Why do GTR VI's...

[Jim]

... not cover the full range of guitars?

According to Google, most guitars with 22 frets produce four octaves (depending on the tuning).

I have guitar VIs from three companies, Vir2, AAS, and Native Instruments, and all of them have a range of around 3.5 octaves. The AAS is a physically modeled instrument, and the Vir2 appears to sample every note in its scales (They take longer to load than my NI GTR VIs.). I presume the NI guitars sample at intervals and interpolate.

I wonder why the shortcoming here. My guess is that the vast majority of guitar music doesn't use four octaves, but some does. Is it just not worth the trouble for developers to support a few more notes?

I also wonder whether there are decent sounding guitar VIs that spans the full four octaves.

I'm not a guitarist. I'm asking because I download MIDI from the web of great music to allow me to play along with "better musicians" I can find in real life. It's a learning experience and fun. I've found a few songs that have that the full range of guitar tracks, which means I experience some notes not getting played, as they're out of range of the capability of the VIs.

What I've been resorting to is finding a synth patch that sounds like a pure guitar note, and then adding a bunch of typical GTR effects to them. Most synths that aren't sample based cover the full range of keys that MIDI supports - 8 octaves.

[bayswater]

A 22 fret guitar doesn't quite make 4 octaves. It gets to C# in third octave. You need 24 frets to get a full 4 octaves.

Others might disagree, but I don't think it matters. I have some guitars with 24 frets and can't say I've made a lot of use of the last 3 frets on any of the strings. The tone up there is pretty flaky at best. Jimmy Page does a nice bend to D on high C in Stairway to Heaven and Brian May uses the High C# in Bohemian Rhapsody to good effect. Otherwise it's not a well trodden path.

If you really need to play a note above the high C#, stretching the note range on the highest note on the sampler will probably sound as good as a sample based on someone playing on the last three frets. If the sampler doesn't allow it, just resample and use pitch control.

[stubbsonic]

With extended range instruments there's kind of a fun price-per-note that can be calculated.

Thinking about flutes with a "B foot" and that's all for one additional half-step of range. Or some bari saxes with extra lower notes. Or those pianos with a few more bass notes.

It's probably pretty easy to get obsessive about the additional notes (I speak from experience on this one). For basses I prefer 24 frets, but only use those top frets very rarely-- and really only on first & second strings. I don't "write for them", but sometimes the composing leads there.

[Jim]

My car has a speedometer that goes to 150 MPH. I suspect most buyers are never going to get close to that fast, but the car company didn't just say, "Let's just make this car max out at 80, because that's as high as 99% of our customers will ever need." No, they make cars go faster for the times their customers need (or want) to go very fast.

[bayswater]

My car has a speedometer that goes to 150 MPH. I suspect most buyers are never going to get close to that fast, but the car company didn't just say, "Let's just make this car max out at 80, because that's as high as 99% of our customers will ever need." No, they make cars go faster for the times their customers need (or want) to go very fast.

Could be the sample lib you refer to uses a 22 fret guitar. Exactly 100% of guitarists on a 22 fret guitar have a range of less than 4 octaves.

My cars speedometer goes to 220. Flat out downhill, I might get 150.

[gavspen]

A 22 fret guitar doesn't quite make 4 octaves. It gets to C# in third octave. You need 24 frets to get a full 4 octaves.

22 frets gives you the D actually, so bending up a whole step would give you the full 4 octaves obviously, but your right, hardly anyone goes there.

(Sorry, it's just the pedant in me that compels me to point that out )

[Bobbyd]

22 frets gives you the D actually

Yeah, my Strat only has 21 frets. The 22nd fret is needed when playing the lead on "Money" (Pink Floyd) but I haven't needed more other than that. They started making guitars with 24 frets at some point and some archtop guitars have 20 or less.

Some bass VIs fall short on notes but those are the freebies.

[James Steele]

A 22 fret guitar doesn't quite make 4 octaves. It gets to C# in third octave. You need 24 frets to get a full 4 octaves.

22 frets gives you the D actually, so bending up a whole step would give you the full 4 octaves obviously, but your right, hardly anyone goes there.

(Sorry, it's just the pedant in me that compels me to point that out )

See: Uli Jon Roth and Sky Guitar

But I get the point... you gotta bend to get up to four octaves. I actually am having a custom guitar built for me by the Dean Guitars USA custom shop and I did spec a 24 fret neck because there ARE times when I want to go there. Doesn't always happen, but I'd rather "have it and not need it" as the saying goes. Oddly enough however it's going to still be a 24 3/4" scale (like Gibsons) as opposed to the 25 1/2" scale you have on Fender strats, etc. So the frets will be a little cramped up there near the top, but I just like the feel of the 24 3/4" scale.

I used to get some really cool high notes with my 22 fret V (with recessed Floyd) by bending as far as I could at the 22nd fret and THEN pulling UP on the Floyd Rose. Downside was you do that too often and *pop*... broken string... which is a nightmare on a floating bridge. The equilibrium between the spring tension and the string tension is lost and your tuning is all screwed up.

Anyway... i feel the same way about guitar VIs as I do about amp modeling... but hey... I'm an old stick in the mud... so get off my lawn!!! I'll play a tube amp till I die. That said: I acknowledge that there are indeed circumstances where both of those modern technologies are just far more practical. They just don't move me, in the same way a Hammond B3 simulation doesn't move me like standing a few feet from a real B3 and Leslie. But such are the realities.

[Jim]

I just noticed the UVI Workstation EGTR that ships with DP 10 has a range of four octaves plus four semi-tones, or 4.333 octaves. It's not a very convincing VI, though, IMO. Maybe in certain contexts.