The path from the now free GarageBand to Logic provides a pipeline for noobs to "get it" more quickly. Also, the IT that the noobs GET might just be that they can start quickly, and discover deeper features more incrementally. Whereas, a non-noob coming from any other DAW needs more pro features from the jump. Noobs are less likely to encounter something stupid and see it for the stupid that it is.Michael Canavan wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 1:57 am Again, it's vastly popular, and used by total noobs, who manage to figure it out.
Pet Peave: Logic Pro's Help Docs
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- stubbsonic
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Re: Pet Peave: Logic Pro's Help Docs
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- Michael Canavan
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Re: Pet Peave: Logic Pro's Help Docs
Yes, Logic is stupid, people that figure it out are indoctrinated.stubbsonic wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 8:47 am The path from the now free GarageBand to Logic provides a pipeline for noobs to "get it" more quickly. Also, the IT that the noobs GET might just be that they can start quickly, and discover deeper features more incrementally. Whereas, a non-noob coming from any other DAW needs more pro features from the jump. Noobs are less likely to encounter something stupid and see it for the stupid that it is.
I'm sure this line of thinking is making it much easier for you to figure it out.
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- stubbsonic
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Re: Pet Peave: Logic Pro's Help Docs
First, no need to put words in my mouth.Michael Canavan wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 6:21 pmYes, Logic is stupid, people that figure it out are indoctrinated.stubbsonic wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 8:47 am The path from the now free GarageBand to Logic provides a pipeline for noobs to "get it" more quickly. Also, the IT that the noobs GET might just be that they can start quickly, and discover deeper features more incrementally. Whereas, a non-noob coming from any other DAW needs more pro features from the jump. Noobs are less likely to encounter something stupid and see it for the stupid that it is.
I'm sure this line of thinking is making it much easier for you to figure it out.
I'm more saying that Logic is a frustrating mixed bag. The elegance of some features sits in contrast with the stupidity of other features.
I never said people who figure it out are indoctrinated, you inferred that. I said noobs have a training path via GB, and noobs might not have the kinds of expectations that pros have.
But as for my "attitude determining my altitude"-- guilty as charged.
M1 MBP; OS 12, FF800, DP 11.3, Kontakt 7, Reaktor 6, PC3K7, K2661S, iPad6, Godin XTSA, Two Ibanez 5 string basses (1 fretted, 1 fretless), FM3, SY-1000, etc.
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- Michael Canavan
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Re: Pet Peave: Logic Pro's Help Docs
Definitely it's affecting your aptitude. You're basically getting in your own way.stubbsonic wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:34 pmFirst, no need to put words in my mouth.Michael Canavan wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 6:21 pmYes, Logic is stupid, people that figure it out are indoctrinated.stubbsonic wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 8:47 am The path from the now free GarageBand to Logic provides a pipeline for noobs to "get it" more quickly. Also, the IT that the noobs GET might just be that they can start quickly, and discover deeper features more incrementally. Whereas, a non-noob coming from any other DAW needs more pro features from the jump. Noobs are less likely to encounter something stupid and see it for the stupid that it is.
I'm sure this line of thinking is making it much easier for you to figure it out.
I'm more saying that Logic is a frustrating mixed bag. The elegance of some features sits in contrast with the stupidity of other features.
I never said people who figure it out are indoctrinated, you inferred that. I said noobs have a training path via GB, and noobs might not have the kinds of expectations that pros have.
But as for my "attitude determining my altitude"-- guilty as charged.
There really isn't any part of Logic that isn't there for a reason. The user guide is fine. There are anomalies for sure, but that's the case with every manual. I didn't start off with Garageband when I switched to Logic 4.7, it was far more impenetrable back then and I got through it. I would even say without hesitation that certain areas of DP are noticeably slower even as a seasoned user compared to what it's like when you get the hang of navigating Logic. Google, the manual and the tips all work just fine any time I'm stuck in Logic.
In the end I use DP, but I prefer Logic over Cubase, Studio One, etc. etc. There are vast areas where it's features are better. Articulation mapping, MPE instrument hosting, included instruments, GUI speed, to a degree it's quantize features, without a doubt it's looping features, including it's version of Clips, it's integration with third party control surfaces including a Komplete Kontrol or Automap style mapping of your most used parameters to any controller universally.
Anyway it's obvious to me that you're approaching it from a standpoint that makes it vastly more difficult to learn it, which will affect your ability as a teacher. As a teacher you should be able to see the problem with this attitude towards the tools at your disposal.
M2 Studio Ultra, RME Babyface FS, Slate Raven Mti2, NI SL88 MKII, Linnstrument, MPC Live II, Launchpad MK3. Hundreds of plug ins.
- stubbsonic
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Re: Pet Peave: Logic Pro's Help Docs
That's a fair point. I'll keep that in mind, going forward.Michael Canavan wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 9:38 am Anyway it's obvious to me that you're approaching it from a standpoint that makes it vastly more difficult to learn it, which will affect your ability as a teacher. As a teacher you should be able to see the problem with this attitude towards the tools at your disposal.
M1 MBP; OS 12, FF800, DP 11.3, Kontakt 7, Reaktor 6, PC3K7, K2661S, iPad6, Godin XTSA, Two Ibanez 5 string basses (1 fretted, 1 fretless), FM3, SY-1000, etc.
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- stubbsonic
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Re: Pet Peave: Logic Pro's Help Docs
It wasn't until a couple days ago that I saw mention of the "advanced tools"-- once I set that, the markers showed up as did the normalize function.
Apple could have put in their help: "To access Normalize/Markers/etc. go to Preferences/Advanced Tools... and enable x, y, z.
Mine were all off by default. I will happily admit this is mostly "on me". But to my original point, searching the help never mentioned this.
Apple could have put in their help: "To access Normalize/Markers/etc. go to Preferences/Advanced Tools... and enable x, y, z.
Mine were all off by default. I will happily admit this is mostly "on me". But to my original point, searching the help never mentioned this.
Last edited by stubbsonic on Fri Apr 02, 2021 2:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
M1 MBP; OS 12, FF800, DP 11.3, Kontakt 7, Reaktor 6, PC3K7, K2661S, iPad6, Godin XTSA, Two Ibanez 5 string basses (1 fretted, 1 fretless), FM3, SY-1000, etc.
http://www.jonstubbsmusic.com
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- Michael Canavan
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Re: Pet Peave: Logic Pro's Help Docs
Yeah that’s legit, it’s on page 148, it should be in the Getting Started section at the beginning. Makes sense as far as you not seeing the two marker types. It was this sort of dumbing down of Logic that had me switching back to DP. To Logics credit it’s a lot more work to set up jumping to a specific marker in DP though, you either have to hit the Next or Previous Marker command multiple times or select it with a mouse and hit the command to jump to selection. As opposed to Logic where the keyboard shortcuts are numbers 1 to 0 etc.stubbsonic wrote: ↑Fri Apr 02, 2021 10:45 am It wasn't until a couple days ago that I saw mention of the "advanced toos"-- once I set that, the markers showed up as did the normalize function.
Apple could have put in their help: "To access Normalize/Markers/etc. go to Preferences/Advanced Tools... and enable x, y, z.
Mine were all off by default. I will happily admit this is mostly "on me". But to my original point, searching the help never mentioned this.
M2 Studio Ultra, RME Babyface FS, Slate Raven Mti2, NI SL88 MKII, Linnstrument, MPC Live II, Launchpad MK3. Hundreds of plug ins.