MIDI Stream Overload !

PeterMcCStrat · Post by **PeterMcCStrat** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 12:02 pm

I know I read this type of issue here before and never had it occur to me.

I usually don't do much MIDI. I have recently been on some projects with maybe 10 MIDI tracks that have CC things like volume - pitch- mod going on.

DP will freak out, no drums for a second, then a big bang of MIDI cluster notes, then playback ok.

WTF with this?

How in the world would a guy score an orchestra with this, If I can't get 10 midii tracks that have CC messages to playback while recording a new part?

it's not the sound card or the MIDI I/O either I've tried several.

Man,.. it's a good thing I don't do too much MIDI I guess,..

Happy 4th

Peter

FMiguelez · Post by **FMiguelez** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 12:58 pm

.

I know what you mean. There are some people here who just suffer with these issues (MIDI bombs, stuck notes, etc.), and I don't think most of them have been able to totally solve the problem or find the culprit.

MIDI in my system runs flawlessly. I've never had these issues. I live on MIDI, dozens and dozens of tracks, no prob. Same with most users, so that kind of rules out DP. It must be some config/hardware problems.

In your case, 10 MIDI tracks should make DP laugh. I mean, it should be nothing for DP. I hope you can solve your MIDI trouble since you never know when you will need it.

Good luck.

mhschmieder · Post by **mhschmieder** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 1:10 pm

Lots and lots of MIDI CC's can choke up some players and some DAW's, but I am noticing that you specifically mention the drums in your post, so the problem may not be as bad as you think.

I often move the drums to the top of my track list so they get prioritised. Once I get around to tracking, I tend to freeze one track at a time rather than play all at once, but certainly you should be able to play all MIDI tracks at once, within reason. Your comments sound like they're describing a "too many MIDI events" scenario though, so if you give your drum tracks priority, there's probably less chance of getting those MIDI hiccups you mention.

If that fails, you might try trimming some of the MIDI CC's or filtering them to thin them out some. Also re-check your work priority and buffer settings, etc. It's easy to forget to change those for tracking vs. playing back vs. overdubbing etc.

misty · Post by **misty** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 1:17 pm

Just curious..
Do you use the "wait" button?
mi

FMiguelez · Post by **FMiguelez** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 1:21 pm

.

Yeah, you can always find ways to work around,, but it is just annoying, and most times impractical. This SHOULD NOT happen at all, especially not with 10 MIDI tracks!!

I use gazillions of controllers, and luckily never had these issues, but the fact is that some users definitely experience this crap. There must be, for these users, some hidden factor that they share. Be it interfaces, settings or something...

I hope you get help with this soon. Perhaps someone has been able to fix this on their system, and can pass along a solution for you.

Don't give up. Good luck.

mhschmieder · Post by **mhschmieder** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 1:45 pm

How about sending your MIDI file to me in PM? I have one of the oldest and most underpowered computers on this forum, so if I am able to run your MIDI file without problems in DP 5.12 on OS 10.4.9, that may save you some time in terms of isolating the component at fault as likely being something other than DP (such as the MIDI interface, for example).

zaster · Post by **zaster** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 2:34 pm

Sometimes I get a MIDI choking the first few times I play a file after opening it. Then after hitting stop and play again a couple of times, it goes away and everything plays smoothly. Don't know why DP does this, as if it's "learning" the file. Just thought I'd throw that out there.

PeterMcCStrat · Post by **PeterMcCStrat** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 2:39 pm

Hey Dudes,
kickin back on the couch,... oh,. my achin' stomach... too much barbecue,
happy 4th....

FWIW,. it's not a big issue for me, I don't usually do that much MIDI, which is why I just now noticed it. but it's happened on my Mac Pro and Powerbook.

It should NOT happen at all, and for the record, the same file has no such issue playing in Nuendo. It certainly is DP, and it's real annoying.

Peter.

sjpc0 · Post by **sjpc0** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 8:14 am

I am experiencing the same issues. With very little going on in my session I am getting "too many MIDI events" alerts and various other aggro. Also I just had one instance of stylus playing 7 MIDI tracks and the system crashed as I tried to do an automatic bass punch in. That was all I had up, stylus and a bass track. I am also thinking that this should be a breeze both for Performer and my computer. I hadn't realized that track placement makes such a big difference. Still it seems that I should be barely touching my cpu with such a minimal set up. Infact in other sessions where albeit I'm running a modestly larger amount of stuff (2 stylus, 1 absynth, one kontakt and a bass) I am maxing the cpu. Is any of this normal. Feeling a bit like kicking something

mhschmieder wrote:Lots and lots of MIDI CC's can choke up some players and some DAW's, but I am noticing that you specifically mention the drums in your post, so the problem may not be as bad as you think.

