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Any DP user who has a working system should wait until the software is out and being evaluated by the media. At that point you should start determining (shopping for) which IntelMac you can afford, that will do what you need it to do, with a little room to expand. Before you change or sell your current set up. Save up the cash (or whatever), buy the new machine, and start building and testing the new system. Gradually add software and hardware. When you feel comfortable, open copies of your projects, and see if they play back correctly. Then start trying to record projects on the new setup. If and when you get to the point where there are no glitches and gremlins, you should be good to go.

If you do this, assuming the Desktop (Pro) Intel Macs are coming this Christmas, you should be up and running by this time next year, almost grief free. That's basically how I'd do it, so unless you have a reason to get the latest versions of everything, have patience.

On another point, am I remembering a dream, or did I hear awhile ago that MOTU was secretly running a PC version of DP down in the basement in a back room? I think it was supposedly because Apple's future was allegedly in doubt, and they were trying to be prepared for any contingency.
If that was ever the case, MOTU may be futher along heading toward Intel land than anyone suspects.
Anyway from my experience MOTU tries to be careful about releasing DP. They seem to try to wait until they have all the basics working before they put it out. Meaning that, for new users they can get started using doing basic recording, and for existing users, they can get started testing basic setup and functions, while migrating to a new system.

Sly

P.S. To you guys whose systems are slowing down because you're using more VI's and newer Plugin's. Try committing more tracks to disk. Think of it as having a real musician play the part. You would RECORD the performance, not have HIM/HER play it everytime you hit the play button. Even a stressed out G4 should be able to play back 24+ tracks.

Remember there was a time when it wasn't possible to do EVERYTHING you could wildly imagine on a computer.
Oh! Wait a minute! It's STILL NOT POSSIBLE to do everything we can possibly imagine on a computer!

Groovepusher Sly wrote:On another point, am I remembering a dream, or did I hear awhile ago that MOTU was secretly running a PC version of DP down in the basement in a back room? I think it was supposedly because Apple's future was allegedly in doubt, and they were trying to be prepared for any contingency.

Maybe you are remembering the rumor back in 2002 that APPLE had OS X running on INTEL hardware in a basement somewhere because of their worries about PowerPC. Of course that rumor turned out to be true!

eweek, Apple Keeps x86 Torch Lit with 'Marklar'
August 30, 2002

http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1656622,00.asp

As Apple Computer Inc. draws up its game plan for the CPUs that will power its future generations of Mac hardware, the company is holding an ace in the hole: a feature-complete version of Mac OS X running atop the x86 architecture.

According to sources, the Cupertino, Calif., Mac maker has been working steadily on maintaining current, PC-compatible builds of its Unix-based OS. The project (code-named Marklar, a reference to the race of aliens on the "South Park" cartoons) has been ongoing inside Apple since the early days of its transition to the Unix-based Mac OS X in the late '90s.

Sources said more than a dozen software engineers are tasked to Marklar, and the company's mainstream Mac OS X team is regularly asked to modify code to address bugs that crop up when compiling the OS for x86. Build numbers keep pace with those of their pre-release PowerPC counterparts; for example, Apple is internally running a complete, x86-compatible version of Jaguar, a k a Mac OS X 10.2, which shipped last week.

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Groovepusher Sly wrote:Any DP user who has a working system should wait until the software is out and being evaluated by the media.

I don't necessarily agree, and from two sides of the fence.

Side 1: The "media" depends on advertising from the vendor (in this case MOTU) and while you will see some negative reviews from time to time, they also punch up the positive. While that may be "fair and balanced" (in the true sense of the words, it has also lead me to buy hardware and software which I thought would be stable and basically sucked. So I don't trust the "media" as much as I used to and certainly don't depend on them for final recommendations. Those come from in store demo units or experience with someone's "hands-on" items (unless, as with Bose, there is an iron-clad, no-risk money back guarentee.)

Side 2: That being said, I am also something of a gambler, and don't mind a bit of a risk as long as there is a way to back out. For example, I WOULD buy an Intel Mac today if need be, but keep my G5 PPC on the ready for a "drop back." In fact, my G4 is STILL sitting in storage in the event the G5 goes South. (I also have a fully functional G3 9500 sitting there, but will probably make that into a server or give it to a niece).

