Waves Gold or DP6?

[shoegazr]

Hi guys,

I have a Christmas dilemma. I'm currently running DP 5.13 and a few decent third-party plugs (I find the DP freebie plugs to be pretty lackluster, with a few exceptions) on my Intel MacBook.

My dilemma is that I can either upgrade to DP 6 or move my Waves Gold plugs over to my intel mac (I currently have Waves Gold 3.x stuck on my old protools/001 rig -- OS9.2 G4).

Both options run about $200, but I can only afford to get 1 right now.

Are the dynamics and convolution reverb plugs that come with DP 6 better than the freebies in DP 5? Are they on par with Waves Convolution Verb and L1/Ren Comp? Again, I'm feeling most inadequate in these departments (dynamics and reverbs) with my current plugs in DP 5.13

What would you do?

Thanks!

[FMiguelez]

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Remember that with DP6 you get the LA2A emulation, and a very good convolution reverb. I've heard very good things about them.

If you are going from Gold to Gold, you won't notice any difference in terms of sound. It's the same plugs. Now, if you could go up for Platinum...

So, in this case, I'd go for DP6, if I was you.

[billf]

I agree with FM. I have Waves Gold 6, being forever chained to them as I am. I also have DP6, and given the choice, I would go with DP6 first.

[monkey man]

Again, I'm feeling most inadequate in these departments (dynamics and reverbs) with my current plugs in DP 5.13!

Yup. 'Verb and dynamics. Shoegazr, this is exactly how I felt and therefore the '6 upgrade was long overdue for me.

[shoegazr]

OK cool. Thanks, guys. I still haven't decided but this helps. If the LA-2A and the convolution reverb are decent, I'll probably go with DP6.

[billf]

OK cool. Thanks, guys. I still haven't decided but this helps. If the LA-2A and the convolution reverb are decent, I'll probably go with DP6.

shoegazr, I have Waves Gold... I don't know, you do have an interesting dilemma. It doesn't sounds like you are totally reliant on Waves as are some of us here, maybe you are, but really unless you're totally reliant on Waves, the DP6 plugins will do the trick until such time that you can upgrade or replace your Waves package. The latest Waves Gold includes the IRL which is comparable to the Proverb in DP6. The LA2 was mentioned upthread. Masterworks EQ is good enough to replace the Waves EQ's. The latest Gold has stuff like RenAxe and Tune, but DP6 has built in pitch correction, and then it comes down to is Waves worth a guitar distortion plugin (when there are better ones out there anyway). There's also a freebie emulation of the L1 out there somewhere (sorry I don't know the name of it), and I've read good things about it. There are some good stereo matrixing freebies out there too. Not sure that anything in freebie-land replaces the paz stuff if you rely on it, but I haven't looked.

My take: if I could cut loose from Waves I would do so and down the road look at UAD or similar for replacements.

One other option if you're happy with DP5 for now, pickup Logic Express for $200 and use the plugs in it to supplant Waves. The downside there is dealing with two DAW's and learning Logic, but it would get you out of Waves WUP hell plus you get a bunch of VI's with it as well.

[shoegazr]

Thanks for your thoughtful post. I do have something like an $800 investent in waves stuck on my G4, so in that sense I'm also stuck with waves. (I went many years without upgrading anything--so I guess this is what you get! But I will note that all the stuff in my rack from that era works perfectly well with my new MacBook, and it does so for free.)

I'm not sure exactly how the upgrade treadmill works with Waves. I haven't given them a dime since I bought Gold originally, but I called and I can get the new version for $210 or something. Is that a fee I would have to pay every year in order to stay current? Or do you pay up whenever you want to upgrade? I could probably go another decade without upgrading again.

I don't mind the Waves plugs so much--they were much better than the built-in plugs that came with ProTools LE back in 2000.

But now there are many quality options out there, and from what I understand Waves gold is still basically the same, quality wise.

[FMiguelez]

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If you are thinking about updating your Waves stuff, maybe it would be a good moment to actually consider upgrading too. If you go up one level in their bundles, if you get Platinum, the WUP will be free for a full year. Plus you automatically get the latest version. That's 2 birds in one shot.

That's exactly what I did when I had Gold. And it was worth it. You do have an incentive to upgrade. And if you do it in a good moment (just wait for those 25% discounts they do often) you can even get more value and save more money.

And, let's face it. Weather we like it or not, Waves' stuff is one of the best, if not THE best, sounding plug-ins in the market.

[bayswater]

But now there are many quality options out there, and from what I understand Waves gold is still basically the same, quality wise.

