Pickups for a new bass?

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mikehalloran
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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by mikehalloran »

And now for something completely different.

I somehow forgot that my last two basses from Rick Turner have piezo pickups in the bridge.

The first, my Renaissance fretless has a DTAR under the saddle and nothing else. The strings are Thomastic Acousticore with nylon cores – no magnetic properties at all.

Image

Image

My Electroline 5 has a mahogany body with a flame koa top but the layout is the same: two soapbar pickups plus a piezo under each saddle.

Image

It can also be done with just the piezo. From Rick's web site:

Image

If you've never heard a bridge piezo on a bass, it's nothing like on a guitar. There is a depth that mag pickups cannot emulate. I blended in the soapbars when playing with drums but otherwise used the bridge.

Carvin makes a blend module:
http://www.carvinguitars.com/products/505SP
Image

Bridges can be found here:

http://www.bestbassgear.com/hipshot-pie ... ridges.htm

Hmmm... look what I found on the internet while searching for images. I've never seen this before. I remember this gig - St Patrick's Day, six weeks before my stroke. I did not know there was a picture of me playing my Electroline. It and my Ren fretless: best basses ever.

Image
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bayswater
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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by bayswater »

Thanks Mike. Lots of good ideas.
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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by stubbsonic »

I was just listening to some piezo pickup demos on YouTube. Seems like they come in quite a few different flavors. I'd not really considered them as an option, before, because I always assumed they'd just add a lot of clacky unpleasantness in the top-end. But some of them sounded ok, especially when blended moderately.
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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by mikehalloran »

Done right through a decent rig, piezos on bass will flap your pant legs at low volume. They are linear to the limitation of the saddle material and speaker. One year when Seymour Duncan and Rick were near the Bag End booth at NAMM, Bag End had a subwoofer linear to 8Hz. I was able to take one of Rick's basses, wiggle the string with my thumb and forefinger and watch the cone go back and forth to match.

An 18V preamp is important to help eliminate the "quack" found in poorly designed systems.

GraphTech makes saddles
http://www.graphtech.com/products/brand ... ups---bass

and offers pre-loaded Hipshot bridges. Carvin and Turner both use Hipshot but Rick makes the piezo elements himself.
http://www.graphtech.com/products/brand ... ss-bridges

and preamps (the Carvin system is simpler)
http://www.graphtech.com/products/brand ... reamp-kits
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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by Gravity Jim »

Not too far from my house, Bob Groat builds acoustic fretless bass guitars (mostly... some guitars and things, too) made with carbon fiber bodies, exquisite wood tops and necks, and under saddle pickups. They sound awesome. (They do repair at his shop, and some of his guys did knockout fret leveling jobs on my six-strings.)

Those Turners are gorgeous, man.
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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by mikehalloran »

Those Turners are gorgeous, man
Yes, he does very nice work. All of mine are gorgeous.

Rick founded Alembic, Modulus Graphite & Highlander Pickups and worked for the Grateful Dead but is no longer involved with any of them. His most famous instruments are probably the Model 1 guitars that Lindsay Buckingham plays and John Entwhistle's "Boris the Spider" Alembic bass.

This is my Model 1. Rick asked me if he could try a new finish, I said that was fine with me:
Image

We met when a friend/band mate of mine who worked for him kept pumping me for advice on Macs. I finally said that if he wants me to design a system, I need a fretless bass since mine had been stolen. At the next gig, I heard, "Rick says, 'OK'". The Ren 5 was the result. That was 20 years ago. I now own 5 of his instruments – too bad I can't play 'em anymore.

The fretless that was stolen was the 5 string in the 1988 Carvin catalog with the koa sides. After that was taken in '93, I played this flame koa 1989 LB85 until I hooked up with Mr. Turner. I have this thing for koa, I suppose.

Image
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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by monkey man »

I've no idea how you'd get your mitts on one, Stoivo, but the hum bucker and associated, crazily-versatile active EQ from the late-model Music Man Stingray basses could fit the bill.

Because one can go from the thinnest, knarliest, to the thickest, reggae-envy-inducing tones with the "package", I figure that no matter how radical your (raw) bass ends up sounding, it should theoretically be able to adapt to it and enhance / shape what you have.

I mention this 'cause, even 'though I've always been an EMG man who in fact does appreciate passive PUs, the sensitivity and punch of my Stingray 5s is something to behold. Assuming you could get the PU etc., it could well prove a whole lot cheaper than some of the more esoteric suggestions thus far. A single PU is all you'd need too, mounted somewhere near the bridge.
Shooshie wrote:The Ford F100 can hold a pretty solid bass, though that pickup is really not like it used to be. Used to be made of all steel sheeting, but now it's got plastic all over the place, and the slightest tap makes the bumper fall off.

The Chevy Silverado is probably a good choice for a bass pickup. It'll hold two or three string basses before the springs give out. When you load them in with a crane, be careful not to drop them from more than about 8 feet, or they might go clear through the bed.

