VCA Tracks: What's the advantage over an Aux track?

[Shooshie]

Looking over DP 10, I'm finding that I don't full understand the VCA Track. It appears to add a fader for controlling the volume of one or multiple tracks, without changing their current automation lines. We already have a track that does that: the Aux track. Also the Master Track. You can route one or many tracks through an Aux, where your Aux automations and/or real-time changes will not override the automation of the feeder tracks, but will add to the total fader values, or subtract from them.

I have created only one VCA track to check it out, so I'm certainly not an expert on it, and that's why I'm here. To see if anyone else has found the advantage to using it. Is it just a quick way to get the same functionality of an Aux without the tedious setup? Still seems the same amount of tedium to me.

I await the enlightenment of our collective experience, here. I'm afraid it won't be coming from my direction!

The Ghost of Shooshie

[MartinBaird]

Here ya go:

https://www.admiralbumblebee.com/music/ ... 0-vca.html

[monkey man]

The Ghost of Shooshie, indeed!

Love you and missed you, brother. "You da man" never meant more IMHO than when being directed towards you.

[cuttime]

I predict more visits from the ghost as the bell tolls One.

[Shooshie]

I predict more visits from the ghost as the bell tolls One.

Oooohooohoohooohoooo.... ask NOT for whom the bell tolls, it tolls for theeeeeheeeheeehehehe...[hack, cough, cackackcough...] Ah, s***! Can we dispense with the voice? I mean, it's harder to do the voice as a ghost, because technically I have no mass to vibrate the air with in the first place. That's happening through sheer willpower, and doing that ghost voice really is hard. ok? Hmmm... maybe with an aggressive cardioid mic and a fierce brickwall limiter. Oh, and some plate. Yeah. A good 3 second plate. We'll work on that.

The Ghost of Shooosh

[Shooshie]

Here ya go:

https://www.admiralbumblebee.com/music/ ... 0-vca.html

Thanks, Martin.

The video explains it all. Just to have it in print in case the video disappears (and they always do, eventually), think about extended connections to a track. For example, a send.

When you use a group fader scale another track or group of tracks, you aren't necessarily scaling the send's return. (or you may be, if you set it up that way) A VCA fader apparently controls the other faders and sends without affecting their contents, so that is taken care of. (if you set it up that way) Let's put it this way: VCA faders are designed to take care of loose ends without your attention to the matter. At least, that seems to be what the guy in the video is saying.

Another example:
If you have been recording automation, and you use a Group Fader to control other tracks whose automation is set to RECORD, the motion of the tracks' faders induced by the Group Fader will erase your automation and replace it. The VCA fader will not do that, according to the video.

I'm sure there's more. Let's celebrate the fact that DP always gives us multiple ways to do things. We have Fader Groups, Aux Tracks, Master Tracks and VCA faders. Also, less talked about, and a lot more difficult to implement, is the Custom Console. I won't get into that, but it also operates faders. I don't remember if you can get it to cross over from MIDI to Audio, but I don't know that it won't. Anyway, the point is that there are different methods for controlling what you mix, record, and perform. Each may be useful to you, depending on the context of the moment. If you learn them all, learn their differences and similarities, and figure out what works best for you, and when, you will be a stronger, faster engineer with DP.

Shooshie (now just a ghostly voice in the wilderness)

[bkshepard]

But just to be clear...

If I'm not mistaken, sending a group of channels through an AUX fader still scales their output--even with their automation. The problem with the first example in the video wasn't with scaling, but with the fact that the individual drum channels were sent to reverb. If you send them after the AUX channel, that's not a problem.

I do a lot of Orchestral mockup work and will often create a separate AUX for say, the horns, the trumpets, the trombones/tuba, and then another AUX for the entire brass section. I can do all the automation I want in the individual tracks and still have it scaled via the AUX bus. As Shooshie rightly pointed out, though, there are lots of other benefits to the VCA fader and I look forward to exploring them, but I'm not sure it will affect the way I most commonly use my AUX channels.

[Shooshie]

But just to be clear...

If I'm not mistaken, sending a group of channels through an AUX fader still scales their output--even with their automation. The problem with the first example in the video wasn't with scaling, but with the fact that the individual drum channels were sent to reverb. If you send them after the AUX channel, that's not a problem.

That's exactly what I meant by "if you set it up that way."
And that's why I'm trying to figure out the big advantage of VCA tracks. I'm sure they are there, or there wouldn't be such a fuss over them. It just may take me a while until turning to a VCA instead of an Aux becomes instinct for me, in the proper context, of course.

Shooshie

[FMiguelez]

... Shooshie...

Shoosh!
What a nice and unexpected surprise!
I hope you're doing great, my friend! I thought you were affairing with Nuendo or Logic or something...

Well, you asked the question I was going to ask, and it looks like you found it convincing. I'll do the reading (or whatever) now, because I still don't get what the big fuss about VCA faders is... I think I can do all that with my Aux stems and more... But I must me missin' somethin', so let's see what that is

[Reading mode on...]

[Michael Canavan]

... Shooshie...

Shoosh!
What a nice and unexpected surprise!
I hope you're doing great, my friend! I thought you were affairing with Nuendo or Logic or something...

Well, you asked the question I was going to ask, and it looks like you found it convincing. I'll do the reading (or whatever) now, because I still don't get what the big fuss about VCA faders is... I think I can do all that with my Aux stems and more... But I must me missin' somethin', so let's see what that is

[Reading mode on...]

Robert explains it quite well in the video above.

[bayswater]

It's discussions like this that make me wish MOTU would publish a signal flow diagram.

[Shooshie]

The reason I'm asking about VCA tracks is because I don't have the ability right now to find out for myself. My studio is in pieces, half at the ranch and half at my still-current place in Dallas. I'm moving, and it's a very slow process for me at this point in my life. So, I'm just trying to find out from you guys what you think. The video made sense, but it's not the last word. I still believe that Aux tracks could handle some [most?] of what VCA tracks are touted for. But time and usage will be the arbiters, here, not what I think now — before I've actually tried them.

[dix]

I'm guessing there'll be more posts about VCA usage once an update for DP10 shows up. I'm not using VCAs in the projects I am doing with DP10 because they disappear if you Save As a DP7-9 and open them in DP9 - a likely scenario to run into since DP10 has some unworkaroundable bugs currently.

[bayswater]

Can we dispense with the voice? I mean, it's harder to do the voice as a ghost, because technically I have no mass to vibrate the air with in the first place.

HA! How to do you explain poltergeists !?!?

[primeevolutionary]

I can see the advantages when working with groups, but, isn't the track based VCA the same or about the same as the Trim Latch and Trim Touch functions?

If not, what's the difference workflow-wise?