Adjusting Headroom - How to move all volume input at once?

[Tritonemusic]

Anybody mention holding down the W key and pulling faders down in the mixer?

Dave

I don't think that works correctly (unless all of your volume levels are static) because if you have automation drawn in, and you stop playback, all the values jump back to the original settings when resuming playback. If you do the "W" trick during playback, than the automation is ignored altogether. Sorry if I'm wrong. If so, please let me know because I love learning new things.

[Dan Walsh]

I don't think that works correctly (unless all of your volume levels are static) because if you have automation drawn in, and you stop playback, all the values jump back to the original settings when resuming playback. If you do the "W" trick during playback, than the automation is ignored altogether. Sorry if I'm wrong. If so, please let me know because I love learning new things.

That's what I thought too. But now I'm all ears....

[wurliuchi]

What I don't like about using W is I have found it not be proportional with all tracks. When some tracks are over unity and some below it can get messed up. Maybe they fixed/changed that in 6 or 7 (I doubt it). I haven't checked 6 and I don't have 7.

Going back to changing the automation for a group of tracks, just as interest, you could use W to change automation for a group of tracks by holding down the W key and setting one of the tracks to Trim Latch (battling the jumpy menu), setting automation to record and adjusting the fader the amount you want to change (all this while still holding down the W key) and then playing the entire sequence. Weird, but it works.

[Tim]

Yeah... the 'w' key does not move all faders in proportion. I use Change Continuous Data a lot, for global trim, and for tweaking automation nodes in tracks.

[Shooshie]

What I don't like about using W is I have found it not be proportional with all tracks. When some tracks are over unity and some below it can get messed up. Maybe they fixed/changed that in 6 or 7 (I doubt it). I haven't checked 6 and I don't have 7.

I thought they fixed that a while back. Last time I checked, it was all working; at least it was working the way I like it.

[edit] my post got cut short while ago. Wife wanted coffee, and I'm the coffee maker. The way I think the faders should work is that when you hold the W (or make a group) and move a fader, the others all move in proportion such that they meet, ultimately at infinity, and at the upper end of the scale. (or is it Unity Gain where they meet?) Anyway, we had debates about that a few years ago; some don't like it that way and think that when one fader reaches the end, they should all stop moving since the one cannot move anymore. I say that as long as it remembers the proportion between those faders, they should all meet at infinity with no premature stopping of faders just because one has reached the end of its throw.

That is, in fact, the way DP's faders have always worked, and that's how they work now, with the one exception being a few versions ago when there was a bug. In that bug, you'd reach infinity one at a time, until they were all there, and then it forgot the proportion if you moved them back up. So, they came down in proportion, then went up in unison. That was the bug, and it has been fixed. [/edit]

[HCMarkus]

Just drop the master fader level a tad and be done with it.

Shooshie is right: Magic D has advised us repeatedly as long as there are no physical outputs or plug ins that are clipping, DP will not clip internally. (note: adjusting a channel fader level doesn't alter pre-fader levels, so plug-in clipping is not the question at hand)

[wurliuchi]

Just drop the master fader level a tad and be done with it.

Sure, that works, but for me, I've never felt like it was a good habit to get into. Seems lazy.

But true confessions: I have used the Trim plug as Frodo suggested or the output of a limiter to lower levels when I got tired of messing with the individual tracks and felt the mix was right. I know it makes no difference, but I always want/like the master fader at unity.

Shooshie is right: Magic D has advised us repeatedly as long as there are no physical outputs or plug ins that are clipping, DP will not clip internally. (note: adjusting a channel fader level doesn't alter pre-fader levels, so plug-in clipping is not the question at hand)

Yes, I've read that and done the tests, and that's true. But still, I watch levels like a hawk and I do not allow 24-bit fixed integer overage (I think that's when a track's red clip light comes on) even if it's not really clipping in the true sense. It just seems so sloppy.

Anyway, that's just my preferences.

[wurliuchi]

What I don't like about using W is I have found it not be proportional with all tracks. When some tracks are over unity and some below it can get messed up. Maybe they fixed/changed that in 6 or 7 (I doubt it). I haven't checked 6 and I don't have 7.

I thought they fixed that a while back. Last time I checked, it was all working; at least it was working the way I like it.

