Integrating modular synthesis with Digital Performer 11

[hsg813]

Hi all,

Hopefully this is the right place to ask. I'm a long time DP user (my setup is listed below) and have been getting heavily into modular synthesis (specifically, eurorack). I'm looking for ways to integrate DP into my workflow, and in particular, to use DP to expand my modular system.

Does anyone have experience using DP with eurorack? I know Volta used to exist, and even though it still seems to be for sale, I'm getting conflicting information as to whether it is still supported. I see Ableton has CV Tools, but I'd love there to be a native DP version. Basically, I want to record, manipulate, and transmit control voltages in order to affect my system, preferably live. At the moment, I am using an Expert Sleepers ES-9 interface to send audio and CV into DP11 (CV seems to be recorded as an audio file). If I play back that CV audio file into my eurorack system, I can hear an effect, but I'm not sure what I'm hearing. For example, I can record an LFO to an audio track in DP11. If I play back the LFO recording and route it to a VCA in my rack, I can hear volume change. However, is this a 1-to-1 copy of the original CV signal, or is resolution being lost via this method? Anyone with insight? Is there a way to do this live, wherein which I can route CV into DP, run it through some plugins to futz with it, and then route back out to the eurorack?

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

My setup:

• 2021 M1 Macbook Pro
  Digital Performer 11
  Expert Sleepers ES-9 interface
  MOTU M4 interface(optional)
  Mackie ProFX mixer (optional)
  VCV Rack emulator (optional)
  Voltage Modular emulator (optional)

[bjornln]

Hi,


I'm also setting eurorack stuff up, but I've taken a somewhat different route. I started with an expert sleepers FH-2 that can do MIDI to CV as well as cv to MIDI conversion (there are a few expanders as well if you need more I/O ). This way you can handle everything as MIDI data instead of audio.

When I started with modular, I looked at different ways to handle CV with DP. This was the way I figured it would work best for me.

Best,
/B

[hsg813]

I started with an expert sleepers FH-2 that can do MIDI to CV as well as cv to MIDI conversion (there are a few expanders as well if you need more I/O ). This way you can handle everything as MIDI data instead of audio.

/B

Thanks! It's good to know that there are other DP users in the eurorack community. Seems like it's Ableton or nothing for a lot of wigglers.

I was looking closely at the FH-2, but was worried about the lack of resolution in MIDI versus CV. Are you having any issues in that regard? I also was hoping to be able to integrate VCV Rack or Voltage Modular into my workflow (hoping to save some money with virtual modules); have you tried anything like that? Any sense of whether they can be used simultaneously with DP?

Appreciate you getting back to me. The ES-9 has a ton of promise, but with the user-unfriendly config tool and trouble with CV, I'm starting to think I made the wrong choice. Thanks again!

[darrell]

I'm in the same boat, but with a much slimmer volume of eurorack education. i bought a Behringer System-55 ( i started w/Moog and ARP 2600 back in the 70s) but can't get anywhere with coupling the modules to Mac/DP. There is a module in the 55 collection that does something w/CV and MIDI, but the instructions are slim and the level of eurorack user's sophistication make it hard for me to figure stuff out. i'd like to be part of the DP/eurorack pioneers!

d. adams

[bjornln]

I started with an expert sleepers FH-2 that can do MIDI to CV as well as cv to MIDI conversion (there are a few expanders as well if you need more I/O ). This way you can handle everything as MIDI data instead of audio.

/B

Thanks! It's good to know that there are other DP users in the eurorack community. Seems like it's Ableton or nothing for a lot of wigglers.

I was looking closely at the FH-2, but was worried about the lack of resolution in MIDI versus CV. Are you having any issues in that regard? I also was hoping to be able to integrate VCV Rack or Voltage Modular into my workflow (hoping to save some money with virtual modules); have you tried anything like that? Any sense of whether they can be used simultaneously with DP?

Appreciate you getting back to me. The ES-9 has a ton of promise, but with the user-unfriendly config tool and trouble with CV, I'm starting to think I made the wrong choice. Thanks again!

Well...
There is no such thing as user friendliness in the euroracks, unless you have an engineering degree in electrics.
The thing with Expertsleepers, once you get the idea of how they think, it's really not that complicated. Also. I kind of look at it three ways. I start out with an idea that I need to figure out. It could become an happy accident, that is nowhere near what I set out to do, but I like it. Or. The end result is crap (ans now I know what I never should try to do again).
Regarding resolution....
8 Bit 256
10 Bit 1024
12 Bit 4096
14 Bit 16384
16 Bit 65536
I haven't taken the time to listen if I can hear any stepping or so in the FH-2. But I figured 14-bits should be OK for most situations (may be wrong here).
You mentioned the "unfriendly config tool". Is that the web interface ? If not, you should take a look at it. If it is the "unfriendly config tool", divide and conquer. Figure out one thing that you need to do, and figure it out. when you got it working, save the config (to be able to go back if you need it). Then figure out the next step that you need to do in order to achieve what you want to do. That way you can have a small library of configs that you can use for different situation.

