DP 9.1 sustain pedal not audible during recording

[Babz]

Wait! OK, I *am* able to reproduce this, but the key is to start and stop recording on the same same track. If you just do a new take, or do undo and start recording again, or delete what is in the track and start recording again, all is normal. It's the starting and stopping recording on the same track that is key.


Try this.

*** With Event Chasing On (i.e., Setup->Event Chasing->Controllers "All" box ticked) ****

1. Start recording a piano part.
2. Press the sustain pedal and record. Release the sustain pedal and stop recording at like bar 4 or 5.

All is normal. Look at the track in the SE and you can see the sustain pedal come on and off.

NOW,

3. Place your wiper at bar 7.
4. Start recording on the same track.
5. Press the sustain pedal. You can see it engage in the SE, but ...
THE SUSTAIN PEDAL DOESN'T WORK!

Try it!

100% reproducible.

All is normal with Event Chasing turned off (i.e., Setup->Event Chasing->Controllers "All" box NOT ticked.)

Conclusion: Event Chasing for Sustain Pedal (cc 64) is definitely broken, but ONLY when you start and stop recording on the same track. That is, if you have previously recorded on a track and released the sustain pedal and stopped recording, and then picked up recording on the same track after that point, the cc 64 controller is recorded to the track but the live MIDI patch thru is disabled. If you quickly press the sustain pedal and release it, it comes back (but this of course messes up your recording).


Best,
Babz

Magic Dave, Mr. Miller, someone at MOTU, I hope you are reading this...

[Shooshie]

Well, perhaps I over-reacted to this particular problem report, but it was a growing frustration with a number of problems reported by myself and others, which should not be happening. When multiple people have the same problem, it slipped past the testers, whose competence I've been questioning in the past several releases. Sorry guys; it's got to be done in a more thorough, methodical manner. DP IS more complex now, and it DOES require more rigorous testing.

My own frustration is my own problem, however, compounded by the fact that DP 9.1 arrived the same day as an esteemed guest, who has been staying with me since then, and who will be in the area for a week or more, returning periodically to stay here again. We've been working on a remote setup for Sibelius, and I just have not been able to test DP more than about an hour. DP always drops without warning, and sometimes I just can't clear my calendar for it.

I will try to keep my outbursts to myself, at least until I get my hands into this again and can experience (or exonerate) more of these bugs personally.

Shooshie

[jacey714]

Wait! OK, I *am* able to reproduce this, but the key is to start and stop recording on the same same track. If you just do a new take, or do undo and start recording again, or delete what is in the track and start recording again, all is normal. It's the starting and stopping recording on the same track that is key.


Try this.

*** With Event Chasing On (i.e., Setup->Event Chasing->Controllers "All" box ticked) ****

1. Start recording a piano part.
2. Press the sustain pedal and record. Release the sustain pedal and stop recording at like bar 4 or 5.

All is normal. Look at the track in the SE and you can see the sustain pedal come on and off.

NOW,

3. Place your wiper at bar 7.
4. Start recording on the same track.
5. Press the sustain pedal. You can see it engage in the SE, but ...
THE SUSTAIN PEDAL DOESN'T WORK!

Try it!

100% reproducible.

All is normal with Event Chasing turned off (i.e., Setup->Event Chasing->Controllers "All" box NOT ticked.)

Conclusion: Event Chasing for Sustain Pedal (cc 64) is definitely broken, but ONLY when you start and stop recording on the same track. That is, if you have previously recorded on a track and released the sustain pedal and stopped recording, and then picked up recording on the same track after that point, the cc 64 controller is recorded to the track but the live MIDI patch thru is disabled. If you quickly press the sustain pedal and release it, it comes back (but this of course messes up your recording).


Best,
Babz

Magic Dave, Mr. Miller, someone at MOTU, I hope you are reading this...

Bingo!

[cuttime]

Thanks Babz, but I'll distill it even further with EVENT CHASING OFF.
1-Create a Kontakt instance and load the concert grand
2-Record the MIDI track
3-Rewind the track and record again
4-No sustain heard, but is recorded.

[David Polich]

On your system. But not on mine.
I cannot reproduce this "bug"
at all.

Not saying it isnt happening, just that
its probably system-specific.

[cuttime]

Maybe it would be helpful if folks listed their OS.

[charnach]

So, I’ve had a chance to spend some time with this and Babz is definitely on to something. It does seem to be related to punching in on an existing track. Recording on a clean track any where in the time line produces no issues, which may be why some people are not reporting a problem.

Setting event chasing on or off doesn’t seem to affect it. I have the same problem either way.

