Exporting DP7.2 MIDI Data to Sibelius 6.2

[erikjamesmusic]

Hey Y'all. I'm new to notation software. I've got a MIDI project in DP that I need to properly notate in Sibelius. Never having done this before, my first inclination is to simply drag MIDI data from DP to a folder on the desktop, and than import that MIDI file into sibelius project and tweak.

1. what's the best way to export MIDI data from DP? Usually, I just highlight it and drag it to the desktop. Problem is, no matter where I start highlighting, the exported MIDI file automatically starts of the first note, instead of observing, say, 67 bars of rest! Is there a better way to do this?

2. what's the best way to import MIDI into Sibelius 6? There's nothing in the manual about this, although I haven't yet attempted it either.

3. What's the best way to deal with drum mapping? For instance, in DP I use superior drummer 2 for my kit parts, and the kick is mapped to C2, snare to D2, etc. In proper notation, the kick should be mapped to A3, snare to C3 (i think), etc. How do most people go about converting a MIDI drum track (in a sequencer) to proper notation (like in sibelius). Export one drum at a time (ex. just the snare)?

Thanks for any suggestions.

[erikjamesmusic]

With a little research, I found this thread on Sibelius forums about important MIDI data:

http://www.sibelius.com/cgi-bin/helpcen ... 3&&guest=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Essentially, I can export my DP score to PDF, run "PDFtoMusic Pro" (a free xml conversion app), and import the xml file into Sibelius.

OR, just hard quantize everything in DP to get clean MIDI files, and do a simple export/import of the clean MIDI data.

[bdr]

Never heard about that method. I would generally copy the sequence and make that my export copy, and hard quantise as you suggest and export as MIDI file. In Sibelius I like to create an empty copy of each imported stave, then focus on one instrument at a time (using focus on staves) and copy a few bars across at a time to the blank stave and clean them up.The drum maps can be very problematic and are sometimes easier just to restart in Sibelius.

Of course, there's this view
http://bennewhouse.berkleemusicblogs.co ... but-equal/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[MIDI Life Crisis]

Depending on the material, you may have to quantize different sections to different resolutions of quantization to get more accurate results. If you used the DP metronome the work might be easier than if you didn't. Having done a ton of transcription of my early orchestral works this way I personally feel that simply redoing the score from scratch in a notation program is way faster than trying to export MIDI. Not always, but sometimes. I especially find it faster to compose directly to notation when going to print rather than sequencing and transcribing.

Caveat: I use Finale.

[erikjamesmusic]

Update: after 14 hours of arranging to meet an a.m. deadline, I'm about half-way there with Sibelius. I spent about 1.5 hrs. thoroughly quantizing (attacks and releases) the project in DP (I saved as a separate project to retain the audio integrity in the original project), then I "saved a copy as" a MIDI File (type 1), and imported that on startup into Sibelius 6. Tempos and time signatures were retained perfectly , but when you open a MIDI file in Sibelius instead of starting a new project, the tracks are mapped out very oddly. Something like:

Solo
Percussion
Solo
Solo
Solo, etc.

I could never get that original "percussion track" (which imported a bari sax part), to behave as a regular instrument track. Very strange. It was definitely NOT a perfect import.

Also, making the drum mappings from the toontrack MIDI track into a "correctly notated" drum map was a disaster. Using the "special filter" in the edit window, you can (not easily) select all D3s, let's say, and move them to whatever note you want that original D3 to correspond to (F4 is kick, etc.). This took me at least 3 hours to do correctly, but i AM very intricate with drums and could have easily used Sibelius' loops/notations and written "sim." instead of notating every measure. Actually, the drummer would have probably preferred this.

Text in the magnetic layout is amazing. So easy to input chords, expression text, whatever and have them stick to the proper notes or bars.

I worked mostly in Panoramic view, which is great, but when i switched to regular view, the project was smooshed into 1 page. The only way I could figure out how space the bars out properly was the remove these little facing arrows at the top of the page, located at each barline. They look like: --><--

I had to highlight every single one and delete them (select all doesn't work for this), and then the bars were spaced out reasonably. I'm sure this is NOT what I'm supposed to do but after hours of messing around, couldn't find any other way to do it, and I was under the gun and had to get it done. Anyone who could shed some light on this situation would be greatly appreciated.

Sorry for the rant, I figure while I learn this software, I'll keep posting my findings, especially as pertaining to the DP---Sibelius conversion process. Thanks.

[Nigel Keay]

I'm still working with earlier versions of both DP and sib. Sib 4 doesn't have panoramic view - that always amuses me to think that this was something Mosaic had years ago - I guess Sib had to keep something up their sleeve for another upgrade. But your layout spacing problems sound as though the format is locked in which case try selecting the entire score and unlock it. Then you'll be able to apply the various formatting options.

I haven't found the transcription via MIDI to be amazing, however Sibelius applies the bulk operations fairly easily so it tends to put me a bit ahead as opposed to starting a score completely from scratch.

[erikjamesmusic]

Thanks, Nigel. It was indeed a "Locked Formatting" problem. I just highlighted the score, click format - unlock. Perfect. Love this program.

I've decided that drum parts are to be started from scratch in Sibelius. MUCH faster and cleaner that way and the drummer will love you more than if you give him the exact part toontrack superior drummer played The rest of the import is very useful though.