[edit] my post got cut short while ago. Wife wanted coffee, and I'm the coffee maker. The way I think the faders should work is that when you hold the W (or make a group) and move a fader, the others all move in proportion such that they meet, ultimately at infinity, and at the upper end of the scale. (or is it Unity Gain where they meet?) Anyway, we had debates about that a few years ago; some don't like it that way and think that when one fader reaches the end, they should all stop moving since the one cannot move anymore. I say that as long as it remembers the proportion between those faders, they should all meet at infinity with no premature stopping of faders just because one has reached the end of its throw.

That is, in fact, the way DP's faders have always worked, and that's how they work now, with the one exception being a few versions ago when there was a bug. In that bug, you'd reach infinity one at a time, until they were all there, and then it forgot the proportion if you moved them back up. So, they came down in proportion, then went up in unison. That was the bug, and it has been fixed. [/edit]

Ah, a lot of this seems much more familiar to me now. Especially the part about it getting messed up after going down to infinity and then back up (though I can't think of any situation when I would actually do that with a group) and if I did it would be a very rare occurrence.

Thanks, Shooshie, I will have to check out using "W" again. Though I think using Control N is better because you don't have to change which tracks are in the Mixer, you can just click on the faders you want.

[Frodo]

Well now, this all has me thinking: what would simplify this process in terms of a feature request?

1. A single command to change all automation modes in one fell swoop? This would include changing the mode to Trim or Trim Latch and back again (shift-option-'character' as a toggle, for example).

2. An entirely new menu to address all/most needs with this?

3. A feature/menu which would address this process in both the SE and the Mixer-- perhaps this would be an extension of #2?

Dunno. Whaddaya think?

[wurliuchi]

Well now, this all has me thinking: what would simplify this process in terms of a feature request?

1. A single command to change all automation modes in one fell swoop? This would include changing the mode to Trim or Trim Latch and back again (shift-option-'character' as a toggle, for example).

2. An entirely new menu to address all/most needs with this?

3. A feature/menu which would address this process in both the SE and the Mixer-- perhaps this would be an extension of #2?

Dunno. Whaddaya think?

"Change Continuous Data" works fine for me for adjusting existing automation in one shot. Trim or Trim Latch when time is running is great. Use it all the time. I don't have a problem with either of those. What I would like to see is a better/easier way of changing static fader (and other parameter) levels for a group of tracks.

What I think would be a great addition, and a way to make everything easier, is a way of selecting tracks in the mixer. And then maybe add the feature "Change Static Level." Think how easy that would make things. And if you accidentally select a track that has automation on a parameter you change, it doesn't matter because the automation is still there so you can't really mess it up.

Just thinkin' out loud.

[Frodo]

Just thinkin' out loud.

... and quite constructively!

[wurliuchi]

Just thinkin' out loud.

... and quite constructively!

Only because I'm half asleep. It just took me three tries to spell "because" correctly.

[Shooshie]

By the way, privately Frodo reminded me that we're talking about automation, not just fixed levels, so the W method has to be combined with something like switching all the automation modes to Trim Latch, then lowering them all by the desired amount and letting it run to the end. Of course, it's even easier if you just select everything, then lower the automation (Audio CC#7) through the Change Continuous Data dialog (Regions/)

I've been doing tabs tonight. I command-click on a dozen threads and leave them open while working (getting the house ready for kids coming home and holidays). Periodically I stop by and write an answer. By that time I've forgotten pertinent details in the original post, so I may answer the question, but not the RIGHT question.

Just 'splainin'

Shoosh

[wurliuchi]

By the way, privately Frodo reminded me that we're talking about automation, not just fixed levels, so the W method has to be combined with something like switching all the automation modes to Trim Latch, then lowering them all by the desired amount and letting it run to the end. Of course, it's even easier if you just select everything, then lower the automation (Audio CC#7) through the Change Continuous Data dialog (Regions/)

I've been doing tabs tonight. I command-click on a dozen threads and leave them open while working (getting the house ready for kids coming home and holidays). Periodically I stop by and write an answer. By that time I've forgotten pertinent details in the original post, so I may answer the question, but not the RIGHT question.

Just 'splainin'

Shoosh

The first question was about lowering all tracks that had existing automation by the same amount, and Change Continuous Data worked for the OP. Then he had a subsequent question about lowering all tracks that didn't have automation, so we're on point.

By the way, tell me, please. When you're holding down the "W" key and trying to change the automation mode does the menu jump around on you?

[wurliuchi]

By the way, tell me, please. When you're holding down the "W" key and trying to change the automation mode does the menu jump around on you?

Never mind. It was impossible to highlight some of the choices so it had me worried, but it doesn't matter that it jumps around. Whatever I put the cursor over, no matter if it highlights or not, that's what is selected.