Record as an ensemble or individually?

[Freaky Freddy]

Good evening, afternoon or morning,

Just looking for some advice from some recording people with more experience than myself if they have time to address my query.

I was thinking about recording a string ensemble with a four voice soprano section (this could change according to the piece) in a contemporary music style.

In order to cut corners on money and free up scheduling for musicians I was thinking of
recording them each separately and then mixing it together.

On top of that, I was thinking about recording, for example, one violinist several times over with a click and so on throughout the string ensemble. Again, to save money and free up musicians schedule times (not my work time on the project). (I would have to have four different singers however).

I can imagine a host of problems from going down this route (and the other route), however, just wondering if any of you had any strong reservations about recording in this manner?
Or perhaps think it is a doable approach?

Any thoughts or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you

Freaky

[Dwetmaster]

If the wanted result is to have an ensemble sound I would strongly suggest to you recording them together. People tend to react and adjust to one another and for an ensemble sound you might WANT that.

[Freaky Freddy]

Thanks for that Dwetmaster. I recently had a discussion with a violinist about
this topic and she had a very similar point about 'adjustment' and 'reaction' is where
the music really takes place. Point taken and I think the group together will be the best
choice.

Cheers

Freaky

[Dwetmaster]

I treat all my ensembles the same way. Like they were a patch from a keyboard. When I record brasses for a song, I usually don't want to hear a trumpet, a sax and/or a trombone, I just want to hear a horn sections. So if you have decent musicians that will be inclined about blending together, record the whole thing together, with both close micing AND ambient micing if possible.

A bit like with Drums; sometimes, you don't want to hear only the snare/Kick/Toms/Cymbals separated, you most likely want to hear the drumkit as a single instrument.

[Phil O]

Tough question, Freaky. I can see how folks could get into a real debate here as to which is "better" but the truth is it depends on a lot of factors.

In order to cut corners on money and free up scheduling for musicians I was thinking of recording them each separately and then mixing it together.

Scheduling and cost are real world considerations on any project, but try not to let these dictate your agenda. If there's any way to get around these issues for the sake of the project, you're better off. If not, then you gotta do what you gotta do.

On top of that, I was thinking about recording, for example, one violinist several times over with a click and so on throughout the string ensemble.

I've done this before with great success. Use different mics for each "chair" and perhaps EQ differently as well. This seems to add to the realism. Careful panning and reverb are obviously a must.

I can imagine a host of problems from going down this route..

It's not as bad as you might think. The biggest problem you'll face is getting musicians who are probably not comfortable working with a click to put their heads in that space. I will often times use Model 12 with DP's drum editor to create a custom click. You can use a 1, 2, 4 or whatever measure phrase and put it in a loop. It then becomes easy to edit that short phrase for individual musicians. Some like a simple quarter note click, while others might like eighths. Still others might like a groove like figure.

You'll also find that the ensemble tightens up as you go along, with the later musicians giving a better performance as the ensemble builds. For this reason it's worth keeping the option open of re-doing the early takes near the end of the project. Think of those first few tracks as scratch. But then again it doesn't always work out that way.

There's also the option of having the best of both worlds. Record them as an ensemble and then add extra chairs individually to the group's recording. I did this once when I needed a huge gospel choir but only had nine people. It worked out great. I think that was about 25 or so tracks.

Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

Phil

[HCMarkus]

There's also the option of having the best of both worlds. Record them as an ensemble and then add extra chairs individually to the group's recording.

What Phil said. Build from a foundation with feeling.... timing, dynamics, and phrasing will fall into place so much easier.

[mikehalloran]

I'm a "get a good sounding room and record the strings with an M/S array" kind of guy. This gives a sense of realism that cannot be duplicated recording one track at a time. If realism is the goal here...

An interesting approach is to have an M/S array in the center of your space while you track the instruments one at a time. I have done this before - gives you lots of choices in the editing room.

[Freaky Freddy]

Thanks everyone for the very thoughtful contributions here.

I have to digest the information and evaluate carefully how to approach this project
or even tone it down if I must.

Freaky

[Radiogal]

Do both!
Record each in the ensemble with a close mic
and
record with overhead mics.
I usually do this.
This gives you more control over edits and pitch.
You will most certain need to do these kinda corrections.

This technique saved me a lot of times from otherwise sitting with useless recordings.
..and I´ve had a few.. phew... those stringed musicians are not always playing as "studio clean" as we need them to be.
DP pitch usually can solve this in a great way.

Record multiple "good" takes so you can comp and blend them.