Hang in there, one day you will have figured it out. Or as one of my eurorack colleagues found out. He needed a bigger studio because of all the eurorack stuff that he bought along the way..

Best,
/B

P.S
It seems the notification doesn't work... so there may be some latency in writing back.
D.S

[hsg813]

Well...
There is no such thing as user friendliness in the euroracks, unless you have an engineering degree in electrics.

So true. I came to eurorack from traditional music and synthesis. Ooh boy, has this been a journey!

The thing with Expertsleepers, once you get the idea of how they think, it's really not that complicated. Also. I kind of look at it three ways. I start out with an idea that I need to figure out. It could become an happy accident, that is nowhere near what I set out to do, but I like it. Or. The end result is crap (ans now I know what I never should try to do again).
Regarding resolution....
8 Bit 256
10 Bit 1024
12 Bit 4096
14 Bit 16384
16 Bit 65536
I haven't taken the time to listen if I can hear any stepping or so in the FH-2. But I figured 14-bits should be OK for most situations (may be wrong here).

Good way to look at it. Also, thank you for breaking down the resolution. That does look like it should be fine for a majority of use cases. If I can't get the ES-9 to work, the FH-2 seems like the best next step.

You mentioned the "unfriendly config tool". Is that the web interface ? If not, you should take a look at it. If it is the "unfriendly config tool", divide and conquer. Figure out one thing that you need to do, and figure it out. when you got it working, save the config (to be able to go back if you need it). Then figure out the next step that you need to do in order to achieve what you want to do. That way you can have a small library of configs that you can use for different situation.

Not to get too far away from DP on this thread, but I'm having trouble saving and recalling states via the config tool, so I can't seem to reproduce my work without screenshots. This problem is likely headed for an Expert Sleepers board, however. That being said, I'll certainly try this approach and see where my (almost certain) user error is coming into play.

Bringing it back to DP, do you have any experience integrating VCV Rack or Voltage Modular?

Thanks again for taking the time.

Best,
HG

[hsg813]

I'm in the same boat, but with a much slimmer volume of eurorack education. i bought a Behringer System-55 ( i started w/Moog and ARP 2600 back in the 70s) but can't get anywhere with coupling the modules to Mac/DP. There is a module in the 55 collection that does something w/CV and MIDI, but the instructions are slim and the level of eurorack user's sophistication make it hard for me to figure stuff out. i'd like to be part of the DP/eurorack pioneers!

d. adams

There are dozens of us, dozens!

You don't happen to still have that Arp, do you? That's a dream synth for me. How do you like the system 55? Not to get into the politics of it, but it's hard to hear unbiased stuff about Behringer. A shame about the MIDI interface and the thin documentation, though. It's odd that DP is having issues connecting via MIDI; though I haven't tried the 55, MIDI has always been straightforward in DP for me.

Best of luck!

HG

Edited for bad grammar.

[darrell]

Firstly, I've learned a lot just reading these few posts...thank you.

As to the 2600, never owned one, but had 2 (3?) in an EM lab back at school in the 70s. The teacher at that time was quite a visionary for us being in a backwater 'educational situation.' I have a friend with a real, vintage 2600. He has dragged it out of storage and is using it now. I looked at online prices....how's about $8K?

The System-55 is great for what it is...an emulation of the old Moog. It seems to me, and this is not a put-down or rant, that it can be used for mostly rhythmic stuff, and after seeking out players online I find that appears to be the majority of their compositions. As a result, I'm going to educate myself re modules that are more ethereal and atmospheric...without buying 10 of them to find what I want!

Anyway, thanks for the encouragement, and again am thankful I found a thread for DP/eurorack.

darrell a.

[hsg813]

I looked at online prices....how's about $8K?

Sure, let me just dust off that check book, hah.

The System-55 is great for what it is...an emulation of the old Moog. It seems to me, and this is not a put-down or rant, that it can be used for mostly rhythmic stuff, and after seeking out players online I find that appears to be the majority of their compositions. As a result, I'm going to educate myself re modules that are more ethereal and atmospheric...without buying 10 of them to find what I want!

Don't want to get too off topic on a DP board, but if you haven't already, I highly recommend posting any potential rack on Modulargrid for the locals to critique before you buy. It was a huge stepping stone for me and really refocused my thinking about modular.

Anyway, thanks for the encouragement, and again am thankful I found a thread for DP/eurorack.

My pleasure! If you have any Eurorack specific questions you can send me a message, happy to chat about it.