NAMM REPORT (2nd hand): DP SIX!!!!!!!

gearboy · Post by **gearboy** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 8:09 pm

Let's hope so, Shooshie!

Shooshie · Post by **Shooshie** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 8:16 pm

ponytrack wrote:Hey, did anyone at the show happen to notice if those little yellow help balloons reared their ugly heads or were magic Dave's fingers too nimble?
Maybe that's where he earns his nickname.

No such luck. They're still there.

Shoosh

Shooshie · Post by **Shooshie** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 8:28 pm

Timeline wrote:

Look closely at the transport control. I love the thin redesign but hate the controls being LEFT of center. They should be below the readouts always IMO if I had a choice.

This is pretty unacceptable to me unless you have a pref to reorder/swap machine controls as designed to the opposite side or even better, a transport breakaway.

Added: Where is the slider reposition bar? Did they take that away? If so that would be unfortunate as I have gotten used to using it. BTW I never use consolidated windows ever.

The thing about the controls and the transport is all wrong: look, if you put the controls below the readout (Counter), then one or the other, if not both, would have to shrink in size, or else you'd give up another half inch of screen. In fact, there is a Counter breakaway window, so you could always position them all such that you get what you want, but I rather like the way it's laid out. Anyway, how many people actually USE the transport buttons? The controls have never been under the counter. Ever.

Are you talking about the slider that locates the cursor? That does appear to be missing. Yeah, it's handy. I suggest you write MOTU and ask for it to be put back. I'll do the same. Tell you what I'm more worried about: where are our mini-menus? Where are all the buttons at the top of the windows? Whew! If those are all gone, we're talking about some serious relearning. Serious new workflow configuration. Let's hope this is a pre-preview.

MOTU has always used customized windows, since back at the beginning of time. Let's hope that this is just a temporary look, inherited from Cocoa, and that they have not applied their customizations to the windows yet. Notice the RED-YELLOW-GREEN buttons at the tops of the windows. That suggests to me that they've done some serious rewriting here, and are still working on the interface. I think they will put back our mini-menus, buttons, and maybe even your slider before it ships. At least... I hope so. Otherwise, this is more change than I really want.

Shooshie

Shooshie · Post by **Shooshie** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 8:34 pm

blue wrote:
filtertone wrote:The redesign is nothing more than color-switching most of what's already there. There are no real structural changes to the GUI, as far as I can tell so far
Structurally it's pretty similar, but that's a good thing in my mind. I think DP's structure is superior to other DAWS I've used and I'm glad they didn't change it to match what everyone else is doing. Just my opinion, obviously.

I think the new GUI does much more than "color-switching." It address one of the biggest problems the app has faced over the last several years: monitor resolution has increased dramatically and DP's interface is not scalable. It was getting harder and harder to read. Now things look more naturally spaced. From what I can tell looking at the photos, it looks a lot easier to read.

I still feel like this redesign was borne more out of need to get the code up to date (and to appeal to new users) than to rethink the program. At least that's what I hope. In any event, I like it a lot so far. After checking out the photos, I opened up DP on my machine and it looked sooooooooo 1990s.

I agree with blue. Even about the 1990's thing.

DP has always been superior to the others in design and layout. After wrestling with Logic for a couple of months, I finally dumped it. Well... it's still on my drive, and still in my dock, but I don't open it anymore. Damn thing sucks, IMO. I'm spoiled to the mercedes/cadillac/nikon/Macintosh/iPhone/Neumann of DAWs: Digital Performer.

Shooshie

DP Fan · Post by **DP Fan** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 8:34 pm

Babz wrote:What I'm trying to discern from the grainy screenshots, is where is the Selection Bar? For me the Selection and Memory fields are the most important part of the transport (and pullout drawers).

Babz

The pullout drawers and transport were significantly reorganized...meaning the pullout drawers were gone. I did see the Selection/Memory fields from the DP5 pullout drawer to which you refer in the DP6 transport...

rcannonp · Post by **rcannonp** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 8:42 pm

Shooshie wrote:
ponytrack wrote:Hey, did anyone at the show happen to notice if those little yellow help balloons reared their ugly heads or were magic Dave's fingers too nimble?
Maybe that's where he earns his nickname.

