Mach5 vs Kontakt...

grimepoch · Post by **grimepoch** » Wed Apr 12, 2006 9:17 am

I own Mach5, bought it about a year ago, but don't use it very often. When I do use it, it works amazingly well, I have been very happy with what I can do when I do need to create my own samples, which admittadly I don't do as often as I thought I would.

My dissapointment with Mach5 is not with the software, at all, but the lack of libraries available for it. Sure, I could go and buy other sampler libraries and use them with Mach5, I just feel there should be some better stuff to use with it out of the box.

Insert Kontakt. I downloaded the demo. It's okay, the interface to me is not as nice as Mach5 (personal preference I am sure), but for the type of music I do, there is like 15 Gig of sounds that come with it. I listened to some of the material in the demo and it wasn't bad.

What do others think? Should I run both? Is there some magical place selling Mach5 samples that are built for Mach5 I didn't know about?

Now, with Nanosampler coming with DP5, I see myself using Mach5 less and less. I don't regret buying it, as it does exactly what it was supposed to, I just feel a lack of inspiration having very little in sound banks for it.

Thoughts?

homebilly · Post by **homebilly** » Wed Apr 12, 2006 9:27 am

mach V rocks. just look around for some libs to convert it's worth the effort.
K2's interface isn't anywhere as elegant as M5s. i use them both but only using K2 until M5II makes it out the door.

I have converted Dan dean, SAM Brass, SAM True strike, Origins, Giovani, Diva, miroslav (from my sample cell days), all of the sample cell stuff and tons of drum loops/samples.

the only thing that is problematic in M5 as it is now is that it doesn't convert the keyswitches etc. of those libs that use them. that's the only reason that i use k2 for my LPC sample set. i think that M5II will solve those problems. I hope!!!

I kan't stand the K2 interface or the logic behind getting to the sounds. the main window is ugly and funky IMO.
ron

grimepoch · Post by **grimepoch** » Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:38 am

I certainly agree about the interface, it's certainly not the best (at least from the demo).

Let me ask you two questions then:

1. I saw in Kontakt some sequence based samples, or arps. I thought that was a pretty nice feature. Can I do that with Mach5? Or would I just use the MIDI ARP plugs in my host (in this case DP).

2. What would be a good sample library for drum sounds that are more dance oriented. Specifically, I want good snares, good rides and a plethera of cymbols. This seems to be where my current selection lacks.

(The effects in Mach 5 just plain rock)

If I can get a good sample set that has lots of drum patches, I think I'd be more inclined to stop looking at other things. I just honestly don't know where to find that stuff. I have bought sample CDs only to get loops mostly. I do not want loops of drums at all.

thoughts?

chrispick · Post by **chrispick** » Wed Apr 12, 2006 12:48 pm

grimepoch wrote:What would be a good sample library for drum sounds that are more dance oriented. Specifically, I want good snares, good rides and a plethera of cymbols. This seems to be where my current selection lacks.

(The effects in Mach 5 just plain rock)

If I can get a good sample set that has lots of drum patches, I think I'd be more inclined to stop looking at other things. I just honestly don't know where to find that stuff. I have bought sample CDs only to get loops mostly. I do not want loops of drums at all.

thoughts?

Have you looked into drum-specific VIs like Stylus RMX, NI Battery or fxpansion GURU? All of these choices offer numerous one-hits that can be used for dance/electronic music.

Another choice might be Reason. That's what I use for much of my electronic drum sounds. Of course, it also comes with lots of other goodies (e.g., synths, effects and whatnot). Reason sounds can take a little doctoring to spice up right, but the app is really flexible and simple to use.

Just throwing out some suggestions.

IMO the current MachFive doesn't ship with great drum sounds for dance music.

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Wed Apr 12, 2006 2:31 pm

grimepoch--

Check out the MacFive poll thread-- on the last pages, some K2 uses have posted very interesting comments. Some people hate the interface while others love its functionality. Both M5 and K2 have lots to recommend-- and both apps will do things the other will not. I understand that M5's handling of certain sample import functions (like keymaps) is not quite up to snuff. Since M5 format is not one of the more widely supported formats, this becomes an important caveat.

I may get both, but I'm also waiting to hear more about M5 v.2, news of which is oddly quiet.

homebilly · Post by **homebilly** » Wed Apr 12, 2006 3:09 pm

wait until M5II. it's supposed to do a lot of things. many ripped off from K2 and RMX.

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:24 pm

homebilly wrote:wait until M5II. it's supposed to do a lot of things. many ripped off from K2 and RMX.

