Altiverb vs ProVerb

[Dan Worley]

For instance, think how much more quickly you'll find the right reverb when you can search by any criteria of your choosing. Maybe rooms with wooden floors, for instance, along with size ranges and shapes.

So nice. I'm really looking forward to Altiverb 7.

c-ya,

Dan Worley

[David Polich]

Altiverb 7 will be a nice product. I got a glimpse of it at the NAMM
show. They've added some additional pre-delay and tail controls to
give you more options when loading impulses of algorithmic reverbs such
as a PCM90.

Intersetingly, the AudioEase rep admitted to me that convolution reverbs
still don't do a very good job of emulating algorithmic reverbs and most
likely never will. Convolution is convolution and algortihmic is algorithmic.
That's why it's still great to have something like iK Multimedia's CSR
reverb or Nomad Factory's Liquid reverbs, for those times when nothing but
an algorithmic reverb will do.

[beautypill]

I love Altiverb --- I think Audioease is a really cool company and I have been with them since the beginning --- but I am slowly saving up money to add the Lexicon reverb.

I use Proverb sometimes, but I'm impatient and rarely get the sound I'm looking for and tend to switch over to Altiverb, which has an interface and library I prefer.

I agree that convolution and algorithmic reverbs sound/feel different and I like both.

As I said, saving up for the Lex.

But... I'm... not at all close to my goal. It's... expensive...

- c

[mhschmieder]

And yet, I have recently been having better luck with Altiverb's EMT plate reverbs than with CSR Plate Reverb, in terms of not muddying up the mix. It may be that I just need to work with the controls more in CSR.

Plate reverbs are more than a bit different from room reverbs and hall reverbs, so maybe the argument about algorithmic reverbs being best in algorithmic processors vs. in convolutions, isn't relevant there.

[newrigel]

I love Altiverb --- I think Audioease is a really cool company and I have been with them since the beginning --- but I am slowly saving up money to add the Lexicon reverb.

I use Proverb sometimes, but I'm impatient and rarely get the sound I'm looking for and tend to switch over to Altiverb, which has an interface and library I prefer.

I agree that convolution and algorithmic reverbs sound/feel different and I like both.

As I said, saving up for the Lex.

But... I'm... not at all close to my goal. It's... expensive...

- c

I heard lexicon is coming out with an LE version... just single algorithms instead of the whole suite to bring it into more boxes. I love lexicons concert halls. Plus the UAD is going lexicon too... maybe a 480 or 224?

[Larry Mal]

So, I guess that nobody has seen this, I just found it yesterday:

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Impulsive/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I obviously haven't used them- and only demo'd Altiverb, so I'm no expert. But I really like Proverb, and I would probably say that if I was going to make a move I'd buy these IR's and forget about Altiverb.

But, like I say, I'm just throwing it out there. Either way, it's good to see somebody supporting DP in this way, and it looks like a great product for video work.

[Larry Mal]

Uh, let me clarify: the link that I put up is specific to TL/Space, and not Proverb. There is, according to the March issue of EQ, page 61, a version for Proverb. I can't find it anywhere, and the Timbral Research web site is very uninformative.

It's advertised by MOTU jointly with Sweetwater, so call them and maybe they can help. It looks to be exactly the same as above, only for Proverb, though. Sorry all!

[kgdrum]

this is an interesting thread that was on GS a while back:
http://www.gearslutz.com/board/new-prod ... lsive.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[timriley]

Apparently the Timbral Research IR's are WAV files so they should work with most convolution reverbs.

It was developed using TL Space which they also made some presets for so I guess that's why its "for" TL Space. In the GS thread it says they're also developing for others though.

[Shooshie]

The making of impulse responses is an art like engineering, miccing, mixing, acoustics, and many others. Audio Ease has gotten very, very good at their art. Their interface has deepened in its functionality as they have learned more about what makes a good impulse response of a hall or other facility. I go with Audio Ease because they offer me a multitude of amazing spaces, tailored for the music that I will ultimately be placing in those spaces. I don't think any other company really has mastered this yet.

Shooshie

[Larry Mal]

I see now that they are the same .wav files, just now considered to be able to work in any convolution reverb, and this is why they are in the same ad with other MOTU stuff. It's sort of misleading how it says "First-class impulse responses for DP's ProVerb" which makes it seem like a DP only product.