No such luck. They're still there.

Shoosh

Maybe he needed them since it's a new version.

Shooshie · Post by **Shooshie** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 8:50 pm

FMiguelez wrote:.

Not that I'm complaining about it, but please remind me why someone would need to scale the TO vertically??
Would not that be almost a duplicate of the SE?? What could you accomplish now that you couldn't before??

Just curious...

Fernando, I was worried about that too until I saw the video. It's not like the SE. It's like a Quartz thing. Think "Preview" (the app), and resizing things in its windows. It's linearly squashable or stretchable. You just pull it down or push it up. It's literally a magnification or diminution of the window -- vertically. I think it's the absolute best way they could have done it, and once again I'm blown away at the surprises MOTU continues to pull out of their unicorn hat.

Shoosh

blue · Post by **blue** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 8:53 pm

Shooshie wrote:MOTU has always used customized windows, since back at the beginning of time. Let's hope that this is just a temporary look, inherited from Cocoa, and that they have not applied their customizations to the windows yet.

I don't know. I'm glad they are adopting a more standard, Mac look. MOTU's windows have always been functional, but they have gotten too cluttered over the years.

Shooshie wrote:Notice the RED-YELLOW-GREEN buttons at the tops of the windows. That suggests to me that they've done some serious rewriting here

That's what I was thinking too. As soon as I noticed the standard window buttons, I figured big changes had happened.

Shooshie wrote:I think they will put back our mini-menus, buttons

They appear to be already there, only in a different place. Take a look at this photo••¦

http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id ... 304&size=l

You can see, in the upper right hand corner, a little pulldown triangle. I think that's where the new mini-menus are. You can also see them in the sidebar panels on the right side of the consolidated window.

grimepoch · Post by **grimepoch** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 8:55 pm

Awesome news. I actually use both Digital Performer AND Logic 8 on a regular basis. As I say over and over, they each have their strengths and their weaknesses. I can say that these features being added ARE bringing them closer together. Especially the comping, burn to CD, pre-rendering, impulse response verb, ect. Totally awesome.

Also, I think the UI looks bad ass!

My only complaint, I still think they need 2 lines of text at the bottom of the mixer for each track. I did email them this suggestion.

Further, I do not like the auto grouping of MIDI and have always found it cludgy as it NEVER groups properly at least in the music I do and there is no way to control it. That is the one huge difference between logic and dp that drives me crazy. Not that I think the exact implementation in Logic is that great either. I'd like to see some kind of hybrid methodolgy allowing the best of both worlds.

Last, as to the comment of 64-bit support. Be aware that if you run a 64-bit DAW, ALL the plugins you want to use will need to be 64-bit as well. You cannot mix and match 32-bit and 64-bit just like you cannot mix PPC and Intel plugin and host. I only say this because you'd better start asking the people that make the plugins you use to also make 64-bit versions as well.

That said, damn I cannot wait to add DP6 into the mix. I am JUST about done with my first full length CD and it is in both DP and Logic and this will just make working with those tracks so much nicer now!!!!

zed · Post by **zed** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 9:21 pm

Shooshie wrote:Anyway, how many people actually USE the transport buttons? The controls have never been under the counter. Ever.

I hardly ever do, except when buggy software disables my keyboard commands. The real estate issue doesn't affect me at all as far as the transport is concerned, since I keep the transport on my second monitor. I love the new look of it, though. Kind of makes me want to press those buttons rather than using keyboard commands.

Shooshie wrote:Tell you what I'm more worried about: where are our mini-menus? Where are all the buttons at the top of the windows? Whew! If those are all gone, we're talking about some serious relearning.

Now, now Shooshie. You know they wouldn't take away our mini-menus. I'm sure they are in some convenient location ready to be accessed and even more efficient than we are already used to.

blue wrote:They appear to be already there, only in a different place. Take a look at this photo••¦

http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id ... 304&size=l

Holy crap. Seeing that picture just got me excited all over again. I absolutely LOVE the new GUI. I am ready to dump DP 5 right now.

