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James Steele wrote:Might very well be, but doesn't really matter to me as I want to use DP 6.01, not another DAW.

Even thinking about returning to Logic now makes me feel very uneasy. I want to use DP – and 6 in particular.
I don’t think the downgrade to Tiger would make much difference to making music. DP doesn’t work well with Spaces anyway as Shooshie has already posted.
It’s just the reinstall of all those plug-ins …. !

It may need to decide not to see that D.P. and look around!
I understand that some can not go back but anyway?

I have spoken in depth about these issues with MOTU and Native Instruments. It is definitely a PPC/Leopard/DP6 issue, both companies agree on that.

Unfortunately I would have to place blame on MOTU. NI plugs work beautifully as AU's in other softwares. MOTU changed the way AU instruments and plugs are handled and did not do their homework when making changes. MOTU needs to fix this or NI needs to release updates to compensate for MOTU's mistake. The only solutions to this are to either go back to Tiger, buy an intel machine, go back to 5.13, or wait it out.

OK, thanks ; I understand better _

If K2 was initiated in DP5, the session can open successfully in DP6.0.1. And K2 will work, but you can't open the plug in window [with out a crash].

chaim wrote:If K2 was initiated in DP5, the session can open successfully in DP6.0.1. And K2 will work, but you can't open the plug in window [with out a crash].

Right... well that's good to know. Still... doesn't help too much unfortunately. I'm reading up right now to figure out how much pain is in store to move back to Tiger.

My experience w/DP6 has been flawless so far, including with Kontakt 3, Reaktor 5 and Absynth 4, Waves. etc.
From everything i've read here, i conclude that that is due to the fact that:
- i did not switch to DP6 until i went to an Intel machine (MacPro);
- nor did i install 10.5 on my prior machine (2x G5).

My philosophy with this stuff is always to try to be "in the big room," or "on the broad path". I.e., in an ideal world DP6 would be released in a timely way working perfectly on every Mac model made in the last 6 years. In fact, developers always have to make time/resource related choices. From that vantage point, you can predict that a release like 6.0, is going to be future-oriented - i.e. it's going to be the most stable the earliest on the CPUs that they project people will be buying from the recent past through the predictable future - Intel macs. That's a simple practical calculation made based on available developer time and resources. Yes, of course, they will no doubt do their very best to get DP6 stable on G5s under 10.5.4 etc. But that could not have been (and clearly wasn't) their very first priority.

All this means that, if I had needed to wait a while before going to Intel, I would have stayed with 10.4.11 and DP 5.13, a combination which is mature and had its full measure of developer attention, in order to secure maximum glitch avoidance.

jloeb wrote:All this means that, if I had needed to wait a while before going to Intel, I would have stayed with 10.4.11 and DP 5.13, a combination which is mature and had its full measure of developer attention, in order to secure maximum glitch avoidance.

Yes... and with the benefit of 20/20 hindsight I see this as well. Although, my hunch is that 6.01 on a PPC machine running 10.4.11 is probably pretty cool. Although I haven't mustered up the courage to pull the trigger on an "Archive and Install" as I'm not sure just what gets replaced and how much headache it will be to reauthorize any plugs that may need it.

jloeb wrote:My experience w/DP6 has been flawless so far, including with Kontakt 3, Reaktor 5 and Absynth 4, Waves. etc.
From everything i've read here, i conclude that that is due to the fact that:
- i did not switch to DP6 until i went to an Intel machine (MacPro);
- nor did i install 10.5 on my prior machine (2x G5).

My philosophy with this stuff is always to try to be "in the big room," or "on the broad path". I.e., in an ideal world DP6 would be released in a timely way working perfectly on every Mac model made in the last 6 years. In fact, developers always have to make time/resource related choices. From that vantage point, you can predict that a release like 6.0, is going to be future-oriented - i.e. it's going to be the most stable the earliest on the CPUs that they project people will be buying from the recent past through the predictable future - Intel macs. That's a simple practical calculation made based on available developer time and resources. Yes, of course, they will no doubt do their very best to get DP6 stable on G5s under 10.5.4 etc. But that could not have been (and clearly wasn't) their very first priority.

All this means that, if I had needed to wait a while before going to Intel, I would have stayed with 10.4.11 and DP 5.13, a combination which is mature and had its full measure of developer attention, in order to secure maximum glitch avoidance.

Completely agree

I'm not moving from my 10.4.11/5.13 setup on my '04 G5 PPC

I'm a firm believer in buying things that are really and truly compatible (at least on paper) - that's why i chose to use MOTU hardware, for example

I'm not sold that the new apps are totally usable and stable in my environment - i think they have been developed with current and future specs in mind, and then sort of retro-fitted for the rest of us - a little bubble gum and band aid or two if you get my meaning

When i want/need a new mac pro, only then will i make the move to DP6 and (obviously) 10.5 - it's this match of hardware and OS that ultimately these new programs are supposed to live in

My DAW environment is considered obsolete now, but it runs nice and smooth and solid - i know its days are numbered, and there will come a time when none of it is supported any longer

Sort of like my old truck that just kept going until i couldn't get leaded gasoline anywhere anymore, so i got rid of it - people told me of how i could mod the engine for unleaded, or use an additive, and a few other ideas - but i just believe in running things they were they were meant to run

I'm all for change and progress, but I'm not buying into the mixed bag of variables - when my time runs out for my current setup, i'll start fresh - then at least if i have issues, i can be fairly certain it's not due to some ppc+dp6+leopard or intel+dp5+tiger equation that makes my head hurt...

FYI, I posted a help request on NI's site and got the following back from one of their techs:

"There are some known issues currently with Power PC Macs running our plugins
in DP 6. What you are experiencing seems to be consistent with the known
problems, and we are currently working with MOTU to figure out where the main
issue lies. This should be resolved fairly soon, and you should be notified
when an update is available."

Doesn't really tell us much, but at least it shows NI acknowledges the problem. Hopefully they will care enough to fix it.

Yeah... I got a response from NI as well and you did better than I in that you got a "fairly soon" out of them.