Can't get Tap Tempo to work -- suggestions?

lamboguy · Post by **lamboguy** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 8:14 am

Followed the online instructions to fill out my receive sync page:

http://www.playerviolin.com/misc/DSCN0066.JPG

When I go to record on conductor track the play button flashes as if ready, but when I start tapping nothing happens (record button stays on, play keeps flashing)

And when I continue tapping nothing happens -- piece never starts.

Suggestions?

Thanks,

Fred

williemyers · Post by **williemyers** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 8:44 am

Fred,

I had this same problem a while back. Most likely is that DigiPerf is not receiving a "C3 note on" signal from your keyboard. If that's the case, you can tap away all day and it will just sit there. As I recall, I had to mess with the "Sync to Port" settings to get DP to "see" the incoming signal. Mess with it a bit and that might help.

luck,
b myers, composer

lamboguy · Post by **lamboguy** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 9:12 am

williemyers wrote:Fred,

I had this same problem a while back. Most likely is that DigiPerf is not receiving a "C3 note on" signal from your keyboard. If that's the case, you can tap away all day and it will just sit there. As I recall, I had to mess with the "Sync to Port" settings to get DP to "see" the incoming signal. Mess with it a bit and that might help.

luck,
b myers, composer

Thanks B, I just tried every combination of settings in there and nothing makes any difference. Just can't get it to work.

Frodo -- help!!!

I'm stuck again!

Fred

PS: I am seeing the Event note change as I play different notes on my kx88 controller keyboard...so it's certainly getting the incoming data...

williemyers · Post by **williemyers** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:38 pm

Fred

sorry that didn't do it, but there may still be some milage in it....

I noticed that your "MIDI Input Data:SOURCE" selection shows "MicroExpress port #8". Try this....go back to your AudioMidi setup. you mentioned that you are using a Yamaha KX88 keybd, hooked to a MOTU MicroExpress MIDI interface, yes?
In my setup, I am using a Kurxweil Midiboard keybd, hooked up to a MOTU MTPAV interface. When I look at my AudioMidi setup, I have a module (Kurzweil Midiboard) identified as "MBoard" and it is connected to MTPAV port #1. Now, when I look at my DP Tap Tempo window, I *must* show "MBoard" as my "MIDI Input Data:SOURCE" selection. If I choose anything else - even "MTPAV port #1" - I will not get the C3's to initiate Tap Tempo.
So you might want to check that the correct source (your KX88) is indicated in that "SOURCE" selection.

Beyond that, the only thing I can think of is that your KX88 is actually putting out a C4 when you think it's putting out a C3 (Yamaha's often do this)

luck,

b myers, composer

lamboguy · Post by **lamboguy** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:50 pm

Thanks Willie, I'm printing that out and I'll dig into it. It's one of those things, when you know where to look it's a lot easier!

Cheers,

Fred

lamboguy · Post by **lamboguy** » Tue Oct 31, 2006 12:46 pm

Got it working!

That was it, tap tempo wasn't seeing my kx88 -- cuz I had never created a device profile for the kx88. I wasn't seeing "kx88" from the tap tempo (receive sync) window (source)

took some messing around with but finally it started working.

Thanks!

Fred

b2 · Post by b2 » Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:03 pm

interesting- now that you've got tap tempo to work perhaps you'll report on how smoothly it works for you. WHenever I tried it, it created an almost infinite number of tempo changes within 1 bar so much so that it wasn't easy to edit the data. Yes it can create a good retard or more human feel but how to smooth out the data that it generates?

Matcher · Post by **Matcher** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:00 pm

I never got the tempo recording to conductor working, but the tap pad was totally unusable to determine a bpm of a song because it can't calculate the average beats like every other functionable tap pad I've used..unless the one in Sonar has remained unfixed since v4.

spirit · Post by **spirit** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:04 pm

Doesn't record beats only create 1 tempo change event in the conductor track per beat played on the keyboard?
DIdn't there used to be (Dp2.7) a selection that would allow one to tap once per bar? There is this option now for adjust beats, but for tap tempo where would it be?

New feature request- larger duration for tap tempo AND adjust beats- multiple bars (2, 4, 8, 16). When adjusting the tempo map to an existing performance sometimes the existing performance has certain beats that were a little rushed, though the tempo actually is fairly steady. If that rushed beat happens to be the bar then the tempo map is jerky, but if it could be averaged out over 2 or 4 or more bars in many cases it would better represent what tempo the musicians were feeling. Try adjust beats every bar even when the musicians stayed with a click track and one will see an unncessary fluctuaion in tempos that could be avoided by having longer intervals between tempo changes.

One could theoretically add the tempos for several bars, and then divide by the number of bars. But DP doesn't show more than two decimal points of the tempo resolution so this would not be entirely acurate. Replacing the bar by bar tempos with an averaged tempo would probably throw everything out after the section one did tempo averaging on.
This is in addition to all the extra work this entails. So it would be nice to have the compute calculate a tempo between any given exact point A and B exactly so it could be used in the tempo map without moving anything after B.

cyborg haines · Post by **cyborg haines** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:04 pm

After roughly half a day trying to get the same problem solved, i just wanted to post it here, but the solution was already given some moments before.
I am very happy about this forum.
Haines

Spikey Horse · Post by **Spikey Horse** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:59 pm

BTW tap tempo and record beats are two different functions- it seems there is some confusion here. But maybe it's me just not reading this thread properly...

Anyway, as I see it:

Tap tempo is more of a live conducting of DP's tempo. It's not necessarily an editing/arranging feature although you can record the tempo map to conductor track. It is really just syncing DP to a live external source (you banging away via MIDI), which you can record too.

Record beats is more like adjust beats (ie an arranging proceedure) except of course done in real time by tapping via MIDI.

But they are kind of the same in many ways.

spirit wrote: ..... When adjusting the tempo map to an existing performance sometimes the existing performance has certain beats that were a little rushed, though the tempo actually is fairly steady. If that rushed beat happens to be the bar then the tempo map is jerky, but if it could be averaged out over 2 or 4 or more bars in many cases it would better represent what tempo the musicians were feeling. Try adjust beats every bar even when the musicians stayed with a click track and one will see an unncessary fluctuaion in tempos that could be avoided by having longer intervals between tempo changes........

It's funny when recording beats I personally I find a shorter duration for record beats better (crotchets or quavers) so I get those fluctuations recorded more accurately! I then either live with a fluctuating click track or use the adjust beats (move bar line by hand) to iron out those little accelerandos/ritardandos (or even ritenuto!).

TBH I tend to think of a NON fluctuating click track as spooky, but that's just my live drumming way .... of course plenty of times a more fixed tempo is what you need.

I love DP's tempo bending posssibilities and I still don't feel I've got to grips with all that can be done (in a good way) - I usually just muck about until it feels right.