But didn't they make big increases in efficiency between V4 and V5? That's what they kept telling me. (I stopped at V 4.3 which still works on my G5/10.4)

[billf]

Thanks for your thoughtful post. I do have something like an $800 investent in waves stuck on my G4, so in that sense I'm also stuck with waves. (I went many years without upgrading anything--so I guess this is what you get! But I will note that all the stuff in my rack from that era works perfectly well with my new MacBook, and it does so for free.)

I'm not sure exactly how the upgrade treadmill works with Waves. I haven't given them a dime since I bought Gold originally, but I called and I can get the new version for $210 or something. Is that a fee I would have to pay every year in order to stay current? Or do you pay up whenever you want to upgrade? I could probably go another decade without upgrading again.

I don't mind the Waves plugs so much--they were much better than the built-in plugs that came with ProTools LE back in 2000.

But now there are many quality options out there, and from what I understand Waves gold is still basically the same, quality wise.

Waves are great plugins. It's the WUP model that is what most people gripe about with regards to Waves.

The WUP fee for Gold is under $200 per year, $160-ish if I recall correctly. The WUP is needed to get updates and such, it's a weird support program that probably only Waves could get away with, but it's not something you need to keep current each year.

FM's suggestion is a good one, which I looked at as well, but I decided I just don't want to go any deeper with Waves right now for a myriad of reasons. But I'm not sure if his suggestion is in your budget.

[billf]

But now there are many quality options out there, and from what I understand Waves gold is still basically the same, quality wise.

But didn't they make big increases in efficiency between V4 and V5? That's what they kept telling me. (I stopped at V 4.3 which still works on my G5/10.4)

I think they also added several plugins to each bundle during the version 5 phase. Gold 5 got the guitar plugin, doubler, IRL, TuneLite, and such. Waves are doing the same with version 6, but I don't think that Gold has added any new plugins added to the v6 bundle yet.

[jlaudon]

My question would be - how 'deep' do you run DP? It's always good to stay current (with reliable versions of course) of any DAW, IMO. Would DP6 be an enhanced workflow for you? Is track comping important (or any of the other new features compared to 5.13), other than the new plugins? Do you run a lot of VIs, etc.?

I have some Waves plugins, but with the new DP plugs, and the pitch correction there already, and track comping, I would choose DP6 over Waves.

[Shooshie]

Carefully balance the DP6 idea with the Waves upgrade. Waves is something you can put off for a long time, at the expense of your musical files. DP6 is an upgrade you're going to make anyway at some point. Many people are disappointed in DP6, but MOST of those people have come full circle and are now liking it. (I'm one of them) You're liable to think you made a big mistake at first if you get DP6. But Waves is immediate gratification. Just saying there are lots of angles to consider. They all lead to eventual satisfaction, but maybe not by the path you might normally expect.

Also, I find Waves Gold to be a little lackluster. Platinum is the "entry-level" for me, as it has the plugins I like the most: the Mastering suite, mainly. I also had to spend extra money to get the full L3 Multi-Maximizer, rather than the cut-down version that comes with Platinum. This stuff is expensive. You're eventually going to get all the things we're talking about, so just figure out what you can afford now and don't worry about the rest. You MAY need to upgrade Waves for DP6. I don't remember the story on that. I sure get sick of forking out money at every upgrade, but that's the way the game is played, so unless you make up your own rules (like, stick with DP 5.13 forever) you're going to be paying to play; always.

Shooshie

[shoegazr]

Great info, guys. But you're not making the decision any easier!

I do see what you mean about the annoyance of WUP. Is there any guarantee that there will be a major new version every year, or do you just pay for the privilege of continuing to use their product and hope they get around to improving it?

The stability thread has me thinking I'm not in a big hurry to move to DP6, so at this point I'm leaning toward Waves. Maybe I'll up to DP 6 next year. I'm pretty decent at comping tracks in 5.13 at this point, anyway.

Thanks again for the thoughts on this.

[FMiguelez]

Great info, guys. But you're not making the decision any easier!

I do see what you mean about the annoyance of WUP. Is there any guarantee that there will be a major new version every year, or do you just pay for the privilege of continuing to use their product and hope they get around to improving it?

The stability thread has me thinking I'm not in a big hurry to move to DP6, so at this point I'm leaning toward Waves. Maybe I'll up to DP 6 next year. I'm pretty decent at comping tracks in 5.13 at this point, anyway.

Thanks again for the thoughts on this.

You can put off updating your WUP as long as you need/want. You'll have to pay it eventually IF/WHEN you want to have their latest version. For instance, my WUP has expired already, but I won't worry about it until I figure if I'll get the Mercury bundle. In the mean time, I can keep using the plugs normally.

The WUP thing used to be much worse. Now it's pretty decent, and as long as Waves keeps shaking hands with MOTU, I really don't mind the WUP.