Ducking

[stainless]

I've read page 842/843 numerous times now and I cannot seem to grasp this...

I'm working on a tune that has a lot of guitar riffs- many extend/continue behind the vocals

While I could manually go pencil in out the volume, I'm thinking ducking (with compression) might be the better approach so it's not so abrupt ((perhaps)

so, my understanding to this point which is flawed is to set up a send from the vocal track... but my interpretation of the manual is ... well I'm not sure I see how this affects the guitar track

looking at the MW Compressor as an insert (I figured startimg with a MOTU plug would be a good idea) ... I'm not seeing a side chain menu... and unless the compressor is in the guitar track.... (once I find the side chain)... how is this going to affect the guitar?

I understand how it works... I just can't grasp how to implement it

[AnthonyS]

Hi:

While I have limited knowledge of side chain compression and/or ducking, I don't believe the MW Compressor has a side chain input.

The included "Dynamics" in DP does have a an input drop down menu that you can feed the output from a bus to.

Hope this helps.

[Phil O]

AnthonyS is correct. If you are using DP plug-ins for this, the Dynamics plug is the way to go. Put the Dynamics plug on a Guitar track insert and set the Control Signal (i.e., sidechain) to the desired bus - say bus 1. Then set a send from your sidechain track (in your case, vocals) to bus 1. I would set it to unity gain, but that's not necessary. Now adjust the controls on the Dynamics plug for the desired ducking.
So in summary:
Dynamics plug on guitar track, Control Signal set to Bus whatever.
Send on vocal track to same Bus.
Adjust Dynamics plug to taste.

Another compressor to consider is Stillwell's Rocket. I can't remember what I paid for it, but I think it's around $50. It's my favorite sidechain compressor.

Phil

[stainless]

thank you so much!

I'll look into the Stillwell plug also!

[Prime Mover]

If you're looking for a good multiband with sidechaining, Waves "C6" has a sidechain variant that's been really easy to use. From time to time they have a 50% off sale (they might be having one now, in fact) and it drops to $75. The interface is a "Dynamic EQ" style, which I find much more intuitive than the traditional "multiband comp" style like the MW Comp.

It'll be interesting to see whether DPs own Dynamic EQ plugin that's coming with DP8 will have a sidechaining option. If they want it to compete with C6, they'd better.

I do really wish my Waves RComp had sidechaining though

[stainless]

I'll look into that also

I have 2 UAD-2 cards (solos) and I like the UAD plugs, but was really surprised that side-chaining isn't an option. I'm pretty sure at least some of the original hardware had this option, but i may be wrong about that

I know a few folks consider "ducking" to be old/outdated, but it seems a very viable way to deal with different instruments that weave around each other (and less time consuming than manually editing volume). A multiband that could be side chained would seem really practical

[stephentayler]

Waves C6 is good.... but I particularly like the NI Vintage Compressors - LA2A- 1176 and dbx160, these have awesome side-chains, and also have a high pass filter on the detection circuit, more useful than you think. I see also that NI also have an SSL buss compressor that also has a side-chain - damn, going to have to get that too!!!

These compressors sound very good and are faithful reproduction.

The dbx160 works very well if you want the kick to duck the entire track.

Only drag with these plugs is that they use Guitar Rig as a frame.

Cheers

Stephen

[AnthonyS]

I wasn't sure if the OP was looking outside of DP for a plugin, but +1 for the NI. Also Waves H-Comp and the very versatile C1 do the trick as well. C1 is very versatile.

Good luck

[stainless]

I'll admit I haven't paid much attention to the NI plugs, although i have Komplete 7.

Another one to contemplate!

[Prime Mover]

Only drag with these plugs is that they use Guitar Rig as a frame.

Got to admit, that's practically a deal breaker with me. Don't get me wrong, GR is great for what it's designed for, and it's great when bundling a large amount of operations to create a specific effect. But it's a total waste of CPU, screen real-estate, and time to have to use it for individual processes.

One of these days I wish they'd just turn GR into a VST/AU host, and turn all their effects into VSTs/AUs. That way you could choose to use them inside GR or individually in the host DAW. Even better, allow Kontakt to also chain VST/AUs, and streamline everything so that all NI effects are using the same protocol as everything else. Once again, NI creates a bunch of good ideas that don't seem to fit well together, and have to duplicate their work.

BTW: whoever said Ducking was outdated? Ducking is a tool, just like any other. If you need to accomplish the task produced by ducking, there's no other way of doing it. Ducking will be outdated when screw drivers become outdated (no Doctor Who jokes, please).

[cbergm7210]

Only drag with these plugs is that they use Guitar Rig as a frame.

Got to admit, that's practically a deal breaker with me. Don't get me wrong, GR is great for what it's designed for, and it's great when bundling a large amount of operations to create a specific effect. But it's a total waste of CPU, screen real-estate, and time to have to use it for individual processes.

One of these days I wish they'd just turn GR into a VST/AU host, and turn all their effects into VSTs/AUs. That way you could choose to use them inside GR or individually in the host DAW. Even better, allow Kontakt to also chain VST/AUs, and streamline everything so that all NI effects are using the same protocol as everything else. Once again, NI creates a bunch of good ideas that don't seem to fit well together, and have to duplicate their work.

Great plugs. I have setups saved with DP channel presets with my favorite NI comps...minimizes the GR issue.

[Prime Mover]

Well, I only have Komplete 7. One day NI will offer enough new things for me to upgrade, and then I'll be able to use them.