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One of my friends has decided to switch from PT to DP due to the new subscription model and the scary future, after he did some math (i.e. financial calculations ).
Any caveats I should alert him to, in terms of lack of parity of features in any major areas, or amazing plug-ins that are PT-only and that he won't find or afford substitutes for (I think any non-PT-exclusive plug-ins he owns probably are automatically available to him in AU and VST formats)?
Also, for those who work with both products regularly or made the switch earlier, what is recommended as the basic workflow for porting projects from PT to DP?
He says everyone he knows is abandoning PT now, but most of them haven't heard of DP so he's the only one considering that route. he's seen me working in DP over the years so feels comfortable with the switch.
Thanks; I think the absolute grid feature is one that made the list for what we'd like to see in DP 9.
I'm confused by the second statement though, as it seems to infer that other DAW's are closer to PT than DP is. It has always been my impression, from using them all at various times, that DP is the closest to the more traditional recording workflow that I also thought (from limited experience) was modeled by PT.
mhschmieder wrote:
I'm confused by the second statement though, as it seems to infer that other DAW's are closer to PT than DP is. It has always been my impression, from using them all at various times, that DP is the closest to the more traditional recording workflow that I also thought (from limited experience) was modeled by PT.
That wasn't my experience. I came from PTHD to DP, and I've used DP in the past along with other DAWs (including working for 2 DAW developers).
I found DP to be the largest leap from PT from anything else I've used. The linear multitrack paradigm is similar, but that's where it ends. The hotkeys are vastly different, the terminology is extremely different, the window layout is different, the hardware->software interaction is different, the general places you 'look' to find something is different etc..
IMO, effective use of DP relies heavily on using the Track Overview (something I learned fairly recently) and heavy use of the info windows. PT doesn't even have these or anything similar. In PT you spend half your time in a Edit Window and half in the Mixer. If you try to do this in DP with the mixer and Sequence editor, then you will get very frustrated. I know, I've been there!
Likewise, if you're used to DP with the TO, info windows, customizable hotkeys, multiple sequences, chunks, v-racks etc... Pro Tools becomes excruciating! Moving between Studio One/Logic/Cubase isn't nearly as painful in my experience, despite them not directly having these features there are fairly obvious ways to get similar results.
His main concerns of what he might give up as he leaves PT are Beat Detective and Elastic Time/Pitch.
He has worked with Cubase/Nuendo before, as have I, and likewise couldn't get along with ASIO.
I haven't personally been able to wrap my head around StudioOne yet, but haven't had a lot of time with it. It didn't occur to me that it would be anything like PT, but I've never been the operator in any of my PT sessions so I probably mostly took in the similarity of the track view, which none of the other DAW's present in a way that I'm comfortable with.
I actually chose the Mac for my first computer in the early to mid 2000's after evaluating all of the DAW's out there and finding DP the most intuitive as someone who had only worked with tape and been a client in pro-level PT recording sessions. I had no prior experience with the Mac so it was pretty scary -- especially as it was during the OS9 to OSX transition and I had a useless G4 iMac for over half a decade that almost completely crippled my productivity.
I don't use hot keys in any application in my life, so it's hard for me to know how important those are for others, except for the app that I develop myself, where my Most Important Clients hate the mouse and rely heavily on shortcuts. I use WAY too many programs and OS's to have the confidence that I could remember enough hot keys to make it worthwhile. I didn't realize that other DAW's try to follow some sort of hot key convention (I guess a bit like how I assign my own, in the app I write, to follow as closely as possible those of apps our core clients use).
As far as terminology goes, I am used to working with people who are from vastly different backgrounds, nationalities, and disciplines, on a daily basis, so have never had a struggle with adapting to different conventions as long as they are consistently and rationally applied. For this specific friend (but not necessarily for all that many other people that I know), I think this would also more or less be the case.
