It is currently Fri Dec 19, 2014 2:23 am
   
Text Size

Virtual Memory

For seeking technical help with Digital Performer and/or plug-ins on MacOS.

Moderators: James Steele, Shooshie

Forum rules
This forum is for seeking solutions to technical problems involving Digital Performer and/or plug-ins on MacOS, as well as feature requests, criticisms, comparison to other DAWs.

Virtual Memory

Postby Julia123 » Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:45 pm

I am trying to find out more about DP's virtual memory. I don't see where or how to monitor it, or how to tell how much each plug in is using.

My new Omnisphere VI is killing DP. Up till now, I've used numerous Instances of large PLAY sounds and eventually would have to deal with things getting sluggish. With Omnisphere though, I just got a message that I was out of memory with only two instances running. (other plugins were also running but with Omnisphere off, things are fine.) I've never seen this error message before. Evidently, it is talking about Virtual Memory, since I've got 7 gigs of RAM still available. How do I monitor this stuff other than watching my Audio Performance meters spike and turning things off?

Also, I've read in passing about VE Pro and DP8, thinking it didn't concern me since I don't mind working around things within reason. Would these fix this Omnisphere problem in my little dual Core iMac situation? (I have one external firewire HD with Play and Omnisphere sounds on it) Thank you.
iMac OS X 10.6.8, Dual Core, 3.06 GHz, 12g Ram, DP 8.05, Apogee One
Julia123
 
Posts: 342
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2011 4:49 pm
Primary DAW OS: Unspecified

Virtual Memory

Postby MIDI Life Crisis » Fri Jun 08, 2012 2:06 pm

Activity Monitor app (probably in applications/utilities
_______________________________________________________________________
_______________________________________________________________________
_____________________________MIDI Life Crisis______________________________
_______________________________________________________________________
_____________OS X.X.1 • DP 64 bit • 8 core MP/20GB RAM • Track 16_____________
User avatar
MIDI Life Crisis
 
Posts: 20779
Joined: Wed May 18, 2005 10:01 pm
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Re: Virtual Memory

Postby FMiguelez » Fri Jun 08, 2012 2:51 pm

Yes. Omnisphere (which I don't use much) can be a memory hog.

Do you have a way to host it outside of DP? Something like VE Pro or Bidule?

If not, perhaps it's time to upgrade your computer, or at least use an unused computer as a slave for this purpose.
Mac Mini Server i7 2.66 GHs/16 GB RAM / OSX 10.9.2 / DP 8.06
Tascam DM-24, MOTU Track 16, all Spectrasonics' stuff,
Vienna Instruments SUPER PACKAGE, Waves Platinum, slaved iMac and Mac Minis running VE Pro, etc.

---------------------------

"There's random genetic variation, and non-random survival, and non-random reproduction, which is why, as the generations go by, animals get better at doing what they do. That is quintessentially non-random". ― Richard Dawkins
User avatar
FMiguelez
 
Posts: 6570
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 10:01 pm
Location: Body: Narco-México Soul/Heart: NYC
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Re: Virtual Memory

Postby Julia123 » Fri Jun 08, 2012 5:05 pm

FMiguelez wrote:Yes. Omnisphere (which I don't use much) can be a memory hog.

Do you have a way to host it outside of DP? Something like VE Pro or Bidule?

If not, perhaps it's time to upgrade your computer, or at least use an unused computer as a slave for this purpose.


I don't. Would VE Pro work in my situation? I can't purchase a new computer for a long time. I'm wondering if DP 8 would help if I just wait it out.

Thanks
iMac OS X 10.6.8, Dual Core, 3.06 GHz, 12g Ram, DP 8.05, Apogee One
Julia123
 
Posts: 342
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2011 4:49 pm
Primary DAW OS: Unspecified

Virtual Memory

Postby kgdrum » Fri Jun 08, 2012 5:22 pm

Julia123 wrote:
FMiguelez wrote:Yes. Omnisphere (which I don't use much) can be a memory hog.

Do you have a way to host it outside of DP? Something like VE Pro or Bidule?

If not, perhaps it's time to upgrade your computer, or at least use an unused computer as a slave for this purpose.


