MOTUnation.com

nightwatch wrote:Actually, I'd like to publicly thank you Shoosie, for getting me to really investigate and access some of DPs more powerful features and for helping get into that workflow. It's made DP that much more fun to work with. For the past few months I’ve been skimming through DP's manual (long live the print and PDF versions!) looking for things I didn’t know about. It's so obvious how well everything has been thought out and how mature the app has become over the years.

That makes me smile. I really enjoy it when others get bitten by the DP bug. Many people — maybe most — pick up an app and try to use it just for what they need, without ever trying any of the deeper features. I see that happening a lot with DP, and I understand the need to get the job done without the detour of learning an app. But then I see a lot of those same people complaining because DP doesn't do this or that, or Logic does it better, and all that stuff. That burns. If you're not going to learn the app, don't comment on what it does or doesn't do. That's why it makes me smile when I see someone like you getting into it, learning your own ways of working with it.

People sometimes complain that my little tricks are work-arounds. They want the "real thing." That's like saying Boston is a work-around, and Las Vegas is the Real Thing. You see, Boston's streets started out as Indian paths, cow paths, and wagon routes, usually with food or water involved for man or beast. Then trains came along and twisted and turned their way into the existing paths, because buildings already existed. Later, when automobiles were invented, Boston's streets had to be widened and reconnected — work-arounds. That's a mature city. People say it's hard to get around in Boston, because of these narrow winding roads, but you can get from anywhere to anywhere if you know the tricks.

Las Vegas, on the other hand, was laid out as a grid. Every square mile there are major intersections with strip-mall shopping and restaurants. It's easy to know how to get from anywhere to anywhere, because everything is laid out by the compass, but there aren't many shortcuts. The traffic backs up horribly, and I'd say it's just as congested as Boston, yet it has the feel of deliberate planning for automobiles. Most cities in the West are new, and began with railroads, the town being built outward from the supply sources of train stations and highways. Older cities back east are more likely to have shortcuts.

Ok, I've labored the point a bit, but DP feels like Boston: it's an old DAW whose features have had to be repurposed for new developments and technologies. Occasionally you see remnants from 1990, but MOTU has provided us with ways to combine these features and connect them into new ways of doing things. Call it work-around if you want, but it's there, and it does work.

Finding these work-arounds has been like a game for me. Winning that game means my work-day gets easier, because I have new features to work with. Connecting the dots of these workarounds gives you paths you never considered before. So which is better? A DAW in which each feature was planned in its current form? Or one with old and new features which can be joined and repurposed to do things that many people never even thought of?

When I look at DP, I see Boston, ready to be explored. And I see the power and maturity of age, combined with some of the latest features. The trick is getting people excited about exploring the app, coming up with their own routes, finding their own destinations. As long as that's happening, you can be sure that DP will remain healthy and useful with a loyal user base.

Shooshie

nightwatch wrote:

cowtothesky wrote:Great video!!

I was hoping that this latest VE Pro update would allow us to use MOTU effect plugins within VE Pro… Unless I have something set up wrong, it isn't recognizing MOTU plugins, so I have to go the aux in DP route if I want them.

Hey there. While VEP now has a MAS version of the server interface (the VEP plugin in DP), VEP still only supports AU and VST plugins in VEP itself. In other words, you can't use your MOTU plugins in VEP. You'll have to bus the audio back to DP to use the MAS plugins.

Hope that helps.

I didn't understand your other question.

Thanks! I did figure that out, but it's nice to see it plainly stated. I hope they support it in the future. . .

The other thing was really a kontakt problem. I'd like to reduce the time it takes to get my kontakt tracks routed correctly in VE Pro. The whole process of locating open channel outputs, assigning them to each MIDI track in the Kontakt mixer, sending them to the correct VE Pro input. I wish there was an automated way for this to happen. I can eventually get it right, but it takes more time than it should. Maybe I'm missing a shortcut.

I have a template very similar to yours. I need to be utilizing more of the great features in DP and seeing your video has really opened my eyes on a lot of things. Thanks again!

nightwatch wrote:Hi - Good question....

hey man, can't thank you enough for the detailed and informative response. give me a bit of time to plow through your material and I'm sure questions will follow!

williemyers wrote:

nightwatch wrote:Hi - Good question....

hey man, can't thank you enough for the detailed and informative response. give me a bit of time to plow through your material and I'm sure questions will follow!

