Sending Audio Files from DP to Protools

Julia Newmann · Post by **Julia Newmann** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 11:19 pm

I am working for a composer on a TV show and I wrote directly to the quicktime movie that he gave me instead of exporting it as a dv file for my canupus box. (I skipped that step to save time.) But when he dropped the cue into his protools, we discovered that the sync was slightly off. I need a solution to this ASAP so I can continue writing. He says the following....

"I did place the cue correctly, so I believe what must
be happening has to do with this pulldown parameter.
On my PT sessions, I have to select the paramater:

1% pulldown 24/30 fps FILM to NTSC" option--- on BOTH
the audio and video rates. DP must have an option for
this as there are many film composers using DP.

Assuming my parameters are correct, then your audio
track is playing faster against the picture over
here---but plays correctly over at your studio. I'm
not good at this kind of troubleshooting, but I think
this means that your video and audio are not being
pulled down.

I do not think offsets will help because if I'm
understanding the problem correctly the music is
playing back fast--at a faster tempo---an offset will
align early hit points but not others over time."

bralston · Post by **bralston** » Tue Jul 22, 2008 1:05 am

Hello Julia,

Do you know what frame rate the original QT file was made at? In QT Pro, select the Movie inspector (window>Show Movie Inspector) when the specific Qt file you used is open and see what the FPS is listed as. Is the movie a 24 frame file? Or was it already at 29.97?

I am guessing that the problem is on the Pro Tools import into his session and not on your end of things. While frame rates and the like are complicated things where it sometimes seems like magic dust is the only thing that solves the problem...I usually find that the issues at hand are dependent on the pull up and pull down settings being correct or incorrect on pro Tools import.

My best guess is that your files are being pulled into his session incorrectly. It is easy to do...incorrectly. especially if one does not know the parameters of the session they are trying to import. While as you know there are many different flavors of frame rate...it is also true that a second is still a second in real time. It is just a mater of how we divide up those seconds and then we try to lock to those divisions when we pull or shrink our audio to match the ever changing video conversions in film/TV production.

Can you export stereo aiff tracks to him with 2-pops on the head and tail as a last resort? Have him not do any pull up or pull down stuff on import of those stereo tracks and see if that happens. I am assuming he is trying to import an OMF or something of your original DP session with all the various multi tracks.

While it is hard to diagnose without seeing what is really happening...I would be willing to bet that the issue is on the Pro Tools import end of things and that it is converting your files when they do not need to be converted. Or maybe they do need to be converted, but they are being converted in the wrong direction. If that makes sense? The fact that things are playing faster than they need to be tells me that your audio was "squeezed" to play faster incorrectly. Think of it like as you would frames of video. The squeezed audio would be played faster (in a shorter amount of time compared to the frames of video). And yet, it is faster than the video on his end and thus out of synch. So...he probably does not need the pull down he is applying on import. And the only way to change it on the Pro Tools end is to re-import the audio using different parameters.

Focus on trying different types of imports...if your TV guy will be patient with you on trying a couple different things.

Say hello to Cody for me.

Best,

Brian

kassonica · Post by **kassonica** » Tue Jul 22, 2008 1:07 am

Also this is a long shot but you never know eh, make sure the sample rates are the same in your setup and their setup.

bralston · Post by **bralston** » Tue Jul 22, 2008 1:15 am

yea...sample rates are good to look at too. but I am sure Julia is use to working at 48K. She does a lot of music to picture. The 44.1 vs. 48K difference is pretty noticable. It is the .1% pulldown for the 23.98/24 Frame and 29.97/30 frame stuff that makes the audio just slightly out of synch and it gets worse over time as was described to her.

There are also some OSX tools that can take audio and do a .1% convert of the sample rate to force it back into where it is supposed to be. But, that is more work than needed when one can most likely just do a fresh import with different/correct settings and fix it that way.

Audioflotis · Post by **Audioflotis** » Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:11 pm

this is indeed a complicated topic...
if you are working for film and you get your quicktimes at 24 fps, when you go to the postproduction facility to mix your music, they will probably be working at 29.97 or 23.98 fps, and all the studio is synced with a video signal at this rate. at this point you are in a little trouble. what you need to do is to open your tracks in a session that is slaved to the clock of the studio and then it will run at 29.97 or 24.98. all your music will have a diferent length than the original recording, in order to be in sync with the picture. if anybody knows a different way of doing this please share.
the best way is to make sure you always get your quicktimes at 29.97 or 23.98 this way you will compose your cues at the right tempo to be in sync when you go to the mixing studio.
i think protools has some features to import the files doing pulldown and even running the session doing pulldown, i think this is not possible in DP. would be nice...