I don't. Would VE Pro work in my situation? I can't purchase a new computer for a long time. I'm wondering if DP 8 would help if I just wait it out.

Thanks



We are all hoping DP8 w 64bit kernel will give of that extra room CPU wise to use more VI's & RAM......
I'm waiting to see how things develop,if I can avoid VE Pro & adding a 2nd Mac it will be worth waiting for IMO.
2.8 Quad MacPro 3.1,24 gig,OSX10.8.3, DP8.05 RME fireface 800,Great River ME-1NV preamp,a few microphones,NI Komplete + numerous VI's & plugins, UAD2, Vdrums (TD20 expanded) Superior 2 etc..., Focal Twin 6 monitors, Shunyata PowerSnakes and Conditioners,too many hard drives... ESATA
User avatar
kgdrum
 
Posts: 3785
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 11:01 pm
Location: NYC
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Re: Virtual Memory

Postby James Steele » Fri Jun 08, 2012 5:56 pm

kgdrum wrote:We are all hoping DP8 w 64bit kernel will give of that extra room CPU wise to use more VI's & RAM......


Just to avoid confusion with the terminology, doesn't the word "kernel" apply to the operating system. DP8 when run as a 64-bit app will still address more than the 4GB RAM limit running in 64-bit mode on top of a 32-bit OS kernel. I have an early MacPro... one of the machines that can't technically boot into the 64-bit kernel, but should still be able to run DP in 64-bit and address more than 4GB RAM.

Of course it's somewhat impractical because RAM for these machines is relatively expensive and silly to spend much money on it, as opposed to saving for newer Mac. :(
JamesSteele.com | Dean Guitars | Facebook | Google+ | Twitter

MacPro4,1 Quad-Core 2.66, 24GB RAM, OS 10.10, ATI 5770, DP 8.07, MOTU HD192, 24I/O, UAD-2 Duo, Lucid GENx192, HV-3C, Red Type B, Dean guitars, Marshall amps, etc., etc.!
User avatar
James Steele
Site Administrator
 
Posts: 15200
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 10:01 pm
Location: San Diego, CA - U.S.A.
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Virtual Memory

Postby kgdrum » Fri Jun 08, 2012 6:21 pm

from my understanding running an app thats written for 64bit and run in the 64bit Kernel is what gets past the 4gig limitation.
There is some debate whether a Mac running an app such as DP8 in the 32bit Kernel will also have these limitations lifted.
From my understanding the 64bit kernel is the key,I might be wrong,I guess we'll see ;-)
2.8 Quad MacPro 3.1,24 gig,OSX10.8.3, DP8.05 RME fireface 800,Great River ME-1NV preamp,a few microphones,NI Komplete + numerous VI's & plugins, UAD2, Vdrums (TD20 expanded) Superior 2 etc..., Focal Twin 6 monitors, Shunyata PowerSnakes and Conditioners,too many hard drives... ESATA
User avatar
kgdrum
 
Posts: 3785
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 11:01 pm
Location: NYC
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Virtual Memory

Postby James Steele » Fri Jun 08, 2012 7:47 pm

The computer does NOT have to be booted into 64-bit kernel for an app like DP to run in 64-bit mode and for the app to address more than 4GB RAM.
JamesSteele.com | Dean Guitars | Facebook | Google+ | Twitter

MacPro4,1 Quad-Core 2.66, 24GB RAM, OS 10.10, ATI 5770, DP 8.07, MOTU HD192, 24I/O, UAD-2 Duo, Lucid GENx192, HV-3C, Red Type B, Dean guitars, Marshall amps, etc., etc.!
User avatar
James Steele
Site Administrator
 
Posts: 15200
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 10:01 pm
Location: San Diego, CA - U.S.A.
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Re: Virtual Memory

Postby Kubi » Fri Jun 08, 2012 7:56 pm

Absolutely. I'm running my Mac in a 32bit kernel, run VE Pro 64, and fill it up to my heart's content.

Julia, I highly recommend an external host like VE Pro (or Bidule, which others here successfully use, I have no first-hand experience with that one.) It's easy to set up and solves your problem now. DP8 isn't out yet, and when it comes out, it could still have a few "point-oh" version hiccups for a few weeks.

