Apple Silicon Native Plugins and VIs

[dix]

Zynaptics Adaptiverb, while supposedly M1 native seems worse processor-wise than it did on my cMP actually. I can still only afford one instance per project on my M1 Max. I’d be curious about other’s M1 experience with that plugin as well.

No issues like that yet, my only disappointment is that certain plug ins may have reluctantly ported to M1 and VST3, but they didn't bother fixing their GUI's and they're tiny tiny tiny still! ( I'm looking at you MOTU with the Mx4! )

Actually, I was wrong. Zynaptiq plugins are not yet M1 native. The latest updates just make them Monterey compatible. Hopefully Adaptiverb will get much more efficient once it's M1 native.

I keep my displays scaled down (up?) to 2048x1152, and DP at 100% scaling largely because not everything is scalable. Only the display that the movie goes on is at full scale.

[dix]

So crucial plugins/instruments etc. not working with AS (native or Rosetta2) and/or Monterey, or MIA for me are:

[EDITED 12/4/21]
- MAS VEP. VEP is broken in Rosetta2 with Monterey too. [Now Monterey compatible]
- GRM suite.
- Soundtoys! Not working in Monterey reportedly. [only for some users - many are not having issues with Monterey]
- ProSoundEffects Search and SoundQ database apps

Any other must-have plugins etc. out there? I'm sure I'm missing a lot of them.

Updating now that I'm using an M1 Mac

- MAS VEP. VEP is broken in Rosetta2 with Monterey too. 12/21: AU version now working in Monterey via R2. Still no MAS
- GRM suite. 12/21: all working in via R2
- Soundtoys! Not working in Monterey reportedly. 12/21: Confirmed. Most Soundtoys plugins are not passing DP's AU exam
- ProSoundEffects Search and SoundQ database apps. 12/21: Both are working via R2

New additions 12/21

- iZotope Stratus 3D doesn't pass DP's AU exam. iZotope says they're not going to update it for M1. It and all the Exponential Audio reverbs are officially abandon-ware...so I tried:
- LiquidSonics reverbs. Cinema Rooms and Lustrous Plate stereo versions pass exam and are working. BUT no surround versions are available.
- Slate Virtual Tape emulation (my only Slate plugin) doesn't pass DP's AU exam
- Ivory doesn't doesn't pass DP's AU exam

Virtually all of these DP exam failures, are passing in other apps. I'm not sure why that would be. I'm curious if any other DP users running Monterey on an M1 are seeing the same failures.

[monkey man]

I know for-sure you'll have to wait for SoundToys; they shouldn't work right now anyway, so you can scratch that off your list of "problem" brands.

[dix]

Soundtoys says their plugins should work right now: https://www.soundtoys.com/m1-capability/

[Michael Canavan]

Soundtoys says their plugins should work right now: https://www.soundtoys.com/m1-capability/

That's the same blurb they've had forever. Honestly I'm maybe a bit of a pedant but it's filled with bad information.
First off, they're kinda obviously waiting on Pro Tools to go native, so although they state they have internal builds of their plug ins running on M1 they flatly say they're waiting on iLok DAWs to be M1 native:

In addition to the DAWs that support our plug-ins, we also rely on companies like Pace for their iLok license management tools – we cannot ship Apple Silicon/ARM native software until the DAWs and the tools we rely on have also made the transition.

They then go on to state that DP is not M1 native. This is pretty dumb because Reaper just got out of beta recently, and it's listed as fully supported.

On top of that this last paragraph is just bass ackwards!

Using Soundtoys in DAWs with native M1 support:

Logic Pro X, Garageband, and Adobe Audition are all capable of running natively on Apple silicon, so if you are trying to use Soundtoys plug-ins in these DAWs you will need to manually set them to open using Rosetta.

a. To check this – find your DAW in your applications folder.

b. Right-click on it and click “Get Info”

c. In the info menu find the “Open Using Rosetta” option and check it off.

If you had previously opened Logic without Rosetta enabled, you may need to rescan for Soundtoys plug-ins.

You will manually need to set them to open up in native Apple Silicon mode, the AU Universal Binary plug in will open in Rosetta. Here's the clincher, so far no DAW I've installed has opened up in Rosetta, you have to manually change it to running in Rosetta via the method they describe... of course checking the Get Info box "Open in Rosetta".

It's like they completely mixed up the two methods to get plug ins working in Apple Silicon; running the whole DAW in Rosetta, and running the DAW natively with AU versions running in Rosetta.

Anyway yeah I really do like their plug ins, but this is kind of disheartening.

[HCMarkus]

Just sent SoundToys this:

Just an FYI, Digital Performer 11 is Apple Silicon Native. It is not listed as such on your website. I'm still running an old 5,1 Mac Pro with your great plugins, but am looking forward to moving to an M1 Mac running DP in 2022, so I appreciate your efforts in this regard. Thanks!

[Michael Canavan]

Just sent SoundToys this:

Just an FYI, Digital Performer 11 is Apple Silicon Native. It is not listed as such on your website. I'm still running an old 5,1 Mac Pro with your great plugins, but am looking forward to moving to an M1 Mac running DP in 2022, so I appreciate your efforts in this regard. Thanks!

