MOTUnation.com

Hi.
I need to check a couple of files in Finale. I have the 2012 version, but when I want to run it, I get the following message>

To open "Finale 2012" you need to install the legacy Jave SE 6 runtime.
Click "more info| to visit the legacy Java SE 6 download website.

I'm under the impression that Java 6 was demoted from OS for being quite unsafe? Is this really so? Is it safe to install that Java?

Thank you!

I have it enabled to run CS6. Let's see what Mike says...

PS: The fact you are asking this question allows me to feel you are probably doing OK post-quake. This is good.

SUN was bought by Oracle who now makes the rules concerning Java. For that reason, neither Apple nor Microsoft are allowed to include it in the OS (with Apple, that means Mavericks on). Understand that and the rest of this makes sense.

JRE (Java Runtime Environment) 6 is 32 bit only. JRE 8 is 64 bit only. The two do not conflict. The error messages usually say “Java Toolkit...” and are wrong unless you are a Java developer, then download the JDK. Otherwise, you want the JRE.

Although Apple cannot include it, they released a tweaked build that lets 32bit apps that require JRE 6 to run in Sierra and backwards (and High Sierra, too). You want the 2015-001 version here.
https://support.apple.com/downloads/java

2014-001 works in Yosemite and Mavericks only; 2015-001 supersedes it.

The latest JRE 8 is downloaded from Oracle only. Many web sites and some apps require it though you can set browsers to ask before using.
http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/java/ ... 33155.html

Unfortunately, the JRE 8 installer wants to add a setting that makes Yahoo! Your default search engine. Unless you want this, make sure you uncheck that option when installing.

JRE 8 only installs a Java Control Panel in System Preferences. You can use it to check for the latest build and download the update if old.

MakeMusic also has JRE 6 2015-001 for download. I don’t recall the link but it’s the same build.

Can you confirm that Finale 2012 installs in Yosemite? 2011 does not although works if installed in Mavericks and the OS is updated (to Sierra in my case). The 2011 license manager does not pass the serial number correctly to MM’s license server — per MM, there is no workaround. I tried to install 2011 on my 10.13 test drive, currently on Yosemite to be upgraded to High Sierra next week.

2012 may crash if Human Playback is enabled. The workaround is to disable it.

Finale 25 does not require a JRE to be installed but versions 2014.5 and older do require JRE 6 as do Adobe CS6, MasterWriter 2 and many other 32bit apps.

Thank you so much for all this info, Markus and Mike.

With all this I will install it during the evening and report back.

Do you guys know how far back we can open old Finale files? I'm talking about opening Finale files from late last century. I hope Finale is as good as DP in back compatibility. I will find out soon enough, I suppose...

FMiguelez wrote:...
Do you guys know how far back we can open old Finale files? I'm talking about opening Finale files from late last century. I hope Finale is as good as DP in back compatibility. I will find out soon enough, I suppose...

If it's a .mus file, 2012 should open it, even if created by a newer version of Finale. 2014 & 25 create .musx but have the option of saving as 2012 compatible .mus.

Some very old files created in OS 8 or earlier might not have the .mus extension and there are workarounds.

If old files don't display properly, it's usually a font issue and substituting current Finale fonts is the first thing to try. Playback issues are often fixed by saving/exporting the data and opening in a new Finale file.

Here is the official Finale user support forum which is the best place to start if things don't behave:
https://makemusic.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/ ... -Questions

When you do a major OS upgrade, you normally have to reinstall both versions of the JRE. Since JRE 6 2015-001 works in High Sierra and 10.13 is the last OS to run 32bit apps without compromise (as Apple puts it), it's unlikely that there will ever be a later build.

2012 uses Java for MusicXML and SmartScore Lite. The version of MusicXML that shipped with 2012 is pretty old and quite limited compared to v.3 that shipped w/ 2014.5.

