How much better is DP5 to 4.61?

pcm · Post by **pcm** » Sun Jul 29, 2007 9:21 pm

HCMarkus wrote:You can turn off pre-rendering in the plug in mini menu. Glitching only occurs when the project is running. Pre rendering can be a CPU saver, big time!

Yes I know, but there is no plugin window for pitch correction! If it were only in preferences somewhere (or ANYWHERE for that matter), that would be great. I mentioned this to Tech Support right when DP5 came out. So far, no one has seen fit to fix this.

David Polich · Post by **David Polich** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 1:18 pm

That, and I wish to heaven that MOTU would add a GLOBAL "disable pre-rendering/offline processing" switch in preferences. It can't be that hard...

gearboy · Post by **gearboy** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 2:05 pm

I've had the busiest 18 months ever regarding audio work. Every time a project would end I would swear that I was going to upgrade to DP5. Well, here it is, almost 16 months since DP5 arrived on the planet and I'm still nowhere near being brave enough to upgrade. DP4.61 works well, I use the Waves RenMax bundle and IR-1 on every project, and I am constantly doing audio work.

I've thought long and hard about the upgrade thing, and I just no longer feel that it is necessary. I feel that I haven't explorted everything that DP4.61 has to offer, and I definitely don't need the new features of DP5. I've established a work flow with everything that I have and it all just works.

However, I will have to obviously upgrade once I move to an Intel Mac (again, no rush). So I feel that DP6 will earn my upgrade at this point. Same goes for Native Instruments Komplete, as I will need to upgrade to be able to use it with Intel Macs.

Right now everything works and I am happy.

Jeff

dosuna11 · Post by **dosuna11** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 2:28 pm

gearboy wrote:I've had the busiest 18 months ever regarding audio work. Every time a project would end I would swear that I was going to upgrade to DP5. Well, here it is, almost 16 months since DP5 arrived on the planet and I'm still nowhere near being brave enough to upgrade. DP4.61 works well, I use the Waves RenMax bundle and IR-1 on every project, and I am constantly doing audio work.

I've thought long and hard about the upgrade thing, and I just no longer feel that it is necessary. I feel that I haven't explorted everything that DP4.61 has to offer, and I definitely don't need the new features of DP5. I've established a work flow with everything that I have and it all just works.

However, I will have to obviously upgrade once I move to an Intel Mac (again, no rush). So I feel that DP6 will earn my upgrade at this point. Same goes for Native Instruments Komplete, as I will need to upgrade to be able to use it with Intel Macs.

Right now everything works and I am happy.

Jeff

Yes!

David Polich · Post by **David Polich** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 3:26 pm

Amen.

hollywood · Post by **hollywood** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 3:46 pm

Well, I just upgraded from 4.61 to 5.12 this weekend (haven't even updated my sig. yet!)

While I only had about 2 hours of time to devote after the upgrade, here are my thoughts:

Pre-rendering on effects...glitches when opening plugins...yes...however...I must say that I am actually looking forward to making music again and mixing! My G4 actually can be used again!

I started a small project this weekend with a stereo drum loop sample, two MIDI tracks that I then recorded as mono audio, and an aux. track for fx return. I copied a four bar section and pasted it about 8 times. On the drum loop, I wanted to squash it and get a really gritty sound. PSP vintage warmer was added at a hefty amount. Then, the cymbals were a little to harsh, so I used PSP Treble, PSP Bass, and MW EQ to get the track to sound a little lo-fi. Then on the other track, PSP Mastering Compressor, followed by MW EQ. I then sent this track to the Aux track which had DP's stereo delay, MW EQ, Altiverb using a EMT plate sim., followed by Camel Crusher. The last track I used MW EQ.

My G4 did not break a sweat. I know that is not a large project, but a week ago, that would have begun to tax my G4. I probably would have to start thinking about freezing or bouncing tracks right about now had I not had DP5 going.

So, more testing is definitely needed (Amplitube 2 being the real test), but I'm really stoked. I think I can actually avoid purchasing a new mac pro for a while now. I'm getting married in 2 months, so the extra $4K will come in handy.

