MOTUnation.com

Kudos to MOTU for this policy, I'd say. I think it's a good compromise - the "used" version has no upgrade path or tech support. So it really is a "lesser" option - making it ideal for someone strapped for cash who needs a certain app now and wants to do the right thing, but can't afford the full monty just yet. I'd be surprised if the same thing works for non-iLok MOTU software, for the reasons gavspen mentions. But hats off to them for this reasonable approach re. iLok'd software.

My legal instincts tell me that MOTU cannot really make a distinction whether a program is protected by iLok or Key Code. If the EULA is identical in spirit and content, it would follow that the purchasers would have the same rights as other purchasers with similarly worded agreements. I won't really be selling my old software that way, although for full purchase upgrades such as Adobe required for their software in the past, it was legal to sell the old product with the old serial #.

Again, trying to "reupgrade" by the new user would be prohibited by the developer even in the case of Adobe, et al. But selling it off does help pay for the new license for the original purchaser. Not really a great deal for the new owner, IMO.

I believe gavspen when he says that MOTU has blessed the iLok transfer, but I do find it surprising that the company policy is to allow folks to make that transfer and "give" the program discs and manuals to the new owner of the iLok transfer. It just doesn't seem like good business sense to me. If i were running MOTU, I wouldn't allow it. Then again, when it comes to what we Sicilians call "the biz-i-ness" I am somewhat protective of my assets.

You gotta a problem widdat?

MIDI Life Crisis wrote:I do find it surprising that the company policy is to allow folks to make that transfer and "give" the program discs and manuals to the new owner of the iLok transfer. It just doesn't seem like good business sense to me.

But maybe it is. If Gavspen's friend likes M5, once he upgrades to Mavericks if he wants get his M5 stuff back, he has to go buy a new copy of M5 3. Or maybe he finds out M5 rocks (which it does), and wants the newest features. Time to buy M5 3. Thus MOTU adds a new customer to the fold.

If it's a gift, sure that's a good deal. If it's a sale, the poor slob is paying for the old version and will have to pay full price for the new version as well. That's not good business sense for his/her.

MIDI Life Crisis wrote:If it's a gift, sure that's a good deal. If it's a sale, the poor slob is paying for the old version and will have to pay full price for the new version as well. That's not good business sense for his/her.

Definitely, but that depends on how much the poor slob paid. If it was $10, then maybe that's not too bad. But you know the old saying when it comes to the used market in any product: caveat emptor!

I have no idea what any of the associated EULAs say, since I've never read any of them....really, who has But I think MOTU's position is a reasonable one. Obviously the problem with a user giving away software is piracy; the original owner still might use his copy, but that cant happen here. It "feels" more like me just giving away (and no, I would not have sold it to him) a rack mounted synth or something. You own it, you do what you want with it. Not exactly of course, but you get my drift.

Anyway, that's the way it is, and it doesnt matter one tiny bit since my friend is already on Mavericks.

gavspen wrote:I have no idea what any of the associated EULAs say, since I've never read any of them....really, who has But I think MOTU's position is a reasonable one. Obviously the problem with a user giving away software is piracy; the original owner still might use his copy, but that cant happen here. It "feels" more like me just giving away (and no, I would not have sold it to him) a rack mounted synth or something. You own it, you do what you want with it. Not exactly of course, but you get my drift.

Anyway, that's the way it is, and it doesnt matter one tiny bit since my friend is already on Mavericks.

If you ever do read the EULA, you'll usually find that you don't own the software. You just hold a revokable license to use it under fairly restricted conditions. With hardware synth, you may own the physical object, but I bet you don't usually own the samples and software on it.

I haven't looked at the Mach Five license, but with upgrades, when you get them you usually agree to abide by the Ts&Cs of the original licence. Maybe MOTU has a more relaxed view of older versions that have been updated.

Well I am one of those crazies who actually reads agreements (except iTunes, which is just ridiculous) and my reading leads me to believe the transfer is a violation. As with all things legal, it's only a violation if 1) you get caught; and 2) the other party pursues a remedy.

BTW, just because someone at MOTU may have "said so" you are bound by the agreement regardless as oral changes are not seen as binding and even when they are, oral agreements are only valid for a period of one year and (as an aside) usually not for more than $5,000.

I'm not a lawyer, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night. (I made that last part up.)

This was not made clear: Mavericks, like SL, cannot be started up in 32bit. This does not mean that 32bit apps cannot run on them. Many run quite well; many others cannot.

Many of us run DP 7.24 and DSP-Quatro on both OS - both are still 32bit. One disadvantage is that 32bit programs are limited to addressing only 4G RAM - that limit is gone in 64bit.

Logic 8 is a 32bit program that does not work in Mavericks - lots of crying about that when people upgraded from 10.6.8 to 10.9 because it was free. Many 32bit only plugs run in DP 7.24 and 8 32bit but won't work in DP 8 64bit. Logic 9 can be run 32 or 64bit but Logic X Pro is 64bit only.

I don't know about MachFive2. I've heard it cannot run on Mavericks but don't know that for certain.

mikehalloran wrote: Logic 8 is a 32bit program that does not work in Mavericks - lots of crying about that when people upgraded from 10.6.8 to 10.9 because it was free.

I could see that, it works badly on Mountain Lion, mostly authorization problems.