Of course all this only makes sense if you have plenty of RAM in your machine. Once you run a 64bit VI host, whether DP8 or VE Pro, it's oh so easy to fill it up...

:D
Kubi
---------------------------------------------------
Kubilay Uner
http://kubilayuner.com
MacPro 2x2.8 GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon, 20GB RAM; OS 10.8.5; DP8.04; MOTU 2408mk3 & MIDI Express 128 w/latest drivers
User avatar
Kubi
 
Posts: 667
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2011 11:51 am
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Virtual Memory

Postby kgdrum » Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:18 pm

Correct Kubi and other users are running VI's in 64bit VE Pro in the 64 bit Kenel to get past the 4gig Ram limitation and not using resource hungry plugs in DP.
The hope I and some users have is when DP 8 goes 64 bit and you have a Mac booted in the 64bit Kernel,you will also not have the 4gig ram limitations we now encounter.The possibility exists that VEPro or Bidule might not be as necesarry for heavy lifting & we should be able to get more power out of 1 Mac,that's my hope at least.
Once the 64 bit transition evolves I expect we will be able to do much more with a 1 Mac DAW.
2.8 Quad MacPro 3.1,24 gig,OSX10.8.3, DP8.05 RME fireface 800,Great River ME-1NV preamp,a few microphones,NI Komplete + numerous VI's & plugins, UAD2, Vdrums (TD20 expanded) Superior 2 etc..., Focal Twin 6 monitors, Shunyata PowerSnakes and Conditioners,too many hard drives... ESATA
User avatar
kgdrum
 
Posts: 3785
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 11:01 pm
Location: NYC
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Virtual Memory

Postby James Steele » Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:22 pm

Note Kubi said he's running it on the 32 bit kernel.
JamesSteele.com | Dean Guitars | Facebook | Google+ | Twitter

MacPro4,1 Quad-Core 2.66, 24GB RAM, OS 10.10, ATI 5770, DP 8.07, MOTU HD192, 24I/O, UAD-2 Duo, Lucid GENx192, HV-3C, Red Type B, Dean guitars, Marshall amps, etc., etc.!
User avatar
James Steele
Site Administrator
 
Posts: 15200
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 10:01 pm
Location: San Diego, CA - U.S.A.
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Re: Virtual Memory

Postby FMiguelez » Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:26 pm

I know DP 8 will be great, and I can't wait to get my hands on it 8)

But Julia, I don't mean to sound like a pushy VSL-sales person (which I'm not,) but I really think you would benefit tremendously with VE Pro and an extra computer for hosting such memory hogs like Omnisphere. If you could get a cheap used computer, even a PC ( :!: ), it would help dramatically because you would liberate DP of hosting VIs and let it shine for other things that it does beautifully.
I'm not sure about this, but I think even with your same computer, as a single-computer setup, the benefits would be great. You would get out of DP's way and memory usage limit of 4 GB (as long as its CPU power is adequate).

VE Pro, at least for me, is the most revolutionary program that has been written in a long time. It is amazing. Really. I'm not exaggerating.
You don't need to spend on MIDI / audio interfaces or Audio cards. You can host basically anything in there (32 or 64 bit). For a master/slave setup all you need is a computer with as much RAM as you can afford, an internet hub and an ethernet cable. Well, and a decent samples HD. That's it!

You could double or triple whatever processing/memory power you currently have quite cheaply, and you wouldn't have to deal with what you are going through anymore.

DP1, DP6, DP8 or whatever will definitely benefit from such a setup. You can always incorporate obsolete computers into your setup instead of using them as door stops.
How do you think I am still running a last-decade old PPC G5 as a master computer? It's all thanks to my slaves! DP runs smoother than ever because most of the work is being done by the others and it happily conducts all of them like Von Karajan (at least during the MIDI stage. When it comes to mix audio it's a different story for me and the G5, but the point remains...).

Otherwise, if you really can't or won't deal with anything of what I suggested, you will have to resort to enabling-disabling instruments (to liberate memory and CPU) and freezing as needed. It's doable, of course, but not very work-flow friendly. I did this for years!
A quick and easy way to do this is to place these VIs in separate instrument racks. That way enabling or disabling them is as easy as pressing a button (and watch in amazement how your CPU goes from 10000% to almost nothing :) ).
Mac Mini Server i7 2.66 GHs/16 GB RAM / OSX 10.9.2 / DP 8.06
Tascam DM-24, MOTU Track 16, all Spectrasonics' stuff,
Vienna Instruments SUPER PACKAGE, Waves Platinum, slaved iMac and Mac Minis running VE Pro, etc.