The only thing that I did notice...and this has happened to me before...is that my audio wasn't lining up to the grid properly when I was editing and pasting in a different project. It was sort of hit or miss. I had to manually nudge stuff into place after turning off the grid. A bit frustrating because I would have a soundbite to past and it would set it down a few samples late. And when I click on the soundbite and examine the start point in the sequence window (top left corner), it showed the proper value, but not fine enough to align it properly in place.

I didn't trash my preferences when I made the switch, and this was an old 4.61 track, so maybe that's the issue? Oh well, more testing is needed.

zed · Post by **zed** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 7:49 pm

gearboy wrote:I've thought long and hard about the upgrade thing, and I just no longer feel that it is necessary. I feel that I haven't explorted everything that DP4.61 has to offer, and I definitely don't need the new features of DP5. I've established a work flow with everything that I have and it all just works.

I'm shocked.

Do you realize (if I am not mistaken) that you could install DP 5.11 and still keep DP 4.61 in your applications folder? You might copy all your 4.61 preferences to a backup folder just in case, but I believe you can use them both, and check out whether or not DP 5.11 is just as stable for you. Someone please correct me if I am wrong on this!

In my opinion, DP 5.11 is as stable or more stable than DP 4.6, and has a heapload of additional productivity features, including adjustment of audio pitch. How can you live without that?

Akai96 wrote:I still have not switched over,is it worth it?

Yeah baby. It is definitely worth it!

emulatorloo · Post by **emulatorloo** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 9:22 pm

hollywood wrote:Well, I just upgraded from 4.61 to 5.12 this weekend (haven't even updated my sig. yet!)

<SNIP>

My G4 did not break a sweat. I know that is not a large project, but a week ago, that would have begun to tax my G4. I probably would have to start thinking about freezing or bouncing tracks right about now had I not had DP5 going.

I agree -- DP 5.12 will breath new life into a G4.

Works great on G5 as well.

----

gearboy wrote:<SNIP>I'm still nowhere near being brave enough to upgrade. DP4.61 works well, I use the Waves RenMax bundle and IR-1 on every project, and I am constantly doing audio work.

I've thought long and hard about the upgrade thing, and I just no longer feel that it is necessary. I feel that I haven't explorted everything that DP4.61 has to offer, and I definitely don't need the new features of DP5.

Jeff -- see hollywood's post above. You will get a lot more bang out of your G5 w DP 5. As to "bravery" not sure you need that -- just the ability to put a CD in your computer and knowledge of how to use a mouse. ( As I understand it the Waves AU stuff is fine. )

Maybe DP6 will be worth the wait --- but you will get higher plug counts etc w DP5 ***TODAY*** than you will w DP4.6. DP 5.12 is the best DP ever on OS X.

-----

David Polich · Post by **David Polich** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 9:44 am

If DP5 is working great then - great.

But judging from a "few" posts here, it isn't working great for everyone.

There are people who still use 4.61 and are completely happy with it, and yes, we don't feel the need to move to DP5 - at all. Why would that be so weird? We can easily "live without" DP5.

I'm not knocking 5. The original post was about whether the move to 5 was that much of an improvement over 4.61. I have both, I use both and IMO DP5 is "not" that much of an improvement over 4.61. Perhaps that is just because I never had much trouble with 4.61. It gets me where I want to go, it always starts up, and everything (i.e., Waves) is compatible with it.

sdfalk · Post by **sdfalk** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 10:06 am

Dp 5(12 or 11) is a pretty big improvement regarding CPU usage, but
still has a long way to go to be on par with Logic.
Regardless, I still (mostly) use DP.

gearboy · Post by **gearboy** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 2:02 pm

Regarding Plug-in counts etc in DP, I have no issue with this. The track counts and plug-in counts that I'm able to get on my system is fine. I'm actually at the point that the only thing that I would like to be able to get more of is 48+ tracks at a terribly low buffer setting, as in almost real-time, AND run all of the VIs that I want to when my track counts are up around 40+. DP5 isn't going to fix this, a future Mac purchase will.

••• Regarding the Meter Bridge, I meter with Trim and FreeG in combination, and have really gotten used to this.

