Are patchlists only availble in DP?

[Henry Robinett]

Are patchlists only available in DP? If I am using a MOTU MIDI interface (MIDI Express XT) can I access some of the old patchlists through the MIDI console - clockworks is it? I'm new to it. I replaced my trusty MTP av USB. So if I'm using another DAW like Logic or PT can I open patchlists using MIDI Express XT software?

[pencilina]

I not sure exactly where patch lists live but I believe if you create an instrument in OSX's Audio MIDI setup app (by hitting the "+") and hook it up to the interface port you have it plugged in to (by dragging connections between the arrows) and specify the make and manufacturer (by double clicking on the instrument icon) the patch list shows up in DP. I think they are system wide so should show up in other DAWs. Not sure if these steps are exactly precise but they should point you in the right direction.

[monkey man]

Sounds about-right, mate.

Those are default patch lists. If one wants custom lists one has to create .midnam files and place 'em in the ~Lib/Audio/MIDI Devices/MOTU folder.

[CharlzS]

DP, PT, Cubase and Ardour (MixBus) make use of patch lists (midnam,middev). There may be others. On the Mac, they're attached to the devices via Audio MIDI Setup. On PC, the apps themselves provide an AMS style setup. I remember a very long time ago you would setup patch lists in the Logic environment, but it's been many years since I've even looked at Logic so don't know if the environment is even a thing anymore. Patch lists don't have anything to do with the MIDI interface or Clockworks.

[Henry Robinett]

Thanks guys. I know about setting up the MIDI devices in the audio/MIDI app. And I know they show up in DP. I've relied on this functionality since the mid 90s at least. I also know motu stopped making new patchlists. But I have a couple of older devices (PCM91 and other effects units) where it's very inconvenient for me to sit on the floor and lean over to push the buttons on the front panel. This is great for DP but increasingly I'm using other DAWs too. I had thought I read in the manual, that I've since misplaced, that I could access patchlists with the Express XT not being limited to DP.

[bayswater]

DP, PT, Cubase and Ardour (MixBus) make use of patch lists (midnam,middev). There may be others. On the Mac, they're attached to the devices via Audio MIDI Setup. On PC, the apps themselves provide an AMS style setup. I remember a very long time ago you would setup patch lists in the Logic environment, but it's been many years since I've even looked at Logic so don't know if the environment is even a thing anymore. Patch lists don't have anything to do with the MIDI interface or Clockworks.

Of course the Environment is still part of Logic, although you can do a lot without it now. (Remember when you had to go into the Environment and tell it, yes, you do want external MIDI data routed to the Logic sequencer). The object in the Environment is called a MIDI Instr (or a Multi if you want 16 channels configured). I don't recall how these were made, but I did make them when I used external MIDI devices, and I must have use the midnam/middev files to do this -- I had no other source.

It might be that you don't need the Environment any more. If you double click on the name of an external MIDI tracks, a patch list opens. Perhaps you can edit and manage that outside of the Environment window.

[mothra]

I cut and paste my banks out of Sound Diver in the instrument objects in Logic's Environment. Works great until you start modding patches on your synth and the program list no longer matches up..

In the old Sound Diver library windows, you can select an entire bank (or the whole library) and Ctrl-C it and it copies all the patch names. Just open the instrument icon in the Environment and paste your patch list to it.

I dont think Logic uses midinam files either but I could be wrong, I think its MIDIQuest that can output midinam files based on your banks but in order to export patch lists for Logic, you have to buy the big full Pro version, because it does something other than the midinam export that Cubase/PT/DP use.

[Henry Robinett]

I cut and paste my banks out of Sound Diver in the instrument objects in Logic's Environment. Works great until you start modding patches on your synth and the program list no longer matches up..

In the old Sound Diver library windows, you can select an entire bank (or the whole library) and Ctrl-C it and it copies all the patch names. Just open the instrument icon in the Environment and paste your patch list to it.

I dont think Logic uses midinam files either but I could be wrong, I think its MIDIQuest that can output midinam files based on your banks but in order to export patch lists for Logic, you have to buy the big full Pro version, because it does something other than the midinam export that Cubase/PT/DP use.

Wow. If I could copy and paste that could solve some problems. I need to find out where the patchlist thing is in Logic and PT so maybe I can paste the patches that come up in DP. Sound Diver? I have Windows 10 with Parallels. If I could open them on windows that'd work. I use that to control Lexicon and an old Yamaha tat have no support on Mac.

Thanks. More tips welcome!

[rp88.2]

Hi Henry:

I had to (re-)read the posts a few times and I think what you are looking for are device patch lists for your effects, etc. Not device presets/definitions that are used only for mapping and routing MIDI interfaces and devices.

It turns out that DP and Logic Pro do not use the same device patch list structure. DP (and Pro Tools) uses midinam files (XML structured) and Logic Pro X requires you to create patch lists in an 'Environment'. No easy translation-- that question has been asked over at logicprohelp.com.

Depending on which DAW you primarily use, you may need to create those lists yourself or look for people who already have and posted them.

So, I would search on your effects processors and midinam files for DP and Pro Tools. For Logic Pro you would search on your effects processors and Logic Environment Objects (or the like).

A source for user created midinam files is here: https://digicake.com/midnams/

If MIDI Quest supports all your effects devices, etc. It may make sense to try a demo. The cost may outweigh the time to track down, build, etc.

If you need help creating midinam files I can point you to some resources-- I built a midinam file for my Roland JD-XI a while back.
See: viewtopic.php?f=26&t=64419

Hope this is helpful.

[Henry Robinett]

Very helpful. Thank you. I’m sorry if I said presets. I didn’t mean that. Patch lists. I’ll check out those resources.


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[CharlzS]

I need to find out where the patchlist thing is in Logic and PT so maybe I can paste the patches that come up in DP.

PT works the same way as DP on the Mac. When you select the MIDI output device on a track and if that device is defined in AMS, the patch list should be available when you click the patch selector for the track. This was broken on a couple of versions of PT during the 32 to 64 bit transition, but has worked fine since the later releases of V12 and beyond.

[rp88.2]

@Henry - No worries -- Glad it was helpful. Have an awesome weekend!

Love the ES-335 (or 275) in your profile pict!!!

[Henry Robinett]

@Henry - No worries -- Glad it was helpful. Have an awesome weekend!

Love the ES-335 (or 275) in your profile pict!!!

Thank you! ES-355!


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[mothra]

Here's the way to do it with Sound Diver/Logic... I dont think Apple has changed this method either, I see no new way to do it so Ive been doing it this way for years..

In Sound Diver, double click your synth and open its editor/library. Select an entire bank of patches, and hit Ctrl/Cmd+C to copy them.
Now in Logic Pro, open the MIDI Environment window and go to the MIDI Instrument layer. If you've got your synths setup, double click on one to open the list of patch names.. Note, this only seems to work on 'Multi Instruments' I can figure out how to get this to open on a single instrument. Over on the right in the Options menu, select 'Paste All Names' and it will write that entire bank you copied from Sound Diver into the patch list. Repeat the process for each synth/bank and voila. You've got Logic setup with all your patch names for all your synths. I have to figure out how to open the single instruments and do it, I know in the past Ive done it before because I even had my Nord Modular's patch names in there and that was always setup as a single instrument in Logic.

The fun part is when you start editing them and have to redo the whole process hah. I miss having Sound Diver integration, but I definitely dont miss Logic Platinum and OS 9..

[bayswater]

SoundDiver? Where do you get that? I thought it was discontinued sometime after the initial OS X beta release about 15 years ago.