---------------------------

"There's random genetic variation, and non-random survival, and non-random reproduction, which is why, as the generations go by, animals get better at doing what they do. That is quintessentially non-random". ― Richard Dawkins
User avatar
FMiguelez
 
Posts: 6570
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 10:01 pm
Location: Body: Narco-México Soul/Heart: NYC
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Virtual Memory

Postby kgdrum » Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:45 pm

Agreed if you're not going to run in the 64bit Kernel running VI's out of DP via VE Pro is a great solution but theoretically if you can run in the 64bit Kernel with a 64bit DP8,some users will feel less of a need for VE Pro,slaves etc....
I don't do film scores or orch type stuff so my needs are rather modest by some standards.
I might be wrong but from my perspective VE Pro,Bidule,slaves are great solutions to get past the limitations of 32bit architecture in the 64 bit future these apps might not be necessary for many users.
2.8 Quad MacPro 3.1,24 gig,OSX10.8.3, DP8.05 RME fireface 800,Great River ME-1NV preamp,a few microphones,NI Komplete + numerous VI's & plugins, UAD2, Vdrums (TD20 expanded) Superior 2 etc..., Focal Twin 6 monitors, Shunyata PowerSnakes and Conditioners,too many hard drives... ESATA
User avatar
kgdrum
 
Posts: 3785
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 11:01 pm
Location: NYC
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Re: Virtual Memory

Postby James Steele » Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:48 pm

kgdrum wrote:Agreed if you're not going to run in the 64bit Kernel running VI's out of DP via VE Pro is a great solution but theoretically if you can run in the 64bit Kernel with a 64bit DP8,some users will feel less of a need for VE Pro,slaves etc....


I'm not sure if you're seeing my posts. You DO NOT HAVE TO RUN IN THE 64-BIT KERNEL TO USE EXTRA RAM WITHIN APPS LIKE DP. A machine like the MacPro 1,1 like I have can boot into the 32-bit kernel, yet launch apps in 64-bit mode and the app can address greater than 4GB of RAM.
JamesSteele.com | Dean Guitars | Facebook | Google+ | Twitter

MacPro4,1 Quad-Core 2.66, 24GB RAM, OS 10.10, ATI 5770, DP 8.07, MOTU HD192, 24I/O, UAD-2 Duo, Lucid GENx192, HV-3C, Red Type B, Dean guitars, Marshall amps, etc., etc.!
User avatar
James Steele
Site Administrator
 
Posts: 15200
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 10:01 pm
Location: San Diego, CA - U.S.A.
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Re: Virtual Memory

Postby FMiguelez » Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:53 pm

The thing is that slaves not only liberate RAM memory, but CPU power!

I agree that with a full-blown 64 bit computer the need wouldn't be the same, but it would have to be a VERY powerful computer to begin with!
Mac Mini Server i7 2.66 GHs/16 GB RAM / OSX 10.9.2 / DP 8.06
Tascam DM-24, MOTU Track 16, all Spectrasonics' stuff,
Vienna Instruments SUPER PACKAGE, Waves Platinum, slaved iMac and Mac Minis running VE Pro, etc.

---------------------------

"There's random genetic variation, and non-random survival, and non-random reproduction, which is why, as the generations go by, animals get better at doing what they do. That is quintessentially non-random". ― Richard Dawkins
User avatar
FMiguelez
 
Posts: 6570
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 10:01 pm
Location: Body: Narco-México Soul/Heart: NYC
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Next

Return to Digital Performer [MacOS]: Troubleshooting/Criticism

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Yahoo [Bot] and 0 guests


Who is online

In total there is 1 user online :: 1 registered, 0 hidden and 0 guests (based on users active over the past 5 minutes)
Most users ever online was 151 on Tue Jan 28, 2014 1:07 pm

Users browsing this forum: Yahoo [Bot] and 0 guests

Login Form