I'm going to notate another tune this weekend and I bet I don't have to be nearly as thorough with my quantization in DP (which i spend 1.5 hours on a 3 minute tune) and the import will still be good, depending on your Sibelius settings.

CONS about Sibelius 6:

1. You are entitled to only ONE "complimentary" tech support call from Avid. All further tech support calls are to be purchased at the Avid store for $25. What the heck?!??

2. Sibelius, unlike Finale, doesn't export to XML or MXL (the file type necessary to work between finale and sibelius). You can purchase a program called "Docet" (i believe) for $200 to add this feature, OR you can download a trial version of "PDFtoMusic Pro" (full version available for $50) and save the Sibelius file to PDF, THEN convert to MXL with "PDFtoMusic Pro". Pretty big pain in the ass. You CAN import XMLs or MXLs in Sibelius. So i began thinking; why would u be able to import but NOT export? Answer: Avid wants Finale users to purchase Sibelius, and doesn't want Sibelius users to purchase Finale. Period. This is pretty upsetting.

I'll post again after another try at converting a DP7.2 project to Sibelius 6.2. Overall, a killing combination!

[Nigel Keay]

CONS about Sibelius 6:

1. You are entitled to only ONE "complimentary" tech support call from Avid. All further tech support calls are to be purchased at the Avid store for $25. What the heck?!??

Just use the online forum; any and every question will always get answered. If another user doesn't give you the answer Daniel of Sibelius will intervene.

[dsmusic]

Re: Exporting DP7.2 MIDI Data to Sibelius 6.2
by erikjamesmusic » Tue Aug 24, 2010 10:23 am

With a little research, I found this thread on Sibelius forums about important MIDI data:

http://www.sibelius.com/cgi-bin/helpcen" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ... 3&&guest=1

Essentially, I can export my DP score to PDF, run "PDFtoMusic Pro" (a free xml conversion app), and import the xml file into Sibelius.



Purchase Sibelius 6 Educational, Sibelius 6 Professional & Sibelius Student from the largest Sibelius UK Dealers http://www.dsmusic.co.uk" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; 01600 772770

[erikjamesmusic]

Update: Sibelius is a great program and I'm almost fluent in it after 10 days or so. I bit the bullet and spent $200 on Dolet 5, so I'm now able to export to XML, and thus work efficiently and quickly with finale users. I highly recommend Dolet for other Sibelius users, as all of the other workarounds are time consuming and not dependable.

Also, Daniel (the tech guy on Sibelius forum) is great and will answer your every question.

[erikjamesmusic]

One more thing. I think I just perfected the process and want to share my findings after hours of trial and error. Here's a quick tutorial for best results

1. When you've got your sequence in DP sounding perfect, click Save. Then, click Save As, and title it "sequence name - QUANTIZED" in the same folder. This way, you can always go back to the great "sounding" DP project, as opposed to the great "looking" one.

2. Comb through your sequence and diligently quantize every piece of MIDI data, attacks and releases. The cleaner you have it in DP, the easier it will be in Sibelius.

3. When you're done quantizing, click "Save a copy as..." and chose Standard MIDI file.

4. A "MIDI File Options" window will appear. Chose: "Format 1 - separate tracks", and check "save track anmes as plain text". Do not check "Expand loops...". The "end file at time" should be filled in automatically with the last measure of MIDI data in the sequence. Click OK.

5. Open Sibelius 6. At the main window, check "open a MIDI file" and click OK. Pick the MIDI file you just saved a copy as from DP.

6. "Open MIDI File" window will appear. In the MIDI File tab, check only the following:

"only one staff per track" (cleaner, but optional)
"keep track names"
"use frame rate from SMPTE header
"Use multiple voices"

UNcheck "MIDI file uses this sound set". THIS OPTION WILL TOTAL SCREW WITH YOUR IMPORT, and you want to pick your own instruments in the Sibelius project anyway. It took me a few tries to figure out that THIS option was the problem.

7. In the Notation tab, check adjust rhythms, minimum duration probably 16th notes (depends on your sequence). UNcheck Staccato, tenuto, remove rests. The rest of this tab is dependent on your project. Click OK.

Hopefully this post saves a few hours of head-banging for a fellow composer/arranger. Have fun with it!

[erikjamesmusic]

One more thing about transcribing MIDI drums parts like "Toontrack SD2" into "proper" notation in Sibelius.

1. In DP, delete all notes with velocities under, say, 40. This will get rid of "ghost" notes that make the track sound real, but shouldn't be there for a live drummer to read. I've been doing this in the Graphic Editor in one pass. Obviously you have to zoom out horizontally to view the whole sequence, and enlarge the velocities area to be accurate. After you "save a copy as..."MIDI file, and open it in Sibelius, as described in my last post,

2. In Sibelius, use the "Edit - Filter - Advanced Filter" to choose the Toontrack Kick (for example) at C2, select all C2s, and move them to F4 (the proper Sibelius Kick notation). Do this for all notes in this MIDI track - corresponding to the correct notation (as described in Sibelius reference).

NOTE: Be sure that NO "toontrack" MIDI notes are lying between F4-G5 before you filter and move notes, otherwise this process will not work.

3. You will need to simplify for the live drummer. The less you give him, the more he will love you. Use lots of "repeat" bars.