I making a follow up video that answers some questions that I got from the first video. I'm going to show how VEP reacts to different thread settings, and also how the system reacts with different Kontakt core settings. I think people will be surprised at the result. I was.

Hey, I'm new to DP (still evaluating) and am still checking out VEP (All though I think my switch to DP is a foregone conclusion). This tutorial was excellent. Very useful. Both DP and VEP appear to be real game-changers. I reckon you should do more tutes. I agree that there are not nearly as many DP tutes as there are on other DAWs. Some beginner ones wouldn't go astray. It would be good to have some tutes which introduce the DP paradigm and how it differs to other daws. I think the Dave Roberts "DP Chunks" series (on the MotuTV channel) goes a long way, but it's not comprehensive. I think Motu have a huge opportunity to reach new users by simply sponsoring someone like yourself to put out polished videos (not just a video version of the print manual). This is the mode of learning now. This is low-hanging fruit going begging. I'm genuinely surprised at the lack of tutorial content for DP on youtube given the age of DP.

This forum is a good start. Motu should sit up and pay attention.

I'm now in the process of downloading VEPro. I'm a bit unclear about whether I download it and install it on my master machine OR my slave machine. I do not intend to use an Vienna Instruments on the master. I only intend to use the Master, running DP, to connect to the VEPro server. Given that, I understand I only need one Vienna Key for the slave machine.

However, I'm fairly certain I should install VEPro on the slave. So, do I also install VEPro on the master, or should I install just the MAS plug-in on the master? Please be specific.

thanks for your help

tezza1971 wrote:Hey, I'm new to DP (still evaluating) and am still checking out VEP (All though I think my switch to DP is a foregone conclusion). This tutorial was excellent. Very useful. Both DP and VEP appear to be real game-changers. I reckon you should do more tutes. I agree that there are not nearly as many DP tutes as there are on other DAWs. Some beginner ones wouldn't go astray. It would be good to have some tutes which introduce the DP paradigm and how it differs to other daws. I think the Dave Roberts "DP Chunks" series (on the MotuTV channel) goes a long way, but it's not comprehensive. I think Motu have a huge opportunity to reach new users by simply sponsoring someone like yourself to put out polished videos (not just a video version of the print manual). This is the mode of learning now. This is low-hanging fruit going begging. I'm genuinely surprised at the lack of tutorial content for DP on youtube given the age of DP.

This forum is a good start. Motu should sit up and pay attention.

Thanks for the kind words Tezza - I agree that while there are some great vids put out by MOTU, what's partly missing is the kind of workflow tutorials that exist for so many other DAWs. I, and another very knowledgable member of MOTUNATION are separately working on a series of vids. I'm currently in the process of posting part 2 and part 3 of the video you saw, and I'll continue with the DP/VEP/MIR/Kontakt theme as long as people are interested. In pt 2 I'll be addressing all the questions and comments I received from the first video, and showing my workflow past what I showed, this time with a cue and partial mix down.

I figure it can't hurt to show the cool side of DP while I'm at it although that's not my primary purpose in making them. If you have any questions in particular, feel free to ask them on my YouTube page, or send a PM to me here or other forums I'm on (VSL and VI).

Steve

comp15 wrote:I'm now in the process of downloading VEPro. I'm a bit unclear about whether I download it and install it on my master machine OR my slave machine. I do not intend to use an Vienna Instruments on the master. I only intend to use the Master, running DP, to connect to the VEPro server. Given that, I understand I only need one Vienna Key for the slave machine.

However, I'm fairly certain I should install VEPro on the slave. So, do I also install VEPro on the master, or should I install just the MAS plug-in on the master? Please be specific.

thanks for your help

You'll need to install on both. With VEP you get three serial numbers. The VEP server (for your server), and then the VEP MAS plugin for the VEP server interface (for the DP host) are both on the same installer. They each take up a license. You'll need the eLicenser (and key) on both machines and will need to add a seperate serial number (which are listed on the VSL site under My VSL/My Products) to each eLicenser.

