body is amazingly "ringy" and moving my strumming hand around in front of the sound hole produces a variety of interesting doppler and filter effects. It can be quite pleasant at times (sort of a built in chorus effect), but can also be annoying. I found I had to strum closer to the bridge to eliminate that.

Finally, I ended up adding an EQ and taking a fair sized cut at about 380Hz to make it sound balanced. I'm new to recording acoustic guitars and I think I have heard that this is common - to take a cut at the guitar body's natural resonant frequency.

Anyhow, having done this, it sounds quite good and I am very happy. Plus, the guitar is a joy to play all on its own. Its a good power ballad guitar, which is what I was looking for.

The thing also comes with the Taylor expression system - I confess I haven't gotten around to plugging it into anything with any clarity.

good stuff!

thanks for posting your impressions, specially about Martin guitars.

recently mine had to be taken to the doctor's. i let it get under moisturized and it developed two cracks. i took it to a very good repair shop (Mandolin Brothers in New York) and they said it will not be a problem to fix it. i have learned my lesson about keeping my guitars properly humidified.

in the meantime i picked a cheaper Yamaha model and i'm not unhappy with it, but it certainly does not reach the same level of expression and subharmonics as the Martin.

cheers!

FM

FM was naughty AND nice.

[ltemma74]

Thanks for the report, six string!

[SixStringGeek]

recently mine had to be taken to the doctor's. i let it get under moisturized and it developed two cracks.

Living in seattle, I don't see that ever being a problem - but I did spring for a humidifier and hygrometer to be safe.

in the meantime i picked a cheaper Yamaha model and i'm not unhappy with it, but it certainly does not reach the same level of expression and subharmonics as the Martin.

Yeah, this high end guitar thing is kind of a curse. Its like being a happy Cuervo drinker for years and suddenly being handed a really high end tequila. That shot of Cuervo is just never gonna do it for you again.

[Spikey Horse]

FM - can I ask what Martin you have that developed cracks ? and where were the cracks ?

I have a Martin D-18v which is the acoustic for me - sounds kind of like Led Zep III - anyway I'm keeping it in quite a dry environment at the moment - now I'm worried

[sdemott]

in general, acoustic guitars should be kept above 45% relative humidity (at room temperature).

Start humidifying when the air gets dry (when you turn your heat on in the fall/winter).

Exposure under 45% RH for even just several hours can begin the drying process. Under 30% (which is typical here in the north east) can crack a guitar in just a few hours.

Older guitars (5+ years) tend to be more stable, as the wood has settled...but can still crack if not properly humidified.

I keep a snake style humidifier in the guitar and a canister style in the case...and always put the guitar in the case when it's not being used. It's much easier to control the RH in a small confined area (the case) than a larger area (a room or a house).

FWIW - Taylor keeps their factory @ 47% RH 68 deg. F, Martin keeps their factory 48% RH 68 deg. F.

[FM]

Yeah, this high end guitar thing is kind of a curse. Its like being a happy Cuervo drinker for years and suddenly being handed a really high end tequila. That shot of Cuervo is just never gonna do it for you again.

FM

[FM]

FM - can I ask what Martin you have that developed cracks ? and where were the cracks ?

I have a Martin D-18v which is the acoustic for me - sounds kind of like Led Zep III - anyway I'm keeping it in quite a dry environment at the moment - now I'm worried

sure.

mine is a 16GTE Premium.

when facing the guitar; one crack pretty was pretty much down front and center, the other one would be coming down from the upper right and it stopped just a bit above the sound hole.

the larger one, the one on the bottom, was a lot more visible and i could see how it was getting worse as time went by.

yeah man... you really have to keep them properly humidified. those snake style humidifiers seem to do the trick and they're not all that expensive.

do you have any samples of your martin?
i'd love to hear it.

i have become quite the martin fan.

peace!

FM

FM is the proud inventor of The Big Shoe Dance.

[matticus]

Whoa! Yeah, that's good info sdemott. Thanks for that. It reminds me I need to start using my humidifier again. Mine's called a "dampit" and is a snake style that I use on my Taylor. By the by, I just recorded my first ever "fo reals" song in DP featuring my Taylor 310ce ltd. I'm going to put it up on the web and list it in the Digital Performer user showcase section. Be looking for it in the next few days and give me feedback. It has "sapele" (from Africa) wood on the sides and back and it has made a huge difference from the regular 310ce which I think had spruce or something. I played both side by side in the guitar shop and it was like night and day. The sapele really seemed to give the top end a sparkle like you were talking about before. If you ever see any guitars with sapele wood, try it out. I think you'll like what you hear.

[sdemott]

Whoa! Yeah, that's good info sdemott. Thanks for that. It reminds me I need to start using my humidifier again. Mine's called a "dampit" and is a snake style that I use on my Taylor. By the by, I just recorded my first ever "fo reals" song in DP featuring my Taylor 310ce ltd. I'm going to put it up on the web and list it in the Digital Performer user showcase section. Be looking for it in the next few days and give me feedback. It has "sapele" (from Africa) wood on the sides and back and it has made a huge difference from the regular 310ce which I think had spruce or something. I played both side by side in the guitar shop and it was like night and day. The sapele really seemed to give the top end a sparkle like you were talking about before. If you ever see any guitars with sapele wood, try it out. I think you'll like what you hear.

Yes the Sapele is a nice wood. For years guitar makers were using it and calling it African Mahogany (it is the African cousin to "true" mahogany). It has many of the properties of mahogany and is easier to come by. "True" mahogany comes from Honduras & is getting harder to obtain as it becomes more scarce. Taylor still uses Honduran Mahogany on the 500 series.

I happen to love Mahogany & Sapele on larger guitars (like your 310). The low end is deep and breathy and the top end is crisp & clean. They record so well you almost don't have to worry about where the mic is.

Looking forward to hearing your tune.

[Spikey Horse]

when facing the guitar; one crack pretty was pretty much down front and center, the other one would be coming down from the upper right and it stopped just a bit above the sound hole.

the larger one, the one on the bottom, was a lot more visible and i could see how it was getting worse as time went by.

yeah man... you really have to keep them properly humidified. those snake style humidifiers seem to do the trick and they're not all that expensive.

do you have any samples of your martin?
i'd love to hear it.

i have become quite the martin fan.

peace!

FM

FM is the proud inventor of The Big Shoe Dance.

Cheers FM - I'm keeping my eye out for any signs of warping / cracking - it's a 'vintage' construction (hence the 'v' in the name) which means less bracing all round .....

I'll try and dig out some recordings ..er ... without singing! - I'd record it now but I'm in between old and new studios at the moment - I'm running all VI's and no real instruments at the moment at home (driving me mental TBH!!!)

[FM]

Cheers FM - I'm keeping my eye out for any signs of warping / cracking - it's a 'vintage' construction (hence the 'v' in the name) which means less bracing all round .....

I'll try and dig out some recordings ..er ... without singing! - I'd record it now but I'm in between old and new studios at the moment - I'm running all VI's and no real instruments at the moment at home (driving me mental TBH!!!)

i hear ya.

lately i have been moving away more and more from virtual instruments myself, to the point that i will do all my next recordings with almost no VI's at all.

as soon as my martin is back i got about a dozen or so songs to record an they will all be very stripped down, a la early Elliott Smith (one the greatest musicians that has ever walked the planet IMHO).

i will report back when ready.

good luck with your studio, mine is just a project studio and every time i have moved it has been a MAJOR pain in the arse.

i look forward to hearing your music.

cheers!

FM

FM is a-rockin' so don't bother knockin'