Radikal SAC 2.2 in Leopard- anybody doing it?

[ghobish]

Is anybody successfully getting the Radikal USB Miidi Driver to function under Leopard? It won't load for me.

It seems to load on restart, but before the login window- in fact before the gray startup screen goes to blue- the phrase "Stall_Uk" appears in the LCD display and it never loads. Under this condition the controller doesn't show in System Profiler and the built-in USB hub is useless.

Note that this is under a fresh install of Leopard 10.5.1 (yeah I checked and it doesn't work in 10.5.0 either) with the only third party driver installed is the Radikal. It's on a dual G5 2GHz w/ 5GB RAM.

Works completely reliably under Tiger.

[billf]

Is anybody successfully getting the Radikal USB Miidi Driver to function under Leopard? It won't load for me.

It seems to load on restart, but before the login window- in fact before the gray startup screen goes to blue- the phrase "Stall_Uk" appears in the LCD display and it never loads. Under this condition the controller doesn't show in System Profiler and the built-in USB hub is useless.

Note that this is under a fresh install of Leopard 10.5.1 (yeah I checked and it doesn't work in 10.5.0 either) with the only third party driver installed is the Radikal. It's on a dual G5 2GHz w/ 5GB RAM.

Works completely reliably under Tiger.

Hi Gary,

I have kept Tiger because of the same issue. If magicd happens upon this thread, I'm wondering if DP6 will fix this issue.

[dbender]

I saw this come up on the MOTU mailing lists, and glad to see this issue has migrated here.

I really like my SAC. Had it for years. It's key that DP continue to support it for me. It was expensive, I like it, and have gotten used to usind DP w/ it. I don't want a DP upgrade to make it obsolete, even though there are other options (i.e., spend more $ and get an MCU)

I was happy to see that MOTU updated it's control surface driver for the SAC to continue to function when DP 5 first came out, and then was very relieved thereafter when the move to Intel chips was made, and am just really happy that right through DP 5.12 (current DP version I'm using w/ OSX 10.4.10, have'nt gone to 5.13 yet).

It is MOTU it seems that's doing this, not Radikal. Radikal is, at least when it comes to the SAC, effectively defunct, and hasn't updated it's firmware since OSX first came out. The key is that MOTU continue to update DP's control surface driver file for the SAC, so it will continue to work with DP as DP is upgraded. (i.e., /Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/MOTU Control Surface/SAC DP Driver.bundle [v 3.2.1 w/ created date 4/6/07]).

I've been holding off on Leopard for all the usual compatibility concerns we've all had, but SAC compatibility is a real biggie for me. I'm at the point now where all my other concerns in this regard have been cleared, except for the SAC.

So I'm wondering and really concerned if any other brother/sister SAC owners have gotten it to work in Leopard with DP 5.13??? I saw this come up on the MOTU mailing list last night, and I think someone there said it worked initially for a while, but then stopped for some reason. This made me optimistic that maybe it could possibly work in leopard. GHobish, was that you? I think you made a post there about this.

GHobish -- sounds like you use the USB function. I stopped using it long ago, have the SAC hooked up via MIDI (not usb), and have had no problems. Seems like you're using the SAC USB hub feature -- maybe that's what Leopard is balking at. Have you tried setting it up via MIDI connection instead?

I wish someone who knows about all this can contribute and illuminate use SAC owners on this.

Thanks

PS GHObish, greetings, brother, from the Inner Sunset

[billf]

I really like my SAC.

The SAC is a great unit. The way my desk is setup, the SAC footprint is perfect.

[dbender]

I really like my SAC.

The SAC is a great unit. The way my desk is setup, the SAC footprint is perfect.

same here

[ghobish]

Here too, I can have my keyboard right in front of the SAC.

However, I have to say I don't believe it's MOTU's issue, not directly, anyway. The whole unit will not load in Leopard. I can tell because I have a HASP key in one of the USB slots. It lights up when you boot up the Mac, but it's extinguished before the spinning wheel shows up on the gray startup screen. The USB hub in the SAC is useless unless the driver fully loads, although the hub shows up in System Profiler; however, the "SAC - Software Assigned Controller" is NOT in System Profiler.

Further, when I first loaded up Leopard it actually DID work for a couple of days and then just stopped. I did a clean reinstall of Leopard but have not been able to get it working again.

Nothing wrong with the firmware- it still runs just fine in Tiger, and the MOTU driver works just fine for me in 5.13 under that condition..

[ghobish]

GHobish -- sounds like you use the USB function. I stopped using it long ago, have the SAC hooked up via MIDI (not usb), and have had no problems. Seems like you're using the SAC USB hub feature -- maybe that's what Leopard is balking at. Have you tried setting it up via MIDI connection instead?

I wish someone who knows about all this can contribute and illuminate use SAC owners on this.

Thanks

PS GHObish, greetings, brother, from the Inner Sunset

Greetings to you too!

Yes, I am using it via USB. I actually have no other MIDI interface. I mostly mastering and mixing, and rarely use MIDI at all; when I do, the Radikal serves as my interface.

[dbender]

Try not using the usb functionality. I haven't in years, so I'm sketchy on details (there was a SACk usb driver file I think I may have delted when I stopped using the USB when MacIntel came out -- the SAC I've been told won't work via USB under MacIntel -- do you have MacIntel??), but anyway, I have the SAC hooked up via MIDI to my MOTU MIDI express MIDI interface, and it works fine.