Hey Homebilly-- can you expound? I've been salivating for more info on M5 v2 for months...

homebilly · Post by **homebilly** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 7:45 am

when i was in paris a few months back i visited the place where all the action has been happening. i was told that MVII would do things that RMX does (x 10) and that it was taking so long because when K2 came out with new features they wanted to do similar things to compete. i'm ok with the wait if it indeed does all of that. i have been using the demo of K2 during this holding pattern. i got Translator. i (unfortunately) borrowed a PC to do my translations to go from whatever to K2 etc....

i don't have specifics since the dude wouldn't show me anything but he did sound really positive and confirmed a lot of what i had been hearing. i bought a 2nd copy of mach V so that i could do the free upgrade thing when it finally hits. i loves me the mach V. i kan't stand the way you have to nagigate folders in K2. it is so UN mac like. Independence and the new VSL VI navigate the same funky PC way and i hate it!!!!

me loves the sideways triangles and drop down menus. it's much neater.

i hope that helps.

mhschmieder · Post by **mhschmieder** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:46 pm

Having recently downloaded and evaluated demos for most of the Native Instruments stuff, I have to say that I'm overall disappointed in their interfaces. They ARE getting better, but I have to use the help pages frequently as the logic flow is counter-intuitive (to me, at least).

In cases where another vendor makes a similar app (such as Arturia, or MOTU), I find myself much more at ease with where/how to find sounds and features in the other products vs. NI's.

The only NI product that I definitely plan to buy (once I can afford it) is FM7. Even with that, Rob Papen's "Blue" may get to the point where it can import/export legacy DX7-family libraries and hence become more useful.

Unfortunately my demo to Guitar Rig 2 ran out before my final effort last night at getting it to do something (I never succeeded in getting any sound out of it, even if I turned off my MOTU interface and tried to get it to use the internal sound of my iMac).

In all three cases (MOTU, Arturia, NI), there seems to be an underlying engine and/or framework that supports most if not all of the apps. Having experience with MOTU Symphonic Instrument, and being impressed by the interfaces to Mach Five and the upcoming DP 5 and MOTU Ethno Instrument, I am leaning more towards Mach Five v2 vs. Kontakt 2.

Someone told me Kontakt 2 is easier to use with existing libraries, and Mach Five is easier to use for creating your own. Then I suppose with MacIntel slowly erasing the boundaries between mac-only and Windows-only apps, one should also consider E-Mu's products.

chrispick · Post by **chrispick** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 2:00 pm

mhschmieder wrote:Having recently downloaded and evaluated demos for most of the Native Instruments stuff, I have to say that I'm overall disappointed in their interfaces. They ARE getting better, but I have to use the help pages frequently as the logic flow is counter-intuitive (to me, at least).

As great as NI apps can sound is as bad as some of their interfaces are. My god, is there anything as ugly and impenetratable as Absynth? And yet it sounds great.

The only NI product that I definitely plan to buy (once I can afford it) is FM7. Even with that, Rob Papen's "Blue" may get to the point where it can import/export legacy DX7-family libraries and hence become more useful.

Both Blue and FM7 are great. If you really want those old DX7 sound though, FM7 is hard to beat.

Having experience with MOTU Symphonic Instrument, and being impressed by the interfaces to Mach Five and the upcoming DP 5 and MOTU Ethno Instrument, I am leaning more towards Mach Five v2 vs. Kontakt 2.

Am I the only one who thinks MOTU Ethno's UI is sinfully ugly? It appears to be easy to get around on, yeah, but it's so sci-fi baroque and over-designed. The new DP 5 VI interfaces look so simple, clean and intuitive in comparison.

Anyway, the wait for M5 2 has already been a long one since it was announced. Just bear that in mind.

grimepoch · Post by **grimepoch** » Fri Apr 14, 2006 2:07 pm

I didn't think Reaktor5 was that horribly layed out, it just takes up too much CPU

And yeah, Absynth is ugly, there is just no other way to describe that app.

I think my biggest problem as I stated is I just need to do some more research. I want a good set of dance drums sounds, or at least, a wide range of drums, and I just don't have that at the moment. I will be sticking with Mach5 for sure in the long run

As for Blue, I really didn't like the sound of it.

As for FM7, well I own a real TX802 so I just use that

After playing with Logic Express for the last hour I can say, damn, talk about going around the world to get to your kitchen.

dehmlow · Post by **dehmlow** » Mon Apr 17, 2006 1:35 pm

going back to original idea...have you checked out the Plugsound Box (6 volumes)...I got it awhile back...converted all the sounds to Machfive .dat file (they also load up as individual virtual instruments, but I never even used them in that way) and it's quite a nice all around set of samples i thought...very nice, crisp sound quality...one volume is dedicated specifically to drums and construction kits...just a thought

grimepoch · Post by **grimepoch** » Mon Apr 17, 2006 1:48 pm

I have not, link handy? I'd be sure to check it out!

Frodo · Post by **Frodo** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 4:40 pm

http://www.usbsounds.com/usb/exec/plugsoundbox

matwell · Post by **matwell** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 5:40 pm

I own both, and my vote is for MachFive. Overall, I use MachFive for everything except Giga-converted files. For some reason, I was never able to get Giga-files (especially with layers, and release triggers) to convert properly. Each layer and release trigger always ended up as it's own, separate preset in MachFive!? So, I'm using Kontakt for all my Giga-converted files, and MachFive for everything else.

Also, I love MachFive's GUI. Kontakt just seems so PC-ish to me. It's not very intuitive when it comes to editing, although it is powerful.