You're a better man than I am, I'll send them a suggestion to update that page in the other places I mentioned as well.

[HCMarkus]

You're a better man than I am, I'll send them a suggestion to update that page in the other places I mentioned as well.

I wouldn't have looked if all y'all hadn't pointed it out. So thanks!

I always figure it is a good idea to remind our favorite plugin companies that DP users buys their stuff, too.

[HCMarkus]

And here is Soundtoys' response re: DP11 M1 Native...

Thanks for letting us know about this, I'll be sure to pass this along to our Web Development team.

Hopefully we'll be releasing an update for native M1 support very soon- we've got an internal (not for release) version that we're currently testing, which is scheduled to be released once we are confident that it is fully compatible and stable in the M1 environment.

We will be sure to shout this news to the world when it comes, so if you'd like to receive our promotional emails, you can sign up either by creating a Soundtoys account or by entering your email address in the box at the bottom of our homepage.

Thanks again for sharing this with us, I hope you have a great rest of your day!

[dix]

My issue with SoundToys (with them or MOTU m'be) is that the statement says "Soundtoys 5 plug-ins are fully tested and compatible with Apple Silicon computers through Rosetta 2", but that is not the case with DP running natively. Very few of Soundtoys plugins pass examination in DP. Hopefully this will become a moot point soon enough.

First off, they're kinda obviously waiting on Pro Tools to go native, so although they state they have internal builds of their plug ins running on M1 they flatly say they're waiting on iLok DAWs to be M1 native

Had not heard this about ProTools. The availability of a native iLok is the stated holdup for a lot of developers, but if they're waiting for Avid to make a move this could be a long winter.

[Michael Canavan]

Dix they state it right on that page.
That DAWs that use iLok need to go native. Only one DAW I know of uses iLok.

[dix]

Dix they state it right on that page.
That DAWs that use iLok need to go native. Only one DAW I know of uses iLok.

ProTools only recently became Big Sur compatible! If SoundToys is waiting on Avid to go native, who is waiting on Pace to go native we could be looking at fall 2022 or later for native versions of ST plugins.

Actually, I'd be fine with Rosetta 2 compatibility with DP (running native) for the time being.

[dix]

I'm getting a little frustrated with MOTU support. I can't seem to extract a clear answer from them as to whether the plugins not passing DP's exam on my system are also not passing on other's systems. They're implying that whether plugins will pass or not can be the luck-of-the-draw, but haven't yet confirmed if the specific plugins I'm asking about (EchoBoy Jr, Slate VTM, Ivory) pass for them, or for other users. Either way hearing that "luck" is a factor isn't really what you want to hear from tech support. ...there are other plugins not passing, but EchoBoy Jr, Slate VTM and Ivory are involved with a lot of past projects and I'd like to have access asap.

If any M1 users can let me know whether or not these plugins pass exam in DP I'd appreciate it. ....surely, it's not just me and Michael Canavan who have waded into the M1 waters with DP (though your input has been crucial in my transition, Michael. Thx).

[Michael Canavan]

I'm getting a little frustrated with MOTU support. I can't seem to extract a clear answer from them as to whether the plugins not passing DP's exam on my system are also not passing on other's systems. They're implying that whether plugins will pass or not can be the luck-of-the-draw, but haven't yet confirmed if the specific plugins I'm asking about (EchoBoy Jr, Slate VTM, Ivory) pass for them, or for other users. Either way hearing that "luck" is a factor isn't really what you want to hear from tech support. ...there are other plugins not passing, but EchoBoy Jr, Slate VTM and Ivory are involved with a lot of past projects and I'd like to have access asap.

If any M1 users can let me know whether or not these plugins pass exam in DP I'd appreciate it. ....surely, it's not just me and Michael Canavan who have waded into the M1 waters with DP (though your input has been crucial in my transition, Michael. Thx).

So far I haven't installed many Rosetta AU plug ins, just the ones I absolutely need, (Amplitube and VEP), but I can take a look. I get why they would say it's hit or miss though, the Rosetta AU capability is an OS level support, it's not their code, so they can't tweak it to fix it. Most developers weren't aware that DAWs outside of Logic could use the AU Rosetta support in Mac OS at first. so it's all new territory.

Plus, some developers have had to update their software for Rosetta AU support, Soundtoys obviously have not. They say it's due to the certain tags they use with iLock. I just extracted the Echoboy jr. component and tried running it in DP, it does not pass validation here as well, but I was able to instantiate it ignoring the warnings. It also opens in Logic Pro as an "incompatible" plug in.

[dix]

Thanks for checking out Echo Boy Jr! Although MOTU said SoundTools were working on M1s for them, I couldn’t get them to check if ALL ST plug-ins we’re working (about half do, half don’t here), so it’s appreciated. I’ve tried using Echo Boy Jr and VTM while invalidated, but they get weird….causing beach balls etc when open adjusting, but seem okay so far while closed. Guess that’s the workaround.

Thanks again.