New Black Mac Pro vs last Gen

[Chris T]

I think I'm in need of a new Mac Pro. My dilemma is: do I wait (indefinitely) for the New Trashcan MacPro or do I go with a (tried and tested) last gen 12-Core machine (hopefully get a refurb one from Apple).

I'm skeptical about the new Trachcan Mac since it's brand new and there are ALWAYS issues with the first models in a new series. (My 2,1 mac has always had some funky issues - notably PCI slots etc, so I had vowed to avoid early models in future).

I really need the power boost since I run the following:

My workhorse is a 2007 8-Core (dual 4) Mac Pro with 28GB of RAM. I run DP 8.05 (64bit). Memory therefore is not my problem: my issue is running out of processor power when on heavy projects (which is often). I'm still running OS10.6.8, and of course will upgrade to the latest OS once I get the new system.

I have 2 external Mac Minis running dozens of Kontakt plugins in 3 or 4 VEP instances on each machine. One MM is Strings, Kbds and Keyd Perc, the other is all Brass/Wind. My sample libraries are Cinesamples, Cinematic Strings etc. and Giga sounds in GPlayer. MIDI and Audio go over the network. I print audio back onto my main Mac Pro. In addition I use 2 power PCs - one runs East-West Symphonic Gold and Symphopbia, the other is all percussion (CineS, Stormdrum etc).

There is a large audio throughput into my Mac (MANY audio tracks and Aux busses for printing/monitoring). Also, the multiple VEP Event Input plugins on my Mac Pro, in addition to the several different Altiverb instances (for simultaneous mix stemming) and multiple Kontakt, RMX and Omnisphere players loaded in DP have made my system sluggish and unstable. Even after putting my Buffers at 1024 I get a lot of audio crackles, implying that my processor is being seriously taxed. (I used to mostly run Kontakt and Omni on VE PRo on the same Mac, but it caused similar problems).

My question for the Mac Pro users out there is:

Will I see a SIGNIFICANT IMPROVEMENT in computer performance (stability / speed etc) if I migrate to a last-generation mac Pro (12 core), with the same amnt of RAM, or should I hold out and wait(?) for the even "faster" Mac Trashcan, (though currently of unkown stability?....).

Your thoughts/opinions would be much appreciated!

[MIDI Life Crisis]

My guess is even a later model 8 core running Mavericks with plenty of RAM and DP in 64 bit would be a substantial improvement.

I've heard of some issues with 12 core machines. OTOH if you can afford the new MP I think that would be a best case - at least IMO. My 2008 8-core is plenty capable but I'm not a fan of 100s of tracks even in orchestral mock ups. I do pretty dense audio from time to time both with and sans MIDI and my 3.2 gHz CPU has been quite happy.

[Kubi]

On my MacPro 3,1 I found you get quite some improvement by going to OS10.8 Using an SSD as a main system drive also made things a lot quicker for me, but probably not in your case?

No idea re. the new MacPro vs the last gen.

Big setup you run there.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

A MP running DP AND Bidule with a lot of RAM should scream for ya, and you'll get a lot more bang for your buck on a used machine, even a more recent one.

Still, I love the specs on the new macs, just not the presumptive prices.

(Fixed: I didn't mean a "Mo" running DP... <sigh> but that's a pretty funny typo.)

[Kubi]

Looks like they drop tomorrow?

http://online.wsj.com/article/PR-CO-201 ... 05653.html

[BKK-OZ]

Looks like they drop tomorrow?
http://online.wsj.com/article/PR-CO-201 ... 05653.html

It's already 'tomorrow' here in the land of Oz, but our Apple store still says 'coming in December'. hmph.

[Chris T]

I've heard of some issues with 12 core machines.

Any idea what issues?… Is this a reason to avoid the 12-core altogether?...

[MIDI Life Crisis]

I'll have to ask, but at least one friend was having issues with DP and possible Finale on a new 12 core. It might have been his system, but I recall him using large orchestral templates and lots of large-ish VIs. I'll try to find the email.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

Not finding the message. I may have deleted it. I didn't see anything on the www about NOT buying a 12 core over an 8 or 6 core so I will assume it was a problem on his system specifically.

[Chris T]

OK Thanks MLC.

Any others with experience of big orch/synth templates on 12-core machines vs old 8-cores?...

[billf]

OK Thanks MLC.

Any others with experience of big orch/synth templates on 12-core machines vs old 8-cores?…

I opted to grab a 12 core just before Apple took them off the market. I haven't had the 12 core for long, but so far so good with handling NI stuff, MachFive, etc.

[mikehalloran]

The only thing in the refurb store at the moment are 12 cores. Three models yesterday, one today.

http://store.apple.com/us/browse/home/specialdeals/mac

As to which is better? Better for whom? If you are heavily invested in PCIe, no question, it's the older tower. If not and price isn't an issue, it will be the newer one.

The pre-release scores are meaningless, IMO. None of them are taking TB-2 peripherals into account.

Is the Mac Pro even necessary for DP? Not really for many users. Those using large numbers of VIs, multiple instances of Omnisphere, many tracks will need an MP, new or old.

I've been fine with an iMac i7. In fact, DP 8 64bit is far better than DP 7 32bit on my machine. My need for an upgrade this year has to do with my other computing needs, not DP. I may or may not spring for another iMac but MPros, new or old are among my choices.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

Keep in mind that many also do video and graphics. Photoshop or FCX running on a multicore machine can be a beautiful thing. For me, it ain't just DP I use often.

[HCMarkus]

Keep in mind that many also do video and graphics. Photoshop or FCX running on a multicore machine can be a beautiful thing. For me, it ain't just DP I use often.

Not so sure about Photoshop, but FCX will likely scream on the nMP. But for DP? Improved performance, I'm sure, but not incredibly so with the CPU, not GPUs, carrying the processing burden.

[Chris T]

This is somewhat off topic, but still relevant to this thread: I was just talking to a friend who switched from Logic to Cubase. He said that he was able to run 12 or so instances of Altiverb (to do stem mixing) on his Mac Pro (8 core) with no problems.

Is anyone able to do his in DP8 ? I know once I go over 3 or 4 instances, when I have several other VIs loaded (e.g. Kontakt, RMX etc), my system just can't handle it. I get audio breakups, crashes etc. I know that with NO other VIs or plugs loaded, DP on my system can't handle more than half a dozen or so Altiverbs.

From his experience, it seems as though Cubase is handling the heavy DSP much better than DP. Would I be correct in assuming this? Anyone with experience of both Cubase and DP (latest versions) ?…