New Bugs in DP 1011 (current latest version)

[toodamnhip]

REALLY??

That alone would make me get DP10 right now and sing loudly with delight!

So I take it you've put DP's mixing/automation new capabilities to severe tests with your mixes and you are happy about the result?

Does it work equally well when snipping heavily automated sections?

What about Waves' plugins? Do the numerical values shown in DP now show the TRUE values and not that numerical nonsense anymore?

What about RELIABLE automation reading?
That was one of your biggest pet peeves. Does DP10 now read your "brute-force - all-parameter - crazy heavy-handed" ( ) automation techniques reliably every time?

So do you put your TDH seal of approval regarding those issues, or not quite yet?

What little I've seen and heard about DP10 so far, it definitely seems like MOTU took a leap (not step) in the right direction!

**Copy and pasting of automation has my "seal of approval". I can cut and paste VERY dense automation without issue.
** I am Very happy with the automation except for the new issue of strange results when dragging sections as opposed to copying and pasting
**No, snap shot still does not work on most 3rd party plugs unless one tabs through all numeric parameters BEFORE snap shot.
**As far as reading Waves data accurately, it is my understanding is that numeric patching of parameter has been partially fixed. One aspect reads correctly, one doesn't,t. I am not sure which.
** In 10.11, There is another issue where changing location points in loop mode glitches playback badly. This needs to be fixed. If one changes location points in any other memory mode, no glitch. In loop mode, terrible playback glitch.
**DP 10.11 is less efficient than DP 8.07. Tested beyond doubt on a new 2013 Trash can with a fresh install of everything. This means that going back to old, large files can be problematic. My solution is a B room stocked with older computers. The thing RUINING my older computers? Crazy authorization issues with older authorizor protocols and this new breed of "subscription based" authorizer, which is developers being irresponsible for users older masters. (another subject altogether).
** Play back glitch- sometimes DP won't play back the first moment of a file. It sounds like a pre buffering issues. Also, there are occasional weirdnesses when editing as the pre fill buffers switch to live mode. It would be really nice to be Able to shut off Next Gen pre gen 2 as many have requested.
**For all the flak I received stating this was an issue here at the forum, as if I was some sort of "outlier", I feel vindicated. As if MOTU finally changed it's automation programming, it shows it WAS broken or at least ill-designed. I was not crazy. If I was crazy, DP wouldn't have changed anything. (Well, I am crazy, but that's a different matter altogether )

[FMiguelez]

Thank you for the detailed review, TDH.

It all seems quite promising.

Also, if it turns out DP MASTERS the (former) automation issues (as it seems they have and are almost there), and it turns out other DAWs are clumsier or as bad as DP was, this would become a truly shinning point for DP (though there are a couple of DAWs that handle it correctly).

It looks like I will devote a part of the weekend to sort through backups and download/install Mojave and DP10 in all my computers. Really looking forward to this.

I really really like the direction MOTU is taking with DP. It's like it's turning into a much more powerful DAW Ableton-Live's style, PLUS all the traditional DP goodness we've all come to love and enjoy, all in one DAW

[jsg]

I uninstalled DP 10.11 and installed DP 10.01. Here is what I am experiencing with DP 10.11:

1. DP 10.11 often crashes, and crashes windows, upon exiting the program. DP 10.01 does not do this.
2. DP 10.11 counter (control panel) is very jerky and erratic, missing beats (visually) and wholly inaccurate. DP 10.01 does not have this issue.
3. DP 10.11 won't allow me to adjust the margins in Quickscribe. DP 10.01 Quickscribe margin editing works fine.

My system is a dedicated DAW, running Windows 10, 32GB memory, 2 fast SSD drives, i7-9700 CPU and ASUS Z-390-P motherboard. It is configures for digital audio and my Latency Monitor reports the machine is fully capable of handling audio, with the slowest driver being about .1 milliseconds in latency. I have almost nothing in memory other than DP and I am using the latest MOTU audio drivers with the 1248 audio interface. I am sending MIDI data out via an ethernet port using ipMIDI to one other machine dedicated to the VSL library.

My system is configured for audio; no drive indexing, all power features are set for maximum performance, the usual settings recommended for digital audio are all applied.

I doubt it's a problem with my system although of course anything is possible.

[HCMarkus]

Hey JSG...unfortunately, the Mac Folk (me included) have invaded and derailed your Windows thread. Sorry about that. I wish you were experiencing the same solid performance I have been enjoying with DP10.11 and hope things get sorted for you quickly.

[jsg]

I went back to DP 10.01 and everything working very smoothly. I'll send a log file to MOTU and hopefully they will sort this out..