••• Regarding VIs... and I am not dogging MOTU's VIs that are included with DP, but I doubt that I'll ever use them. Between Komplete3 (soon to be Komplete4), The GMedia Stuff, Automat, etc, I have enough VIs. Factor in Live 5.2 Rewires to DP and realize that I only use about 5%-10% of what I can do with audio on my G5/PB/outboard gear as is, and not upgrading is definitely not preventing me from making music, working on film audio, practicing guitar, doing ADR work, etc.

••• Have 40+ tracks and need a VI added? Submix stems and create a SubSession for tracking.

••• Too many tracks/plugs/etc and need extra Reverbs? Run several instances of IR-1 on the PB G4 as Aux Tracks and hook my two 828mk2 interfaces together via lightpipe. No worries. I still have yet to do this.

••• The big deal right now is having so much work and not being able to risk messing any of it up by changing DP versions. I've just gotten to the point of feeling like I no longer need to acquire gear, and definitely not upgrade.

NI is getting my upgrade cash in the next month as they are running a 50% off sale this summer and I can upgrade Komplete3 to Komplete4 and get Acoustic Piano and all UBs of what I already have for $170. That's a deal. MOTU will get my $200 when DP6 is released and/or I upgrade to a MacIntel.

Jeff

sdfalk · Post by **sdfalk** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 4:21 pm

I still have an older Single processor G5 system.
I can run multiple instances of Cameleon 5000, Zebra 2
and some decent fx plugins in Logic Express and the meter
goes up about half way on a 256k buffer..DP just can't manage
that.
I realize when I (soon ) get a newer faster system that will become
less relevant, but it would still be nice if DP could run a bit
leaner.

emulatorloo · Post by **emulatorloo** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 5:45 pm

David Polich wrote:If DP5 is working great then - great.

But judging from a "few" posts here, it isn't working great for everyone.

There are people who still use 4.61 and are completely happy with it, and yes, we don't feel the need to move to DP5 - at all. Why would that be so weird? We can easily "live without" DP5.

#1 rule of the internet -- Internet Gripe Sites/Troubleshooting Sites attract lots of posts of people Griping.

I learned early on that you cannot make rational judgements about software stability by reading posts on a troubleshooting site.

It makes sense -- if you are having trouble you come to unicornation and post "woe is me". (And if you dig back you are going to see plenty of "woe is me" posts about DP 4.61.)

Another thing that is deceptive about all these "woe is me" subject headings is the amount of posts that end with "fixed it, all is well!" Usually a fair percentage of those involve -- "I forgot to read the read me"

Conversly, If you are not having trouble, you do not post endless threads about how wonderful your system is.

--
OTOH if 4.61 is working for you fabulous. All I can tell you is in my personal experience, 5.11 breathed new life into my dual motorola machine in terms of what I could do in a song performance wise. All the while feeling more stable to me than 4.61. YMMV -- save the 200.00 if you are doing great -- because as we know there is always need for more available cash in our own pockets! Or as Jeff points out, there is the NI summer sale. . .

--

David Polich · Post by **David Polich** » Wed Aug 01, 2007 6:58 pm

I may be guilty as charged of posting that my system (4.61) is working great.

I'll cop to that.

I am always happy for anyone else whose system is working great. Nothing wrong with reading about that from other users. It's encouraging.

I realize saying your system is working great may seem like saying that you've won the lottery to someone who is having trouble. That is not my intention. I'm just being thankful, and happy that I can get up in the morning and not worry first thing about whether my system will launch.

I definitely feel for those having difficulties. Who doesn't? We've all been there. It's really depressing. If I've offended anyone personally with what sounds like grandiose crowing, I sincerely apologize.

My friend Waxman tells me about every other day how great DP 5.12 is and how I should just move up to it. He's fearless about upgrades and 5.12 is working really well for him.

All I want to emphasize is that it is something of a liberating experience when you realize you don't "have to" upgrade. It's a relief, actually.

Okay, now I'm off to enjoy the Amplitube Jimi Hendrix upgrade which I just bought...

zed · Post by **zed** » Wed Aug 01, 2007 7:18 pm

David Polich wrote:Okay, now I'm off to enjoy the Amplitube Jimi Hendrix upgrade which I just bought...

Would be interested in your comments on this over in the Beatles thread. A few of us are considering the crossgrade. Have fun!!