“Double-pumping” the sustain pedal after punching in as Babz suggested seems to work, although not predictably.

2015 MBP 15" retina, OS 10.11.4 "El Capitan" 16 GB ram, MOTU Ultralite MK3,

[Babz]

Thanks Babz, but I'll distill it even further with EVENT CHASING OFF.
1-Create a Kontakt instance and load the concert grand
2-Record the MIDI track
3-Rewind the track and record again
4-No sustain heard, but is recorded.

No, the "Rewind the track and record again" is the part that is confusing, or is why I wasn't able to initially reproduce the bug, and why others maybe are not able to.

I rarely work like that. If I record something, and then record again, I usually erase everything in the track first, or do undo, or I do a new take. And if I do either of those things, I cannot reproduce the bug.

It is only when you have some cc64 recorded in the track and then try to record on that same track with the previously-recorded cc64 off, that you get the bug. I would rarely rewind to the beginning and start recording on a track without erasing or undoing what I just recorded, unless I was doing overdub mode. However, I just tested, and the problem DOES occur in overdub mode too, so I supposed "rewind the track and record again" would work, if in overdub mode, but is not the best way to explain how to reproduce the bug, IMO.

Best,
Babz

P.S. Also, I am testing with an XP-80 keyboard. No VI involved, so loading a Kontakt piano is not an essential part of the steps needed to reproduce the bug. (However, I can also make it happen w/ a Kontakt piano.) It also has nothing to do with brand of keyboard or sustain pedal.

The key is that Event Chasing for All controllers has to be on, and you have to start recording in the same track right after you have recorded a cc64 off.

[Babz]

On your system. But not on mine.
I cannot reproduce this "bug"
at all.

Not saying it isnt happening, just that
its probably system-specific.

Seriously? You followed my steps exactly? Event Chasing on, Controllers box ticked and All button on? Record MIDI ending with a sustain pedal off, and then recording again on the same track?

That would be most peculiar indeed if you did all that and did not get the same results. I am as surprised by your statement as your quotes around "bug" would indicate you apparently are by mine.

I maintain it is a confirmed, reproducible bug, if you follow the steps exactly. If your system is not manifesting the bug, there must be something peculiarly system-specific about your set up, possibly you don't actually have Event Chasing on?

Best,
Babz

P.S. In the unlikely event that it is OS-specific, I am on 10.8.5 (Mountain Lion). Would others who CAN reproduce the bug list there OS specs, pleeze?

[Shooshie]

Thanks Babz, but I'll distill it even further with EVENT CHASING OFF.
1-Create a Kontakt instance and load the concert grand
2-Record the MIDI track
3-Rewind the track and record again
4-No sustain heard, but is recorded.

No, the "Rewind the track and record again" is the part that is confusing, or is why I wasn't able to initially reproduce the bug, and why others maybe are not able to.

I rarely work like that. If I record something, and then record again, I usually erase everything in the track first, or do undo, or I do a new take. And if I do either of those things, I cannot reproduce the bug.

It is only when you have some cc64 recorded in the track and then try to record on that same track with the previously-recorded cc64 off, that you get the bug. I would rarely rewind to the beginning and start recording on a track without erasing or undoing what I just recorded, unless I was doing overdub mode. However, I just tested, and the problem DOES occur in overdub mode too, so I supposed "rewind the track and record again" would work, if in overdub mode, but is not the best way to explain how to reproduce the bug, IMO.

Best,
Babz

P.S. Also, I am testing with an XP-80 keyboard. No VI involved, so loading a Kontakt piano is not an essential part of the steps needed to reproduce the bug. It also has nothing to do with brand of keyboard or sustain pedal.

The key is that Event Chasing for All controllers has to be on, and you have to start recording in the same track right after you have recorded a cc64 off.

Brava!
This is good, thorough testing!

Shooshie

[jacey714]

Running on OS 10.9.5

[Babz]

Running on OS 10.9.5

And you CAN produce the bug. And I'm on Mountain Lion, so I think that rules out OS as a factor.

[Babz]

Setting event chasing on or off doesn’t seem to affect it. I have the same problem either way.

After reading this, I tested again. After several tries, I cannot get it to happen when Event Chasing Controllers is OFF.

Best,
Babz

[charnach]

Setting event chasing on or off doesn’t seem to affect it. I have the same problem either way.

After reading this, I tested again. After several tries, I cannot get it to happen when Event Chasing Controllers is OFF.

Best,
Babz

Hum...

[cuttime]

Let's be clear how event chasing is disabled: I am using the "Clear" button. I don't see any way to untick "All" and have it stick.