Line6 vs. Vox

HCMarkus · Post by **HCMarkus** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 9:41 pm

Geez... sorry I digress. I'm very passionate about guitar amps and all of that.

No worries, James. Lots of good info there. Thanks!

rcannonp · Post by **rcannonp** » Thu Aug 30, 2007 6:31 pm

Line 6 has announced the Spider Valve.

Line 6 - Spider Valve

YouTube · Post by **James Steele** » Thu Aug 30, 2007 6:58 pm

rcannonp wrote:Line 6 has announced the Spider Valve.

Line 6 - Spider Valve

I'm reading it now, but I don't know to look at is as "innovation" or the clear admission that to produce the sound of a tube amplifer, you need a tube amplifier.

What's troublesome is considering it's basically a tube amp, it might sound really good. Which will suck because I swore I'd never play a Line 6 amp... at least back when they sounded like great big transistor radios.

rcannonp · Post by **rcannonp** » Thu Aug 30, 2007 7:07 pm

It sure looks a lot more interesting than a Flextone or Spider. It's not something that I really need, but if I was looking for a new amp, I would have to give it a serious look.

YouTube · Post by **James Steele** » Thu Aug 30, 2007 7:10 pm

Yeah... essentially it's a tube amp. I've heard the vettas and things like that and felt they could never capture the sound of a real tube amp. Apparently Line 6 felt the same way.

monkey man · Post by **monkey man** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 11:48 am

David Polich wrote:Here's where I've ended up - I record using the Tonelab, but I run a splitter and also record a dry unprocessed D.I. signal simultaneously, into DP. Then I have the option of "re-amping" the unprocessed track with either Guitar Rig 2 or Amplitube 2. I don't record directly into DP with Amp2 or GR2 inserted on the track, as the latency is too much of an issue (especially with something like 60 tracks already playing).

This is exactly what I've decided to do, David.
I'd planned on using my Onyx's auxiliaries for splitting the (desk's built-in DI) guitar signal for realtime monitoring and recording, with a 24i output as a reamp option.
Well, the 24i output works a treat for reamping from what I can tell, but the Onyx auxes leave a lot to be desired.

As I'll be doing the same thing with bass, I'll probably be looking at two simultaneously active, splitting DIs.
Any ideas on the best value for money/performance ratio out there would, as ever, be very much appreciated.

Resonant Alien · Post by **Resonant Alien** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 12:27 pm

"A'int nothing like the real thang babaaaay"

Digital sims are good when you're in a pinch or need to be super duper quiet, but everything else being equal, nothing can touch a real tube amp. It is one of the laws of physics and no amount of digital modeling will ever change it.

KarlSutton · Post by **KarlSutton** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 12:35 pm

I'm not a guitar player so forgive these questions - the only things I have for my Strat is a Pod 2.0 and a music man 212.

Should I be able to get a big crunchy sound out of the 212? It seems like I have to crank it WAY up to get any distortion out of it.

I've been thinking maybe I need a distortion pedal to run into it. But then I wondered if that is actually transistor distortion or tube?

Any thoughts?

Oh and I like the Radial Pro DI, seems like a good box. I have their reamp box as well.

YouTube · Post by **James Steele** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 2:50 pm

Resonant Alien wrote:"A'int nothing like the real thang babaaaay"

Digital sims are good when you're in a pinch or need to be super duper quiet, but everything else being equal, nothing can touch a real tube amp. It is one of the laws of physics and no amount of digital modeling will ever change it.

At a gut level I want to agree with you. Part of me thinks that perhaps some day some sort of super computer type algorhythm might be able to account and model all of the variables in REAL TIME that have to be accounted for to really and truly simulate the amp... then try to capture the way the amp reacts to various speakers and impedences at various volumes, etc. At some point, it's like you have to wonder why bother? That's sort of why, and forgive me, I never understood what was so cool all those years about Jan Hammer playing a keyboard like it was a guitar? It's an interesting exercise and cool that he could cop guitar licks and make it somewhat convincing, but WHY?

Resonant Alien · Post by **Resonant Alien** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 11:17 pm

James Steele wrote:
Resonant Alien wrote:"A'int nothing like the real thang babaaaay"

Digital sims are good when you're in a pinch or need to be super duper quiet, but everything else being equal, nothing can touch a real tube amp. It is one of the laws of physics and no amount of digital modeling will ever change it.
At a gut level I want to agree with you. Part of me thinks that perhaps some day some sort of super computer type algorhythm might be able to account and model all of the variables in REAL TIME that have to be accounted for to really and truly simulate the amp... then try to capture the way the amp reacts to various speakers and impedences at various volumes, etc.

Yeah, I guess one should never say never, but I would like to think that I would always be able to tell the difference - I can still tell the difference with the dig sims out there today, but who knows about the future, eh? But, there is something just so pure and so satisfying about having those tubes glowing in there like miniature space heaters

James Steele wrote:At some point, it's like you have to wonder why bother? That's sort of why, and forgive me, I never understood what was so cool all those years about Jan Hammer playing a keyboard like it was a guitar? It's an interesting exercise and cool that he could cop guitar licks and make it somewhat convincing, but WHY?

It was the 80s - lots of people have a lot of things to explain from that decade.

The best "keyboard impersonation of a guitar" though still goes to Jon Lord from Deep Purple. For years, I never knew that the entire beginning of "Space Truckin'" is just Lord on the organ through a Marshall, sans Ritchie Blackmore's guitar. I kind of felt cheated when I found out - all those years comping that intro lick thinking it was the guitar

YouTube · Post by **James Steele** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 11:20 pm

Resonant Alien wrote:It was the 80s - lots of people have a lot of things to explain from that decade.

Point taken.

chrispick · Post by **chrispick** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 11:44 pm

James Steele wrote:Yeah... essentially it's a tube amp. I've heard the vettas and things like that and felt they could never capture the sound of a real tube amp. Apparently Line 6 felt the same way.

Am I missing something? How does this new amp differ from a conventional Bogner with a bunch of Line 6 pedals in front of it?

YouTube · Post by **James Steele** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 11:50 pm

chrispick wrote:
James Steele wrote:Yeah... essentially it's a tube amp. I've heard the vettas and things like that and felt they could never capture the sound of a real tube amp. Apparently Line 6 felt the same way.
Am I missing something? How does this new amp differ from a conventional Bogner with a bunch of Line 6 pedals in front of it?

Beats me. That's pretty much what it looks like.

1pauper1 · Post by **1pauper1** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 6:25 am

i have the the pod pro xt, which i run thru a vox valvetronix power amp
for live jamming.best of both worlds.
as far as recording goes,tonelab is markedly inferior to its real-life
counterpart.
whereas the the pod pro xt has a direct studio setting that translates
very well into your daw (dp5).
the gearbox plugin for $199 gives you the ability to access all the toys in your pod xt right there in your daw .
i have all of the afore mentioned gear and software
but in my (not so humble) opinion, IK multimedia's amplitube2 is the best software guitar plugin.

monkey man · Post by **monkey man** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 10:07 am

Resonant Alien wrote:Digital sims are good when you're in a pinch or need to be super duper quiet, but everything else being equal, nothing can touch a real tube amp. It is one of the laws of physics and no amount of digital modeling will ever change it.

Remember, RA, almost everyone used to say this about reverb, and even optimists felt this was with good cause.
When Altiverb hit the scene, it was immediately clear that the optimists had won.
As you so wisely said, we should never say never.

I'm not saying, "Hold your breath", but it will happen, IMHO.

KarlSutton wrote:Oh and I like the Radial Pro DI, seems like a good box. I have their reamp box as well.

Thanks Karl. I'll check it out.