I think the usb thing with your set up might possibly be related to the problem.

Too bad you don't have a MIDI interface to try it out. A 1x1 port (e.g., M-Audio Midisport) is only $40, so you wouldn't have to get a more expesive interface if that's your only piece of MIDI gear --that is, of course, IF the SAC can work under Leopard, at least via MIDI (i.e., instead of via usb).

The SAC usb driver file was writen and updated by Radikal, until it stopped supporting the SAC. But, DP's driver file for the SAC (Macintosh HD:Library:Audio:Plug-Ins:MOTU Control Surface:SAC DP Driver.bundle) seems to be something that MOTU has updated -- the created and mod dates for the one I'm using now are in 4/07 & 5/07 -- long after Radikal stopped supporting the SAC -- so my guess is that the updating of that file, which is the key file we need for the SAC to work with DP, has been done by MOTU as it has released DP updates.

So, hopefully, the SAC can work via MIDI in DP 5.13 under Leopard -- anyone tried?? I'd love to know before upgrading to Leopard.

Thanks.

[ghobish]

Try not using the usb functionality. I haven't in years, so I'm sketchy on details (there was a SACk usb driver file I think I may have delted when I stopped using the USB when MacIntel came out -- the SAC I've been told won't work via USB under MacIntel -- do you have MacIntel??), but anyway, I have the SAC hooked up via MIDI to my MOTU MIDI express MIDI interface, and it works fine.

I think the usb thing with your set up might possibly be related to the problem.

Too bad you don't have a MIDI interface to try it out. A 1x1 port (e.g., M-Audio Midisport) is only $40, so you wouldn't have to get a more expesive interface if that's your only piece of MIDI gear --that is, of course, IF the SAC can work under Leopard, at least via MIDI (i.e., instead of via usb).

(snip)

So, hopefully, the SAC can work via MIDI in DP 5.13 under Leopard -- anyone tried?? I'd love to know before upgrading to Leopard.

Thanks.

No, not on Macintel yet- this is on my dual 2GHz G5. I'd like to try the MIDI experiment before shelling out for a 1x1- maybe you'd like to visit my studio in Bayshore with a MIDI interface and we could both find out!

There is a Radikal USB driver that hasn't been updated since 2003. That's what I have running in Tiger, and what I've loaded into Leopard. Again, the oddest thing is that it was working and then just stopped!

But if it's true that it will never work on a Mac Pro, it seems we'd just be putting off the inevitable. I do have a MBP we could try that out on... PM me if you're interested in trying it.

[dbender]

I had just checked your website......saw the phone # and will give a ring tomorrow

[dbender]

PS -- and will update here with further findings after the call (want to correct some things for the edification of other bretheren SAC owners following this, such as, among other things, it does work w/ MacIntel via MIDI -- e.g., I'm running the SAC just fine via MIDI, using a MacBook, DP 5.12, the above-referenced control surface driver file with the created date in 4/07 [probably installed by a DP update], in OSX 10.4.10)

[davedempsey]

SAC working fine here on Mac Pro 10.4.11 via MIDI - USB hub still functioning for iloks etc.
Haven't finished my Leopard installation as yet but I'd be suprised if it doesn't work via MIDI with the DP driver.
Sure wish Radikal would write a new USB driver.

[dbender]

SAC working fine here on Mac Pro 10.4.11 via MIDI - USB hub still functioning for iloks etc.

Do you mean that you have the SAC connected via MIDI (and NOT via usb), but can still use the usb ports on the SAC for dongles?? How can that be, I wonder, if you have no usb cable connecting the SAC and the computer, if your SAC is hooked up soley via MIDI??

[dbender]

... but I'd be suprised if it doesn't work via MIDI with the DP driver.

That's what I'm thinking, and hoping, as long as that motu control surface driver file for it keeps getting updated and will be updated in DP 6, as it seems it has been, by MOTU. I say ••œseems••

[dbender]

Well...... the upshot seems to be:

- the SAC does work w/ DP via MIDI on MacIntel under 0S X 10.4 (but not via usb)

- still no reports on whether this is also true under Leopard (Anyone??)

- even though there is no support from Radikal anymore, that seems to affect only the ability to use the SAC via usb (which, as best I can recall now, was lost in the move to Tiger from Panther), as opposed to not being able to use the thing at all, since it was Radikal that made and supported the usb driver file for the SAC (but, as discussed above, it seems that MOTU has been updating the DP control surface driver file for the SAC as DP has been updated, as indicated by ever-newer created and modified dates on those files after doing DP updates)

- so, if this is still true with DP 6, as it has been up through DP 5, then we should still be ok using the SAC via w/ DP 6 under Leopard (this would be better indicated now if someone could let us know here if they can use their SAC 2.2 w/ DP via MIDI under Leopard now -- anyone??)

-- these are the 2 real questions:

[1] Is SAC ok via MIDI w/ DP now under Leopard? (hopefully someone can let us know now)

and

[2] Will SAC be ok via MIDI w/ DP 6 under Leopard (unknown, of course, until DP 6 comes out, but at least it would be nice to know #1 now, so I can confidently upgrade to Leopard)

Hope this helps other SAC devotees......