My fault for any misunderstanding.

[csiaudio]

I didn't see anyone post this site with what I feel are excellent IR's. Be sure to donate if you like them.

http://signaltonoize.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I use them all the time - especially the Bricasti IR's!

Hope you like them as much as I do.

[Armageddon]

The making of impulse responses is an art like engineering, miccing, mixing, acoustics, and many others. Audio Ease has gotten very, very good at their art. Their interface has deepened in its functionality as they have learned more about what makes a good impulse response of a hall or other facility. I go with Audio Ease because they offer me a multitude of amazing spaces, tailored for the music that I will ultimately be placing in those spaces. I don't think any other company really has mastered this yet.

Shooshie

That pretty much sums it up for me, too. There are an alarming amount of convolution reverbs on the market now, though (I think every DAW on the market has its own), and many people are under the assumption that any convolution reverb = "the best reverb money can buy". Just sampling some impulses and sticking it in an interface isn't enough. In my case, I'm saving my pennies for Altiverb, but, for the time being, am using great digital 'verbs like AcousticArts -- 32 or 64 bit operation, amazing sound and a great selection of presets you can use as your "base" reverbs. Most of the music I love and want to sound like used artificial reverbs, so I don't mind sounding that way. If I got into heavier orchestral film scoring, though, I'd have to spring for Altiverb, just to get the great scoring hall sounds.

Also, sampling workstations like Kontakt have built-in convolution reverb, everybody here says the next incarnation of SampleTank will have it and high-end players like PLAY have a limited (read: presets only) convolution 'verb. In certain parameters, if you were interested in adding convolution to your arsenal, you could almost even get away without buying one. Or augmenting it with ProVerb, which I still say should be rethought a little.

[fsheinfeld]

Not sure if anybody mentioned this, but there's a really good free IR of the Bricasti m7 capture by acousticas:
http://www.acousticas.net/World/IRs/AcousticasM7.zip" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It is VERY good. I use it all the time and I own Altiverb 6.

For a more commercial format http://www.samplicity.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; their L96 excellent and used by many film composers.

They all should have files you can drag to Proverb. I'm not sure how to import them all at the same time, though. I haven't tried Proverb much since I had Altiverb before DP6.

[Armageddon]

And yet, I have recently been having better luck with Altiverb's EMT plate reverbs than with CSR Plate Reverb, in terms of not muddying up the mix. It may be that I just need to work with the controls more in CSR.

Plate reverbs are more than a bit different from room reverbs and hall reverbs, so maybe the argument about algorithmic reverbs being best in algorithmic processors vs. in convolutions, isn't relevant there.

Technically, a plate reverb is an "acoustic" reverb and not an algorithm (real plate reverbs being recorded in chambers with moveable plates, etc.), so it's no surprise that impulse recordings sound much better than a digital reverb algorithmic recreation that may or may not even be in the ballpark. Try PSP EasyVerb, though; they've nailed down a lot of great plate settings.

Again, I think it's all in what you're trying to accomplish. If you're recording an orchestra, real or sampled, especially for a film score, you're going to want a convolution reverb. If you're trying to emulate a real drum room for your sampled kit or a mic'd guitar room for a real mic'd cab sound ... convolution. If you're doing post and trying to either create a realistic room tone for dialogue or using impulses sampled on location to create the same room in post that the location dialogue was recorded in (for ADR and effects), convolution. For most music production, however, I think convolution is overkill.

Considering that convolution didn't really even exist until about ten years ago, and has maybe become a staple in computer audio around five years ago (and is only now widely available due to its inclusion in most DAWs maybe three years ago), the sound of most popular music is still based around digital reverb. I think most convolution sounds real, all right, and definitely high-end and transparent ... but it lacks the character and the flexibility that I've come to know and love from good old digital (or even analog) reverb. I think CSR, ArtsAcoustic, PSP, Breverb and even TC have all nailed decent workhorse digital reverbs that a) are comparable to most hardware reverb processors, b) sound great on anything and c) don't carry the pricetag of Altiverb -- though, as I stated above, convolution is necessary and totally has its place, as well. If all you're doing is rock, pop, rap, R & B, country or electronic, however, Altiverb may be an unnecessary purchase. Just my two unwanted cents!