MusicXML 3.1, released three months ago, is a really nice upgrade. To update Finale 2012 (2009–2014.5) to this latest version, download the Dolet 7 plug-in. It's free and highly recommended.
http://www.musicxml.com/dolet-plugin/do ... or-finale/

Even though other notation apps don't support 3.1 yet, I have found it quite useful.

I've written this up a gazillion times, but probably Mike covered everything -- am too tired after so many BART delays tonight due to police actions and the like. The main point is that Java 6 by Apple and Java 7+ (8, and soon 9) from Oracle deliberately live in different parts of the OS so that they won't ever conflict by trying to share dependencies, libraries, files, etc.

Java on the desktop is safe -- it's in the browser where there can be issues, but that's also true of just about ANY browser technology. Apple's Java was "incomplete" in that it depended on some "special" files and so developers had to clone that file in a particular way in order to build desktop apps that were truly standalone. And even at that, you still had to depend on an installed Java.

So, apps like Illustrator, Oxygen XML Editor, and Finale, have some specific legacy functions (not even sure what they are, but probably file export to XML), that haven't been updated in years, and which therefore still depend on Apple's mothballed Java, which Apple does at least try to keep running on new OS updates knowing that this is the case.

mhschmieder wrote: So, apps like Illustrator, Oxygen XML Editor, and Finale, have some specific legacy functions (not even sure what they are, but probably file export to XML), that haven't been updated in years, and which therefore still depend on Apple's mothballed Java, which Apple does at least try to keep running on new OS updates knowing that this is the case.

Yes, 32 bit apps.

Interestingly, Finale Notepad 2012 requires JRE 6 also. It won’t install in High Sierra but still works if the OS is upgraded and 2015-001 is installed. MakeMusic pulled it and PrintMusic 2014.5 do to 10.13 incompatibility — I presume installation.

Once again, it looks like upgrading past the current OS is not a happening thing for me any time soon...

MIDI Life Crisis wrote:Once again, it looks like upgrading past the current OS is not a happening thing for me any time soon...

As far as I can tell, Finale 2014.5 should behave exactly as it does in Sierra as long as it is already installed. If there's anything in particular you want me to test, let me know and I can verify. You have my email address if you need to attach a test file.

Thanks Mike. The lost license on reboot for DP is, of course, a deal breaker with High Sierra. That'll get fixed... I hope. Then again, things are humming along in Sierra so why fix it if it ain't broken? Anything earth shattering in High Sierra I just have to have?

MIDI Life Crisis wrote:Thanks Mike. The lost license on reboot for DP is, of course, a deal breaker with High Sierra. That'll get fixed... I hope. Then again, things are humming along in Sierra so why fix it if it ain't broken? Anything earth shattering in High Sierra I just have to have?

Perhaps, I updated to keep current with iOS 11 with its new storage sharing flexibility. There are a number of OS bug fixes but none have affected me.

DP is running faster on APFS. I keep my login in Notes so I can copy and paste on reboot.

Yahoo email is having minor issues — can't tell if it's 10.13 or Yahoo. I'm getting my email but can't send to Spam or delete. I'll give it a few days — I can always delete IMAP email on my iPad to have it gone from my Mac.

Adding an APFS partition is quite easy. Deleting an empty APFS partition that I created was a major PIA involving many steps running Disk Utility in the GUI and Terminal (both were required)... but I did it. I just wanted my 200G back.

Although I don't have CS6, my other 32 bit Adobe apps are fine.

For all of the talk, talk, talk, 10.13 is a minor upgrade for the average end user. Network admins have their work cut out for them as APFS has major changes under the hood where most mortals will never need look. It's the future for some very good reasons.

The big one will be 10.14 if it kills 32 bit.

mikehalloran wrote: DP is running faster on APFS. I keep my login in Notes so I can copy and paste on reboot.

It IS running faster, and loading way faster. I also keep my log-in on a Stickies note, so it takes me 5 seconds longer to launch in the mornings: not a deal-breaker for me. The advantages outweigh this tiny glitch, which MOTU will surely address shortly.

Finale 2014.5 is the biggest concern. I can't go to F25 (no score to picture).