Basically, I don't think theere is a "should" for every user. I always get a bit suspicious in meetings where there are several possibilities and one person chimes up and says "what we NEED to do..." I don't mean to 'indict' you personally. But what we "need to' or "should" do is think for ourselves. What works for you doesn't necessarily work for me or Chrispick. OTOH, I would be remiss to NOT listen to your views as I may well garner something of great value (which I did, BTW).

Now what I SHOULD do is go have a LI Ice Tea, but I have a meeting soon and and what I NEED to do is wait until he leaves. Then I will certainly break open the necessary components and take a few hours with the little lady.

Hello guys!

Chiming back in here. I have been looking at processor upgrades some and have not totally ruled them out yet, but from what I have found to upgrade a dual processor would require almost $800 for both processors. I would then only be at a 1.5 Ghz with still a slower bus speed and limited RAM. For a little more than twice the price I can have everything upgraded with a current 2.0 Ghz dual core G5. That is still looking real good to me at this point, unless I am still missing somthing. I do not want to rush into the upgrade or buying a newer G5, I want to be sure and get the best tool for what I need and for the best $ also. Your feedback has been very helpful in this.
I looked into getting a Waves APA to help out now, but my G4 does not meet the min. specs to run the things. So, I am out on going that direction too. I have the $ needed to upgrade to a new G5 and then I would wait for a while when the new intel macs come out before I would jump on that wagon. At this point, I still think it is the best way to go so far, but I have not made a final decision yet. Thanks for all your input, keep it coming if you can. It all helps. Thanks.

MIDI Life Crisis wrote:

Groovepusher Sly wrote:Any DP user who has a working system should wait until the software is out and being evaluated by the media.

I don't necessarily agree. The "media" depends on advertising from the vendor (in this case MOTU) and while you will see some negative reviews from time to time, they also punch up the positive. While that may be "fair and balanced" (in the true sense of the words, it has also lead me to buy hardware and software which I thought would be stable and basically sucked. So I don't trust the "media" as much as I used to and certainly don't depend on them for final recommendations. Those come from in store demo units or experience with someone's "hands-on" items (unless, as with Bose, there is an iron-clad, no-risk money back guarentee.)

What I mean by that, in most cases, and most of the time for MOTU, is the software company hopefully has put out a version that will, reasonably, perform as expected. No matter how favorable a reviewer may be, no company wants a bad review.
When other people, some of whom I'm familiar with, and whose job it is to evaluate products give their opinion, I listen to their views just as you did mine. My point is, that for me, that is where I start.

MIDI Life Crisis wrote:I WOULD buy an Intel Mac today if need be, but keep my G5 PPC on the ready for a "drop back.

Right, now days you have to keep the old system up and running, until the new one has been tested and deemed reliable.

MIDI Life Crisis wrote:Basically, I don't think theere is a "should" for every user.

Not at all, but just as there are procedures for "driving a car", there are things we can all do to minimize the grief, anguish, and frustration of upgrading to new systems and software.

MIDI Life Crisis wrote:I would be remiss to NOT listen to your views as I may well garner something of great value (which I did, BTW).

Thanks, anytime I can help. Enjoy the "Tea"

Sly

Prok:

There are lots of folks with/doing CPU upgrades-- they're cost effective, etc. But I know of no software company that guarantees support on CPU modded computers. That's not to say that they don't work well, because they do-- but these mods are done at the user's risk. It's only when something goes down that troubleshooting becomes a problem. You wouldn't be able to contact MOTU or Apple should anything arise. It's a tough call.

If it's really that important to you, and if time is indeed of essence-- and you cannot wait until the Intels, I would get a warrantied Mac that was fast enough without modifcations.

That's just me, though-- I've been burned lots and have often found myself wishing I'd spent a little more up front when spending a lot more on the back end was called for.

If you've ever gotten something in the back end, you'd know it's no fun.

But I know of no software company that guarantees support on CPU modded computers.

Wow, see there's something else I did not know! That is a very important thing to know. Thanks Frodo! I don't want to get in a position where I can not get help from MOTU. I will add that to my con list on processor upgrades.

Thanks
PR

Proklaim Recording wrote:

But I know of no software company that guarantees support on CPU modded computers.

Wow, see there's something else I did not know! That is a very important thing to know. Thanks Frodo!

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Well, guys, for what it is worth, from MOTU site:

http://www.motu.com/techsupport/technot ... erm=sonnet

Upgrade Cards

MOTU recommends Sonnet upgrade cards. Others may work, but we have a good working relationship with Sonnet and therefore tend to test their cards to ensure compatability frequently.

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