UltraLite: Can't Return Computer Out to Mix 1

dkaye · Post by **dkaye** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 12:44 am

Using an UltraLite with CueMix Console 1.5, I've checked "Mix 1 Return Includes Computer Output" but as far as I can tell, it doesn't work. DO I have the wrong idea? I've assigned Mix 1 to Outputs 7-8, but the computer's output audio doesn't appear there.

jrdmcdnld · Post by **jrdmcdnld** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 6:27 am

Question: Are the outputs of your DAW assigned to 7/8? Other than that it should work.

-Jay

dkaye · Post by **dkaye** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 8:28 am

Hi, Jay. I guess I misunderstand the purpose of the "Mix 1 Return..." Option. If I set the computer output to 7/8, then sure: I see output on 7/8, but then I'm not using the "Mix 1 Return..." feature.

My goal is to get output on 7/8 *and* on the Main outs. My thought was that I could do the following:

* Assign computer output to Main L/R
* Enable "Mix 1 Return Includes Computer Output"
* Assign Mix 1 to outputs 7/8
* Hear computer output on both Main L/R and Output 7/8

Bjoillsing · Post by **Bjoillsing** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 8:43 am

I'm not sure of this because I'm not at my Ultralite at moment...
I use output analog 1-2 as as out in DP and then I route those signals "manually" (with cables) to input analog 1-2 on the ultralite and I assign those to for example phones 1-2.

I know this might seem strange but it works when I'm recording up to 6 signals at the same time and want to be able to have an eye on what is going on in the phones.

I know this may not be the thing you asked about but it can give you an other way to look at things, I am not that familiar with CueMix it has just worked with the things I want to do with it.

jrdmcdnld · Post by **jrdmcdnld** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 10:45 am

ok, I'm with you now. Couple different options. Bjoillsing's analog mix return method is perfectly fine. If you wanted to keep everything digital you could use a single lightpipe cable connected to both input and output (a loop) and assign your main mix to s/pdif on toslink (I've even used the s/pdif on coax to accomplish this).

Also, you can use the available aux sends available in DP assigned to analog outs. Personally I would use this method as it does not take up any inputs and allows you to have seperate mixes for each cue mix.

-Jay

jrdmcdnld · Post by **jrdmcdnld** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 10:56 am

....in case you are wondering, can I have the same mix on the aux sends that I have on my main outs and have the channel faders control all output levels? Of course! Simply park all aux sends at unity (by double clicking them) and leave them set on post fader (default). Then, any channel fader move you make will be followed by the aux sends.

Hope that helps.

jrdmcdnld · Post by **jrdmcdnld** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 12:10 pm

apologies! I forgot you are working with the ultralight. You do not have optical connections. forget everything I said. I'm used to working with 828mkII. I still suggest using the aux sends.

fogive my ADHD.

arth · Post by **arth** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 12:54 pm

dkaye: If this is the same option as "Cuemix input includes computer output" in CueMix 3.6, I've never found that it does anything at all, at least not under Windows. Computer output seems to be fed to the CueMix output of bus 1 and never to the CueMix input of any bus no matter whether this is checked or not. (The Mac version might behave differently)

jrdmcdnld · Post by **jrdmcdnld** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 2:07 pm

Maybe I can shed some light on the purpose of "mix 1 includes computer output". With Motu Hardware, it is possible to record mix 1 of your hardware's cuemix. It is used when you want to record the mix that the musician's are hearing during tracking, not to multiply the computers main audio output. For that, you need to use aux sends in your DAW or re-route the main output to other mixes as previously discussed. You can also use this feature to add outboard gear to your session in real time, but that's not what we're discussing.

arth · Post by **arth** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 4:58 pm

I hear what you're saying, but I don't understand it. What you record is the input of a bus, isn't it?
From what I can tell on a PC, whether the "Cuemix input includes computer output" is checked or not, the computer output never gets fed back to the computer input for recording, and always gets fed out on the output selected for bus 1.
Which means that if you use an external recorder, you have to use the output from bus 1 if you want to record the computer's output, and the output on any of the three other buses if you don't. If you record on the computer, you have to loop back the output from bus 1 (which can have every input disabled) into the input of another bus.
In neither case does the "Cuemix input includes computer output" seem to do anything at all.
Is it supposed to take ASIO output and add this to the input mix of the active mixer? It doesn't seem to do so -- at least not on the PC.
I can play a sound file with ASIO while recording the input from analog 3/4 without recording the sound file at all, no matter what the switch is set to. What have I misunderstood here? A step-by-step guide which doesn't depend on a particular DAW that can show the difference between the "on" and "off" setting for "Cuemix input includes computer output" would be welcome, cause I sure don't understand what it's supposed to do, and can't make it make any difference whatsoever.

jrdmcdnld · Post by **jrdmcdnld** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 5:49 pm

your' on the right track, arth. I wish I knew more about the ASIO stuff, but I'ma mac geek.

What you record is the input of a bus, isn't it?

Yes. what you should be able to record using this feature is; the mix buss of mix one of your hardware's internal cue mixer. You MUST have a stereo track in your DAW (with the input labeled "Mix 1") record enabled just like any other audio track you wish to record on. If you have a live signal coming in on say, mic 1, your fader for mic 1 is up on cue mix 1 and your DAW mix is sharing the same output as mix 1 (providing you have "mix one includes computer output" checked) you will record that mix onto a track. solo the stereo "mix 1" track and play it back. You will hear both the newly recorded live signal and whatever DAW mix you sent out with it. If you had the feature unchecked, you will have recorded ONLY the live signal without the DAW mix.

Here's a MOTU link for this, Read the "bounce back" section;

http://www.motu.com/products/motuaudio/ ... ixdsp.html

dkaye · Post by **dkaye** » Fri Nov 24, 2006 8:48 pm

I managed to solve my problem. Bjoillsing really had the right answer. jrdmcdnld suggestions didn't work because there are no Aux busses available on CueMix for the UltraLite. My Main outs are now patched directly into inputs 7/8. Mix 1 now routes inputs 7/8 to outputs 7/8, which now feeds my monitoring system.

So why go to all this trouble? Why not just send the Main outs to the monitors? It's because I now have my outputs available as inputs, which means I can feed them into meters and other analyzers such as Spectre (http://www.audiofile-engineering.com/spectre.php). These tools can't grab OS X outputs, only inputs. It's too bad I have to go from the computer to analog, back to digital and then to analog again, but I'm getting what I need. I could use a splitter off the Main outputs instead of what I'm doing, but it's okay for now. Thanks for everyone's help.

jrdmcdnld · Post by **jrdmcdnld** » Sat Nov 25, 2006 9:17 am

I suggested using aux sends in your DAW software to mult the signal to more than one output, not cuemix - you're right cuemix has no aux sends. ...Just glad you got something that works for you.

Best,
-Jay