I often move the drums to the top of my track list so they get prioritised. Once I get around to tracking, I tend to freeze one track at a time rather than play all at once, but certainly you should be able to play all MIDI tracks at once, within reason. Your comments sound like they're describing a "too many MIDI events" scenario though, so if you give your drum tracks priority, there's probably less chance of getting those MIDI hiccups you mention.

If that fails, you might try trimming some of the MIDI CC's or filtering them to thin them out some. Also re-check your work priority and buffer settings, etc. It's easy to forget to change those for tracking vs. playing back vs. overdubbing etc.

PeterMcCStrat · Post by **PeterMcCStrat** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 8:34 am

I fiddled around with the input filters,. that helped a bit, DP can't handle the CC very well, at least on my 2 systems.

PM

zaster · Post by **zaster** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 10:39 am

I've been able to pile on the MIDI tracks (and using lots of CCs) since moving from Powerbook to MBP, so I feel that, if you're on Intel you shouldn't be having such severe limitations. Every time I have something that seems like a MIDI overload issue on this new machine, it turns out to be something else. One recent example of this- I forget that I have a MIDI track record-enabled and while it's playing back my keyboard is still sending mod-wheel data, which conflicts with the modwheel data already on the track and causes a stuttering, crapping-out effect which sounds for all intents and purposes like a MIDI overload. Is it possible you're sending conflicting MIDI messages during playback?

Peter, it would seem that you should be able to do some fairly complex scoring on you MacPro. My MBP is 2.33 GHz and I've had a lot of orchestral voices, 3 Kontakts, Altiverb, with good results. Don't give up on MIDI!

EDIT: One more thing- are your buffers set at least 256 or higher?

PeterMcCStrat · Post by **PeterMcCStrat** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 10:52 am

I dunno,. it seemed to go away when I took some of the CC data out.

I had 2 pads using CC 7- 64 & 1 and a Bass track playing back with no CC data events.

Then I was doing a drum track over and got this wierdness.

I'll deal with it.

thanks

Peter

jstaczek · Post by **jstaczek** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:13 am

My experience is that this is related to the MIDI interface, its drivers and any USB hubs in the way. I am doing orchestral scoring using an MBP running a two dozen instances of VSL. Was using an m-audio lightbridge for one of the MIDI interfaces and it kept choking. Swapped it out for an old FastLane and everything works beautifully.

What MIDI interface are you using? Any hubs in the way? I suspect it's not a DP issue.

One other thing to check. My controller (an A90) will send out MIDI data for multiple zones simultaneously. I accidentally had two zones enabled on it and so was recording TWO sets of MIDI data on every pass. Couldn't see it in the graphic or sequence editors. But the phasing was driving me nuts and I finally tracked it down in the event list. Don't make my mistake!

PeterMcCStrat · Post by **PeterMcCStrat** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:29 am

jstaczek wrote:My experience is that this is related to the MIDI interface, its drivers and any USB hubs in the way. I am doing orchestral scoring using an MBP running a two dozen instances of VSL. Was using an m-audio lightbridge for one of the MIDI interfaces and it kept choking. Swapped it out for an old FastLane and everything works beautifully.

What MIDI interface are you using? Any hubs in the way? I suspect it's not a DP issue.

One other thing to check. My controller (an A90) will send out MIDI data for multiple zones simultaneously. I accidentally had two zones enabled on it and so was recording TWO sets of MIDI data on every pass. Couldn't see it in the graphic or sequence editors. But the phasing was driving me nuts and I finally tracked it down in the event list. Don't make my mistake!

Hi,

All things being equal, Nuendo seems to allow much better MIDI throughput as teh same gear exhibits no MIDI choking running the same files. I beleive it is DP.

I was using no interface at one point, just plugging straight into the Powerbook via usb port either a pad kontroller, a Radium keyboard or a Motif ES.

Peter

sjpc0 · Post by **sjpc0** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 2:09 pm

Since we both are having similar problems and I notice we both are using the RME Fireface 800 could there be an issue with that? Is this a niave question?
AC