Jerry
www.jerrygerber.com

[terrybritton]

Just so people do not get the idea that DP 10.11 is unstable in a Windows 10 environment, I am running it just fine, with 16 megs of RAM, two SSD's, using VEP to two slave computers, a massive template, etc. When I am using the VEP instruments I keep the buffers fairly high (512). When those are turned off via the Enable Track switch, I can go down to 128, though I rarely feel the need to. I never feel any inclination to downgrade. Things are running very well for me here.

Terry

[jsg]

Just so people do not get the idea that DP 10.11 is unstable in a Windows 10 environment, I am running it just fine, with 16 megs of RAM, two SSD's, using VEP to two slave computers, a massive template, etc. When I am using the VEP instruments I keep the buffers fairly high (512). When those are turned off via the Enable Track switch, I can go down to 128, though I rarely feel the need to. I never feel any inclination to downgrade. Things are running very well for me here.

Terry

Which audio driver are you using? Do you make use of QuickScribe? If so, have you tried adjusting the margins? I'm running Windows 10 with an Asus Z390-P motherboard, an i7-9700 CPU, 32GB of RAM, 2 fast SSD drives and I've configured Windows for digital audio. My DAW is a dedicated machine, it's only used for music production. Latency Monitor shows I have excellent latency, with my slowest driver clocking in a .1 milliseconds, well below the threshold for dropouts.

[daniel.sneed]

[...]Latency Monitor shows I have excellent latency, with my slowest driver clocking in a .1 milliseconds, well below the threshold for dropouts.

What is your buffer setting ?
AFAIK very short latency means very low buffer and very high CPU load.

[HCMarkus]

[...]Latency Monitor shows I have excellent latency, with my slowest driver clocking in a .1 milliseconds, well below the threshold for dropouts.

What is your buffer setting ?
AFAIK very short latency means very low buffer and very high CPU load.

+1

[toodamnhip]

Anyone else having issues with starting playback? At different times, DP will stutter or completely miss the first moments of audio when hitting play? Feels like a pre buffer issue to me.

[terrybritton]

Which audio driver are you using? Do you make use of QuickScribe? If so, have you tried adjusting the margins? I'm running Windows 10 with an Asus Z390-P motherboard, an i7-9700 CPU, 32GB of RAM, 2 fast SSD drives and I've configured Windows for digital audio. My DAW is a dedicated machine, it's only used for music production. Latency Monitor shows I have excellent latency, with my slowest driver clocking in a .1 milliseconds, well below the threshold for dropouts.

You never mention what your buffer settings are on your audio card. Lower buffer settings result in higher CPU demands, as it has to perform its realtime processing much faster on a smaller amount of buffered content, as there is less content and thus no lookahead surplus. That is a mistake many make, always thinking it has to be a "one buffer size to rule them all" kind of thing, but unless you are always recording percussion or piano or guitar playing along with other track output, low buffers are only a waste of CPU power. That is why I only use low buffer settings sparingly for very special purposes.

Terry

[terrybritton]

Also, having many plugins in operation at once can slow down the GUI because, logically, realtime audio plugin operations will always take precedence over GUI operations.

In your preferences for the track window (open it by double-clicking on any column heading in the tracks tab), make sure you have the Enable Track column enabled and showing (the column heading will be ENA for "Enabled") so you can turn off memory-hog items while doing things with the GUI like margins. This is very useful when you keep things organized in folders, as you can "power down" an entire folder of VSTi's or Auxes, for instance, with a single click. (Powering items back up again needs to be done individually if you do not wish to power up all of the items in that folder at once.) I have a special "Memory Hogs" folder where I put my most villainous VSTi's. If you are using V-racks, use several, one V-rack to each VSTi or group of VSTi's, so you can power down those from the Chunks window.

Of course, you are saying that with the exact same project having the exact same items enabled that you are having better performance in 10.01. I am not finding that to be true - 10.11 has improved everything. I run a MOTU 828 mk3 hybrid (via Firewire to a Siig/Texas Instruments chipset card), and see my signature for the computer specs. [EDIT - maybe you can't see the signature? Computer: Dell XPS 8700-1751BLK | Intel i7 4790@3.6Mhz | 16GB DDR3 1600Mhz | Windows 10 Pro x64 ]

Terry

[HCMarkus]

Anyone else having issues with starting playback? At different times, DP will stutter or completely miss the first moments of audio when hitting play? Feels like a pre buffer issue to me.

I have noted that, on occasion (more than once, but not every time), I get a brief stutter/dropout a few bars into a freshly opened project when playing for the first time, but this occurs only once. So it hasn't really bothered me, other than causing a momentary pang of concern each time it happens.

And today, I had a situation where the first CC64 Sus Pedal ON in a tune was always missed by Ivory. Adding a second track addressing the Ivory MIDI channel with the pedal ON event fixed the problem.

Like Terry reports above, I am seeing overall better performance with DP10.11. The only performance negative attributable to the new audio engine is the delay associated with record-enabling a VI. It takes longer now for a VI to be ready to roll once record is enabled.