The problem with either pickup is the gas mileage. I'd consider a Prius V, which can hold a couple basses, and still gets up to 48 mpg on the highway, and around 40 mpg in the city if you use good gas. It's more of an Electric Bass Pickup, if you will, or at least a Hybrid Bass Pickup. I mean, if you don't mind your pickup being a wagon, which is really what the Prius V is. I can carry all my saxophones in mine with room left over for a few groupies, and none have to ride in the rain. Beats the heck out of those old Ford and Chevy pickups.

Ok, ok, I admit that I know nothing about Bass Pickups. :surrender:

:lol:
Shoosh
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bayswater
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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by bayswater »

monkey man wrote: the hum bucker and associated, crazily-versatile active EQ from the late-model Music Man Stingray basses could fit the bill.
Their site "store" just gives a contact for those looking for parts. Seems unlikely they will sell a pickup but I've left a message to ask.

I've come across replacement pickups from following up some of the other suggestions. It's not clear whether these replacements have similar characteristics, or if they are just the right size to replace the originals. Here's a couple of examples.

http://www.bestbassgear.com/bartolini-m ... ickups.htm
http://www.seymourduncan.com/forum/show ... ent-pickup
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monkey man
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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by monkey man »

Hey, I'm just glad you didn't baulk at the suggestion, Baysey.

Fingers crossed for the response.

FWIMBW, Trilian's famous "Studio Bass" sample set, AFAIK, employs these PUs, and you'll see 'em represented in just about every ROMPler's electric bass patch collection, and for good reason, IMHO. As I said, if you want punch and fatness, as well as sensitivity, it's all there. These things cream any EMGs I've ever owned, and by some margin, again, IMHO.

Catch you in a couple o' days, mate.

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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by mikehalloran »

I've no idea how you'd get your mitts on one, Stoivo, but the hum bucker and associated, crazily-versatile active EQ from the late-model Music Man Stingray basses could fit the bill.

Because one can go from the thinnest, knarliest, to the thickest, reggae-envy-inducing tones with the "package", I figure that no matter how radical your (raw) bass ends up sounding, it should theoretically be able to adapt to it and enhance / shape what you have.

I mention this 'cause, even 'though I've always been an EMG man who in fact does appreciate passive PUs, the sensitivity and punch of my Stingray 5s is something to behold. Assuming you could get the PU etc., it could well prove a whole lot cheaper than some of the more esoteric suggestions thus far. A single PU is all you'd need too, mounted somewhere near the bridge.
The patent expired years ago and MM never trademarked the design. One of many sources:

http://www.carvinguitars.com/group/bass_pickups

Image

Image

I always figured that the next bass (there was always going to be a next bass) would still have a piezo bridge but would have a MM pickup in the correct position near the bridge with a side by side humbucking pair of single coils a la a P-Bass or that split T-Bass that I posted earlier in the middle. 5-string for me.
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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by bayswater »

The HB-4. I think that might be it.
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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by monkey man »

As long as your bass is gonna be a 4-stringer, Bays. I missed that; you've probably already stated this.
mikehalloran wrote:
I always figured that the next bass (there was always going to be a next bass) would still have a piezo bridge but would have a MM pickup in the correct position near the bridge with a side by side humbucking pair of single coils a la a P-Bass or that split T-Bass that I posted earlier in the middle. 5-string for me.
Interesting, Mike, 'cause I too expected more "coverage" when I shelled out for my S5 fretless 5 years ago. I'd started with the fretted version from a pawn shop circa 2002, and from that moment forwards hankered for a fretless version to pair up with it. I'd figured that, by the time I ended up ordering one, there'd at least be a 2nd PU.

Turns out my initial fear was unfounded, and this is partly why I suggested this puppy to Bayswater. I'd never have believed that such versatility and grunt could be garnered from a single PU in the bridge position. To me, this simply speaks for the response, sensitivity and power of the pickup. Brilliant IMHO. This, along with the military-spec nature of the build of the Stingrays, is the principal reason why I love 'em so much, and hope never to be tempted to switch brands or even models for that matter. I played Ibanez, Maton and P-Basses live and in the studio back in the day, and these things are in a different league. To be fair 'though, I suspect I'd have been at least nearly as happy had I gone the J-Bass route. Less punch, but still a great sound and I think the strings are spaced closer together, which is something that always suited me. That's my only beef with my beloved MM 5-stringers - the spacing. I figure I'll just have to get used to it if I want the balls, versatility and punch on offer.

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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by mikehalloran »

This morning, my daughter emailed some bass tracks that she laid down on a Korean el-cheapo Danelectro bass I bought for her in the '90s. I wanted somerhing that didn't sound like anything i owned. The few times I played that bass live, she almost didn't get it back (she couldn't play my 5-strings so, if we were switching on bass, we both played hers).

Anyway, a lipstick pickup on bass in the neck position is something to consider.

http://www.stewmac.com/Pickups_and_Elec ... ickup.html
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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by bayswater »

I think I'll have to come up with something like a hard drive docking station, but for pickups. Some sort of dock on the bass, and a universal mount for pickups that can be snapped into the dock. Then I can buy a whole load of these different pickups.
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Re: Pickups for a new bass?

Post by stubbsonic »

Maybe you joke, but there ARE guitars with hot-swappable pickup modules. A friend of mine had a weird one. It think it was plexiglass.
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