Unfortunately VSL only gives you one license of MIR, which is a drag, but should be put on your slave. I'm not 100% positive but I'm pretty sure this goes for the MIR 24 to MIR Pro upgrade. You might double check with VSL about that one though cause I could be wrong.

Hope that helps.

I finally have all the necessary tools to get this underway (samples loaded, connected by with gigabit ethernet, etc.)

I chose "Add instrument with options", "Vienna Ensemble Stereo". Then after I bring up the server interface, there are no available instances listed. In the slave address field, I type in the slave ip address of the pc slave but once i click out of that box the ip address does not remain there. It disappears. Why are there no available instances listed?

comp15 wrote: I chose "Add instrument with options", "Vienna Ensemble Stereo". Then after I bring up the server interface, there are no available instances listed. In the slave address field, I type in the slave ip address of the pc slave but once i click out of that box the ip address does not remain there. It disappears. Why are there no available instances listed?

That threw me too. I'm new to VSL. The video presumes I know more than I do.

I think you need to launch the VEP Server before you launch DP in order to connect. The video also spends time setting up MIR, which I'm pretty sure I don't have....?

dix wrote:

comp15 wrote: I chose "Add instrument with options", "Vienna Ensemble Stereo". Then after I bring up the server interface, there are no available instances listed. In the slave address field, I type in the slave ip address of the pc slave but once i click out of that box the ip address does not remain there. It disappears. Why are there no available instances listed?

That threw me too. I'm new to VSL. The video presumes I know more than I do.

I think you need to launch the VEP Server before you launch DP in order to connect. The video also spends time setting up MIR, which I'm pretty sure I don't have....?

Vienna Ensemble Pro Server needs to be running when you click Connect in the VEP Server Interface to be able to connect to it. It does not have to be launched before DP. But Vienna Ensemble Pro Server needs to be running when you click Connect.

A common mistake is to open Vienna Ensemble rather than Vienna Ensemble Pro Server. They are two separate programs. Vienna Ensemble is a free stand alone app that comes with Vienna Instruments and is just a host program for the Instrument player but it does not connect to a DAW. For that you need Vienna Ensemble Pro Server. This is very important to understand. On a Mac, look in your Applications folder. If you have a Vienna Ensemble Pro folder, in there is where the Vienna Ensemble Pro Server (32-bit) and Vienna Ensemble Pro Server (64-bit) programs are. Those are the programs that you need for connecting to your DAW. If you have a Vienna Instruments folder, look in there and you'll see a program called Vienna Ensemble (a 32-bit and 64-bit version). That program does not connect to your DAW. It only works as a stand-alone.

It might be a good idea to either add the Vienna Ensemble Pro Server app to your Login Items (in System Preferences), or place it in the Dock so that you don't accidentally launch the non-server version.

About MIR, you will only have MIR if you bought it separately. It is not bundled with Vienna Ensemble Pro (or anything else).

Hope that helps.

Got it. Thanks Nightwatch!

I'm giddy about the improved performance that VEP brings to DP, even when not working with a slave. I have a sequence that was taking around 10 seconds to save, with VEP (decoupled) saves are virtually instantaneous. Everything is noticeably less sluggish too.

I uploaded part 2 of my HOW TO DP and VEP 5. This time I added DP9 and a VEP slave, and I cover system configs and settings for VEP, MIR and touch on Kontakt while playing back a piece I wrote that tests my new MacPro slave.

Video is here:

https://youtu.be/-knS4ca6Obw

Part 3 will be up in a few days on total optimztion of system, VEP, Kontakt, VSL player and DP.
Part 4 will "write a good cue in 10 minutes".
I plan on covering DP9 very soon, maybe after part 3.

Enjoy!
Steve Steele aka nightwatch

Can someone please explain VEP a bit better to me? For instance, I don't understand why VEP Server wants me to create a new document every time I quit it. I'm not clear on what I'm suppose to do when it asks me if I want to save. Do I need to save the server info? Isn't everything needed saved in DP? What exactly is being saved in server docs?

Thanks!

If you are referring to quitting VEPro, it always asks to save on quit - it simply saves the instances added into the server host. If you are loading a VEPro setup to use between projects (base template setup), VEPro server and VEP's instances in DP should be set to "preserve" and "decoupled". If you want DP to load each VEP instance setup in individual projects, don't decouple - then the VEP server will load those instances at project startup.