Shooshie · Post by **Shooshie** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 9:35 pm

odarellmc wrote:i wish they would give you the option to have the mixng board take up the whole screen or show more smaller channels in one screen like you can with the meter bridge.

I'm not sure, but he did say that all windows will have uniform zooming abilities. I wonder if that includes windows like the Mixing Board, or if it's limited to editor windows?

blue · Post by **blue** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 9:46 pm

zed wrote:Holy crap. Seeing that picture just got me excited all over again. I absolutely LOVE the new GUI.

I know. The more I look at it, the more impatient I get. I want it now! They really opened it up a lot, got rid of some clutter and made it breathe. Some things will be in different places, but at least their placement will make more sense. So it seems.

I think this refresh will do a good job of attracting new users without alienating existing ones. Sure, it sucks to knock your knees at night in a new house, but you'll get over it quick if it's a better house.

BobK · Post by **BobK** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 9:53 pm

In a couple of the screenshots of the new comp feature, I noticed a square button labeled 'S' to the left of the play enable button (the triangle). It appears to be in the take tracks, but not in the top track, which is the comp.

Does anyone who saw the NAMM presentation know what that is? I really hope it's a Solo button - I've wanted Solo and Mute buttons in the SE for a long time.

Timeline · Post by **Timeline** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 9:53 pm

Shooshie wrote:
Timeline wrote:

Look closely at the transport control. I love the thin redesign but hate the controls being LEFT of center. They should be below the readouts always IMO if I had a choice.

This is pretty unacceptable to me unless you have a pref to reorder/swap machine controls as designed to the opposite side or even better, a transport breakaway.

Added: Where is the slider reposition bar? Did they take that away? If so that would be unfortunate as I have gotten used to using it. BTW I never use consolidated windows ever.
The thing about the controls and the transport is all wrong: look, if you put the controls below the readout (Counter), then one or the other, if not both, would have to shrink in size, or else you'd give up another half inch of screen. In fact, there is a Counter breakaway window, so you could always position them all such that you get what you want, but I rather like the way it's laid out. Anyway, how many people actually USE the transport buttons? The controls have never been under the counter. Ever.

That's right they haven't. I said for me because i keep the transport at the bottom of the screen always. My point is that everyone should not have to adhere to someone's version of how they work and Prefs are needed Shooshie. I would want to have it for my room bottom right. Somebody else may still use the controller at the top of the monitor
so I totally disagree that it's all wrong man.

As for the rest of your comments yes it appears you will have to go slugging for some of those buttons. I don't see quickscribe there and that bothers me but maybe the little arrows navigate to them.

My concept of the transport window would make all three sections easily break away without a pull down window to open to slow workflow.

Are you talking about the slider that locates the cursor?

Yes

That does appear to be missing. Yeah, it's handy. I suggest you write MOTU and ask for it to be put back. I'll do the same. Tell you what I'm more worried about: where are our mini-menus? Where are all the buttons at the top of the windows? Whew! If those are all gone, we're talking about some serious relearning. Serious new workflow configuration. Let's hope this is a pre-preview.

MOTU has always used customized windows, since back at the beginning of time. Let's hope that this is just a temporary look, inherited from Cocoa, and that they have not applied their customizations to the windows yet. Notice the RED-YELLOW-GREEN buttons at the tops of the windows. That suggests to me that they've done some serious rewriting here, and are still working on the interface. I think they will put back our mini-menus, buttons, and maybe even your slider before it ships. At least... I hope so. Otherwise, this is more change than I really want.

Shooshie

enigmatunes · Post by **enigmatunes** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 10:25 pm

Dubnick wrote:... but I do wish there were more, like fixes for long standing stuff like notes disappearing in the drum editor and the ability have work with aspects of the Beat Detection process in the graphic editor (editing transient analysis for instance) like with BD and EA in PT....

How do we know there aren't "fixes"? It seems to me (and I'm slightly new to the game and usually a Unicornation "lurker", so feel free to take this with a grain of salt) that MOTU has never touted bug fixes. It's more like *bam*, suddenly a new update is out and people slowly notice that certain things are working better than before. I'd wager that with a redesign of this magnitude there may be some "old issues" that have been completely fixed ... and probably some new ones to replace it (but hey, that's software for ya...)