My prospective switcher is 100% audio and 0% MIDI and is unlikely to change in that regard. I have both types of projects going on at all times, but ironically it is my current pure audio project where I've really stepped up my expertise in DP and gotten to the point where I enjoy it even more for audio than for MIDI.
Given your feedback, however, it is probably even more important that my friend spend some time with StudioOne before making a decision. Logic is out of the question for a lot of reasons I won't go into here as it would dilute the topic focus. So between StudioOne and DP he can probably make a good judgment of his needs, his workflow and preferences, and short-term vs. long-term prospects and goals.
I've found that with any major piece of software, switching can be frustrating. Even if both programs are equal in ease of use, the one you started with always seems easier (both for obvious and not so obvious reasons). My advise for anyone switching is to be patient. Any time you feel like, "Why can't I do this in this stupid program?" remember that there probably IS a way to do it. The manual is your best friend.
I've worked in both PT and DP and my personal preference is DP, but there are some things PT does better. Be sure to remind him that there are many, many things DP does better.
Phil
DP 11.23, 2020 M1 Mac Mini [9,1] (16 Gig RAM), Mac Pro 3GHz 8 core [6,1] (16 Gig RAM), OS 14.3.1/11.6.2, Lynx Aurora (n) 8tb, MOTU 8pre-es, MOTU M6, MOTU 828, Apogee Rosetta 800, UAD-2 Satellite, a truckload of outboard gear and plug-ins, and a partridge in a pear tree.
I don’t think there’s anything major (off the top of my head) but lots of little things that can be frustrating unless you read the manual, and a few things that are just frustrating. There have been feature request threads here over the years where the differences are discussed.
DP is the closest thing to PT I’ve seen. The particulars differ, and I like the way some things work better in DP, some in PT. Because they are so similar when something is harder to do it seems even more frustrating.
Audio editing is much faster and easier in PT, but I would say that only applies when you get to a certain level. If you’re a musician working on your songs there may be no difference, if you’re editing professionally there certainly is. The basics are very similar though.
I don’t use Beat Detective so I don’t know how they compare.
Thanks a lot; I've passed this advice along to my friend, and also recommended he start exploring this forum during his evaluation period of DP8 (I had forgotten you can now demo DP!).
mhschmieder wrote:His main concerns of what he might give up as he leaves PT are Beat Detective and Elastic Time/Pitch.
It is just my opinion, but I think both of those features are lacking in DP. Yes, DP has its own versions, but they simply don't compare to the PT versions (that includes ease of use, and sound quality).
Those are the two main things I wish I could bring from PT into DP.
DP 10.13, OS 13.6, iMac Pro (2017) 3.2 GHz 8-Core, 32 GB RAM, MOTU M4
Just guessing here, but given the number of requests for a simple drag-and-drop implementation of time stretching / compression (elastic audio) over the past few years, it wouldn't surprise me if MOTU gives us just that in DP9.
At the very least, and provided it's not too far off, which I suspect it isn't, I'd ask your friend to hold out for DP9 before making a decision either way, Mark.
Patience is not one of my friend's better known virtues. And that's putting it mildly.
Anyway, the brand-new kid on the block is StudioOne 3, and I think that's what he's going to go for. It's all shiny looking and more colorful than its grey ancestors.
I'll be upgrading my own copy soon as well, but for completely different reasons, as I'm interested in exploring some of its new features for scratchpad ideas (which one can of course do indirectly in DP, but I like having formal and direct support for things also).
Both the new version of StudioOne and the latest Tracktion release come with Melodyne. I think ABleton Live does as well, so it seems possible that MOTU could contract this into DP9 as there doesn't appear to be exclusive contracts involved, given how many DAW's include it now.
Funny how folks who're super-patient (as you seem to be, along with myself) seem to attract these restless types as friends.
Too bad he won't wait, but he'll probably be happy with Studio One anyway; I've heard it's not too heavy on the MIDI side of things, which should suit him.
).
